Joe Johnston - The Rocketeer

WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.640
This episode of a Film Buy is
brought to you by black Key Cooffee.

2
00:00:04.160 --> 00:00:08.240
Head over to black Keycoffee dot com
and get your favorite flavor. Not sure

3
00:00:08.279 --> 00:00:13.039
what you want, then build your
own sample pack and try several black Key

4
00:00:13.080 --> 00:00:19.399
coffee. With enough coffee, anything
is possible. We hope this holiday weekend

5
00:00:19.399 --> 00:00:24.440
you are staying safe out there,
whether you're traveling by a car or jetpack.

6
00:00:24.800 --> 00:00:30.559
We got a film by Joe Johnston, his nineteen ninety one underrated pulp

7
00:00:30.600 --> 00:01:02.200
hero classic The Rocketeer Up next.
Hell, Everybody, I'm Jeff Johnson and

8
00:01:02.320 --> 00:01:07.560
I'm Scott Hoffman, and this is
a film by podcast. Today we're discussing

9
00:01:07.640 --> 00:01:15.439
a film that takes place in Los
Angeles nineteen thirty eight. This past weekend,

10
00:01:15.920 --> 00:01:19.239
we dropped another one of our Lost
nineteen a six episodes on Patreon,

11
00:01:21.200 --> 00:01:26.920
covering Shanghai Surprise, which takes place
in Shanghai nineteen thirty seven. Scott with

12
00:01:27.040 --> 00:01:33.519
Glennon and Wazy Lyndon. We're not
gonna do that again. No, uh,

13
00:01:34.159 --> 00:01:36.599
we didn't plan that, but it's
it's kind of cool. We're going

14
00:01:36.640 --> 00:01:42.599
back to back with with period piece
films, adventure films, as if it

15
00:01:42.719 --> 00:01:46.920
was meant to be so don't miss
all the bonus content and exclusive episodes.

16
00:01:47.239 --> 00:01:52.439
You can check out patreon dot com
slash a film by podcast and start subscribing,

17
00:01:53.239 --> 00:01:56.799
or sign up for a free membership
because we are dropping free content as

18
00:01:56.840 --> 00:02:00.959
well. Scott, back to The
Rocketeer, What can you tell the listeners

19
00:02:01.079 --> 00:02:06.040
about this one? For those who
haven't seen it, It's three years before

20
00:02:06.079 --> 00:02:09.080
the start of World War Two and
local stunt pilot Cliff Seacort has just made

21
00:02:09.120 --> 00:02:13.759
a discovery that could end the war
before it begins. Cliff and his friend

22
00:02:13.800 --> 00:02:16.599
peev find an experimental rocket pack hidden
in their hangar. After a high speed

23
00:02:16.719 --> 00:02:22.280
chase almost destroys their livelihood, but
after a little Howard Stark style tinkering,

24
00:02:22.599 --> 00:02:25.280
Peevie turns the rocket into a full
flight suit that Cliff uses for a daring

25
00:02:25.319 --> 00:02:30.560
rescue. Soon, their little corner
of California is crawling with FBI agents,

26
00:02:30.759 --> 00:02:34.400
mobsters, and a nefarious actor who
wants to help the Nazis create a flying

27
00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.840
army that would threaten the entire world. Based on the popular independent comic by

28
00:02:38.879 --> 00:02:43.680
Dave Stevens, The Rocketeer is one
of the most underrated comic based movies of

29
00:02:43.719 --> 00:02:46.560
the nineties. That also paved the
way for many more important comic movies to

30
00:02:46.599 --> 00:02:51.960
come. Joe Johnston directing this one, And if you think this film has

31
00:02:51.960 --> 00:02:57.360
a familiar aesthetic, it's because Johnston
worked for ILM on both Star Wars and

32
00:02:57.879 --> 00:03:00.919
Raiders of the Lost Ark. Yeah, now have you seen the series Light

33
00:03:00.960 --> 00:03:05.240
and Magic on Disney? Plus,
I don't think I've caught that yet.

34
00:03:05.599 --> 00:03:10.120
You'd absolutely need to end. The
first episode actually gives you some great insight

35
00:03:10.240 --> 00:03:14.919
into Joe Johnson and the rest of
the crew that worked on the first Star

36
00:03:14.960 --> 00:03:21.520
Wars. So Joe in this talks
about how he started out with Star Wars.

37
00:03:21.560 --> 00:03:25.000
Apparently he had just finished the industrial
design program at cal State Long Beach,

38
00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:31.840
where Joe Dykstra had also graduated a
few years earlier. Now Joe didn't

39
00:03:32.159 --> 00:03:37.240
Johnston didn't graduate because the commute was
too much for him, which comes up

40
00:03:37.280 --> 00:03:40.000
as a little bit more important to
his story. So it's a horrible commute.

41
00:03:40.560 --> 00:03:45.960
He happened to see a flyer in
the design department one day that they

42
00:03:45.960 --> 00:03:49.680
were looking for artists, model builders, etc. For a space movie.

43
00:03:50.039 --> 00:03:53.120
So he thought, sure, I'll
give it a shot because it's a better

44
00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:55.879
commute. Wow, he got Star
Wars because it was a better commute.

45
00:03:57.319 --> 00:04:00.599
His job offer was for six weeks
doing storyboards, and said, sure,

46
00:04:00.719 --> 00:04:03.120
I can do that, but he
had no idea what a storyboard was at

47
00:04:03.159 --> 00:04:08.280
all. Star Wars was actually the
first movie script he had ever read in

48
00:04:08.319 --> 00:04:12.080
his life. But he goes on
to help streamline and improve the ships,

49
00:04:12.120 --> 00:04:15.000
like the X Wing, the Tie
Fighters. He even came up with a

50
00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:19.160
millennium Falcon design with inspiration from a
roughly designed cockpit and a stack of dirty

51
00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:27.519
dishes. It's amazing this guy takes
a job as a storyboard artist without knowing

52
00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:31.160
what one is. Yeah, and
it's for George Lucas on Star Wars.

53
00:04:31.240 --> 00:04:35.639
That's yeah, and he's not He's
not alone with that story. There's a

54
00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:41.040
lot of creators back in the day
that have very similar stories in that first

55
00:04:41.079 --> 00:04:44.120
episode, so Light and Magic.
If you haven't seen it, check it

56
00:04:44.199 --> 00:04:46.959
out. It's definitely worth it.
That's on Disney Plus. Yeah, all

57
00:04:47.040 --> 00:04:51.399
right, definitely want to check that
one out. I do want to mention

58
00:04:53.560 --> 00:04:59.399
Johnston's cinematographer. He's worked with a
couple of times, Hero Narta. I

59
00:04:59.399 --> 00:05:04.120
think his work on this is absolutely
gorgeous. Yeah, And if you're and

60
00:05:04.519 --> 00:05:09.560
like I said, if you if
you feel like if this movie feels familiar,

61
00:05:09.560 --> 00:05:13.480
like the look of it feels familiar, you gotta remember he also worked

62
00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:17.240
with Johnston on HONEYE Shrunk the Kids. Scott, I'm sure you're going to

63
00:05:17.319 --> 00:05:20.240
talk about this at some point on
Phasers at the Sun. But he was

64
00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:26.399
also the cinematographer for Star Trek six
The Undiscovered Country. Ooh, that's a

65
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:30.639
favorite. How about hocus Pocus.
That's a that's Hero's work, yep,

66
00:05:30.759 --> 00:05:36.000
okay, and a nineteen eighty six
classic that is soon to hit our Patreon.

67
00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:44.800
Fire with Fire is also hero Rita's
cinematography. All right, let's talk

68
00:05:44.839 --> 00:05:49.959
about this cast, starting with Billy
Campbell. He plays Cliff Secord, otherwise

69
00:05:49.959 --> 00:05:56.279
known as the Rocketeer. Yep.
So Disney wants Johnny Depp, which I

70
00:05:56.279 --> 00:06:00.240
think is fascinating because because when you
think of Depp's relationship with Disney over the

71
00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:05.439
whole Pirates of the Caribbean franchise,
it's it's interesting to know that they were

72
00:06:05.480 --> 00:06:10.720
looking at him way back, way
back here, you know, in the

73
00:06:10.800 --> 00:06:15.079
late eighties. I think that's fascinating. It is, and I know that

74
00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:18.360
they talked about a lot of different
actors stepping into the role, obviously,

75
00:06:18.480 --> 00:06:21.800
each one of them having a,
you know, a well known name.

76
00:06:23.399 --> 00:06:27.199
Yeah, so Billy Campbell was not. Yeah, Billy Campbell's not. But

77
00:06:27.240 --> 00:06:30.639
the producers are going after Kevin Costner, who ultimately decides to do Robin Hood.

78
00:06:31.399 --> 00:06:35.120
They look at Matthew Modine, who
also passes, and I can't imagine

79
00:06:35.120 --> 00:06:42.160
why Matthew Madeen is passing on this
at this time. Yeah, but Kurt

80
00:06:42.240 --> 00:06:47.319
Russell and Dennis Quaid showed some interest. Emilio Estevez and Bill Paxton both lobbied

81
00:06:48.240 --> 00:06:54.199
very hard for the role, and
Paxton is on record claiming he nearly got

82
00:06:54.240 --> 00:06:58.920
it. But in the end,
Johnson wanted an unknown, and as you

83
00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:02.800
said, he fought for Cammble and
Campbell sends a three picture deal with Disney

84
00:07:02.920 --> 00:07:05.560
like they're looking. They're looking long
term for the Rocketeers, like a big

85
00:07:05.560 --> 00:07:11.120
franchise. Yeah, well, and
it definitely lends itself to that, even

86
00:07:11.160 --> 00:07:15.759
though I mean the comic is pretty
different. Dave Stevens, the artist that

87
00:07:15.800 --> 00:07:19.839
created The Rocketeer, I think I
heard that he was pretty satisfied with it.

88
00:07:19.920 --> 00:07:25.920
I think his opinion changed a bit
later, But when I heard about

89
00:07:25.920 --> 00:07:30.600
the casting, I remember seeing that
Billy Campbell was somebody that seemed to step

90
00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:34.480
right off the page. Yea.
His look was absolutely perfect for it,

91
00:07:34.600 --> 00:07:41.639
and I think it was better to
use him as a relatively unknown actor because

92
00:07:41.639 --> 00:07:47.439
you're talking about a very independent comic
roots for The Rocketeer. Well as I

93
00:07:47.519 --> 00:07:51.480
understand that Campbell had never heard of
The Rocketeer, And as soon as he

94
00:07:51.519 --> 00:07:57.319
gets the roll, he picks up
the comic books. He goes straight to

95
00:07:57.360 --> 00:08:03.720
the barber, has his haircut to
look like the comic accurate Cliff Secord.

96
00:08:05.680 --> 00:08:09.000
He's listening to forty thirties forties music. I mean he's he's putt in the

97
00:08:09.000 --> 00:08:13.399
work. Yeah, he put in
a lot of work on another famous role,

98
00:08:13.600 --> 00:08:16.319
Scott. I don't know if you
were aware of this. He had

99
00:08:16.360 --> 00:08:24.759
the role of Lieutenant William Riker on
Star Trek the Next Generation until Jonathan Franks

100
00:08:24.759 --> 00:08:31.120
walked in the door Wow Wow ends
up much different, but he does come

101
00:08:31.160 --> 00:08:37.519
back. Yeah. He plays a
who is it Oconn or Yukon, someone

102
00:08:37.720 --> 00:08:43.360
O'Connor or conic outrageous Oconnor. That's
the episode. Yeah, Yeah, I

103
00:08:43.440 --> 00:08:46.159
like that. I like that he
might he might he loses out on Riker,

104
00:08:46.200 --> 00:08:48.720
but they still bring him back for
something else, and he did great

105
00:08:48.799 --> 00:08:52.720
in that episode. I'm actually surprised
that you didn't pull out a Frasier reference.

106
00:08:54.159 --> 00:08:58.159
I was just about to say,
I I know him as the annoyingly

107
00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:03.039
perfect doctor that arrives to upstage Fraser
Crane until we we finally can't sing.

108
00:09:03.279 --> 00:09:09.120
He cannot sing at all. This
that's such a fun episode. That's what

109
00:09:09.519 --> 00:09:11.840
episodes. Here's the one, here's
the one that surprises me though, Scott,

110
00:09:13.759 --> 00:09:20.000
I absolutely love brom Stokers Dracula.
You know the Copola film, yep.

111
00:09:20.840 --> 00:09:24.200
Until today, I never knew that
he played Quincy. You know,

112
00:09:24.279 --> 00:09:28.320
the cowboy that's that's fighting alongside of
him to stop Dracula. Yeah, that's

113
00:09:28.360 --> 00:09:33.639
Billy. That's Billy Campbell. Interesting, doesn't sound like him, doesn't look

114
00:09:33.720 --> 00:09:37.320
like him. Unbelievable. Yeah,
I want to ask you this, and

115
00:09:37.399 --> 00:09:41.600
I feel like you you can definitely
speak on this. I feel like the

116
00:09:41.720 --> 00:09:46.320
rocketeer, like his Rocketeer has a
similar tone to Spider Man. And and

117
00:09:46.480 --> 00:09:50.720
by that I mean he he finds
this, this rocket pack, right,

118
00:09:52.639 --> 00:09:56.840
his first thought is it's about money
and fame. You know, he's trying

119
00:09:56.879 --> 00:09:58.519
to he's trying to get PV on
board. Like I feel like, you

120
00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:01.559
know, kind of like how Peter
Parker was like, Hey, I'm gonna

121
00:10:01.799 --> 00:10:03.120
I'm gonna win some money. I'm
gonna go on some talk shows. I'm

122
00:10:03.120 --> 00:10:07.080
gonna get famous. Now do you
do you see that in the In the

123
00:10:07.159 --> 00:10:09.679
Rocketeer. I see some parallels there. Yeah, I think it's interesting.

124
00:10:09.720 --> 00:10:20.840
There's there's also parallels to Steve Rogers
in the MCU in the sense that he

125
00:10:20.919 --> 00:10:22.559
you know, he has it originally
for you know, we could make some

126
00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:26.000
money with this. This could save
the Hangar. Not necessarily, I want

127
00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:30.039
to say, you know, sign
major motion picture deals and all this other

128
00:10:30.120 --> 00:10:35.320
kind of stuff. He doesn't want
to exploit the Rocketeer beyond maybe going to

129
00:10:35.399 --> 00:10:39.039
Nationals, but that's as high as
the aspirations seemed to go. Kind of

130
00:10:39.039 --> 00:10:43.559
similar to Steve Rodgers. It's like
where Steve says, I don't want to

131
00:10:43.679 --> 00:10:46.960
kill anybody. I just don't like
believes. Yeah, he's not out there

132
00:10:46.039 --> 00:10:52.639
too, you know, to keep
the suit to like he's ready to give

133
00:10:52.639 --> 00:10:54.559
it back. He just wants to
use it to save his girlfriend. Jenny.

134
00:10:56.279 --> 00:11:01.360
Yeah, let's let's talk about Jenny. The the actress, the up

135
00:11:01.360 --> 00:11:05.679
and coming actress, is best Gorgeous, The Gorgeous, The Gorgeous. Upcoming

136
00:11:05.720 --> 00:11:13.240
actress Diane Lane went after the role. Kelly Preston went after the role.

137
00:11:13.000 --> 00:11:18.720
Ultimately, it's Jennifer Connelly signing a
two picture deal with Disney to play this

138
00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:24.240
part. Yeah, which it should
not be anybody else. The two leads

139
00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:28.840
here, Billy Campbell and Jennifer Connelly. I know they were in a relationship

140
00:11:28.879 --> 00:11:33.279
for a while after this movie,
but I cannot imagine it with anybody else

141
00:11:33.639 --> 00:11:37.960
at all, Like any of those
other choices would just be would just be

142
00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:45.559
wrong. Their chemistry is amazing.
They started dating during during production, which

143
00:11:45.879 --> 00:11:50.759
Johnston says, Hey, you know
that's method acting like like I've never seen.

144
00:11:50.840 --> 00:11:56.679
But you know, they get engaged. They but they break it off

145
00:11:56.720 --> 00:12:00.960
five years later. My question is, Billy, what are you doing?

146
00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:07.720
And Paul Bettany says, thank you. Yeah. Conley obviously has an eye

147
00:12:07.720 --> 00:12:11.120
for superheroes, you know, she
she tried to make it work with the

148
00:12:11.159 --> 00:12:18.559
Rocketeer. Ultimately she marries Vision so
and she's in Spider Man Homecoming, that's

149
00:12:18.639 --> 00:12:26.360
right. And she's Betty in The
Anglee Hulk. Yes, the only part

150
00:12:26.399 --> 00:12:31.159
of the Angley Hulk that I actually
like, and you know, we had

151
00:12:31.200 --> 00:12:35.440
talked about Top Gun Maverick, where
she was Penny Benjamin. Yep. When

152
00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:39.559
we did that Back to the Box
Office, we also talked about her.

153
00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:43.159
Was it five or six years earlier
in nineteen eighty six Labyrinth? Oh?

154
00:12:43.240 --> 00:12:46.799
Yeah, you and I did the
Labyrinth episode. And so this is right

155
00:12:46.799 --> 00:12:52.919
around the time in her career where
she's she's kind of making a turn into

156
00:12:54.399 --> 00:13:01.440
older roles. So it's the same
year that she makes career opportunities. It's

157
00:13:01.480 --> 00:13:05.960
a few years before she goes into
things like higher learning of Loving Shadows.

158
00:13:07.120 --> 00:13:11.919
She definitely secures her spot as a
leading lady in this role, which is

159
00:13:11.200 --> 00:13:18.679
fascinating that she's one of the bigger
names on the marquee for this, but

160
00:13:18.679 --> 00:13:22.120
it's still pretty early in her career. Well, I'll tell you what I

161
00:13:22.200 --> 00:13:26.919
like, aside from her in that
white dress looking like a bombshell, because

162
00:13:26.960 --> 00:13:30.120
she she is. This is peak
Jennifer Connelly as far as I'm concerned.

163
00:13:31.000 --> 00:13:35.320
She is out to dinner with Timothy
Dalton. I just you can't take your

164
00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:39.159
eyes off her. Yeah, I've
been crushing on Jennifer Connelly since the Rocket

165
00:13:39.159 --> 00:13:43.399
Teer. I know you have,
but I love the fact that her character

166
00:13:43.720 --> 00:13:48.240
is not the typical damsel distress.
She is strong, yep. I mean

167
00:13:48.240 --> 00:13:54.080
she's she's she's fantastic, she's she's
more of a partner to the rocketeer than

168
00:13:54.080 --> 00:13:56.960
she is just someone that needs saving. And that's what's one thing I love

169
00:13:56.960 --> 00:14:03.600
that Jennifer Connelly does in this film
is she portrays a strong, independent woman

170
00:14:03.320 --> 00:14:07.600
who could take care of herself.
Yeah. I mean, if you take

171
00:14:07.639 --> 00:14:11.000
a look at the head count,
she kicks more butt than Cliff does.

172
00:14:11.919 --> 00:14:16.519
He has more action scenes, but
like actual physical contact with somebody hitting him

173
00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:20.039
over the head of the vase,
stomping on a foot with a heel,

174
00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:26.279
knocking him out with whatever she's got
available. Yeah, she absolutely holds her

175
00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:30.879
own and I love the fact that
it's that kind of character. What do

176
00:14:30.919 --> 00:14:37.200
you think of Alan Arkin as PV? He was he was kind of an

177
00:14:37.279 --> 00:14:43.399
adorable proto Howard Stark, Like it
seemed like he was if it was a

178
00:14:43.440 --> 00:14:46.559
what if story of what if Howard
Hughes never made it out of the local

179
00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:48.799
garage, Right, he knew what
he was doing, he knew his way

180
00:14:48.799 --> 00:14:54.000
around, you know, tinkering and
a bit of design. I think he

181
00:14:54.080 --> 00:14:58.840
even draws up blueprints for another rocket
pack of his own. Oh, she

182
00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:03.240
gives it, remember, uh Genny
hands it to him, and then he

183
00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:07.360
immediately, though hemially, starts to
going, hey, look if we shaved

184
00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:11.000
this off, and you know he's
already redesigning based off the blueprints. I

185
00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:16.320
feel like he turns it into a
flight suit because he makes the the helmet.

186
00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:20.480
I think that was a striker genius. Yeah. I kind of feel

187
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:26.559
like he's a less neurotic, less
erratic Doc Brown in a way. Okay,

188
00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:28.720
I look at like I look,
I look at the two of them,

189
00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:31.840
and I see kind of like Doc
and Marty. You've got the the

190
00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:37.039
the young guy with the the older
mentor type. They're clearly best friends.

191
00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:41.919
Yeah. I love Alan Arkin this, I know. I know. Originally

192
00:15:41.759 --> 00:15:46.240
uh Lloyd Bridges was offered the role. He turns it down. I'm happy

193
00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:52.440
about that because I feel like Bridges
would have been a little too cartoony.

194
00:15:52.639 --> 00:15:56.759
Yeah, he he would have still
had that mentor quality, but I don't

195
00:15:56.759 --> 00:16:00.000
think he would have had as much
of the friendship quality that we go now

196
00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:02.840
it would have. I think it
would have become more of like a father

197
00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:08.679
son dynamic than a friend dynamic.
Yep. You can't have a great hero

198
00:16:08.759 --> 00:16:15.720
without a great villain. Timothy Dalton
as Neville Sinclair. Yeah. Now,

199
00:16:15.720 --> 00:16:21.399
according to Dalton, the original plan
was for him to play James Bond in

200
00:16:21.559 --> 00:16:26.279
four to five films, but after
License to Kill suffered a lack of box

201
00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:32.799
office success in nineteen eighty nine,
MGM and Eon Productions were allegedly in dispute

202
00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:38.360
over his tenure. Dalton gets wind
of this and gracefully resigns from the role

203
00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:45.159
in the year nineteen ninety four.
And that's important, Scott, because GoldenEye

204
00:16:45.559 --> 00:16:49.919
is released with the new Bond,
Pierce Brosnan in nineteen ninety five. Now

205
00:16:49.960 --> 00:16:55.240
think you about that for a second. We live in a world where it

206
00:16:55.320 --> 00:17:00.919
takes years to transition from one Bond
to the next. It's a big event.

207
00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:04.920
And in the span of a year, Dalton has walked away, Brosnen

208
00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:08.680
has walked in, and they've put
out They've put out GoldenEye. Wow.

209
00:17:08.920 --> 00:17:14.440
So and I mean you've got to
respect him having that viewpoint to say,

210
00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:17.079
like, Okay, I'm going to
step away from it just in case it

211
00:17:17.160 --> 00:17:19.119
was me, I'm going to step
away and let somebody else do it.

212
00:17:19.240 --> 00:17:23.759
I think he could have done GoldenEye
very well. But I think we're better

213
00:17:23.799 --> 00:17:26.880
off for having Pierce Brosnan in that. That was a great premiere for him

214
00:17:26.880 --> 00:17:36.279
to Well, you have to remember
Brosnan was being courted before Dalton and had

215
00:17:36.279 --> 00:17:41.119
the role, but could not get
out of his obligations on Remington Steel and

216
00:17:41.160 --> 00:17:45.319
that's how Timothy Dalton gets gets into
the movie. Yeah, so I think

217
00:17:45.359 --> 00:17:49.440
all along they they had Brosnen waiting
in the wings. I know, I

218
00:17:49.480 --> 00:17:52.400
know, I read, I read, I did a little digging on this

219
00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:59.000
recently. One M GYM executive had
said that that Dalton was never in the

220
00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:03.440
picture for God and they knew that
they were moving in a different direction and

221
00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:07.160
they just had to They had to
convince the Broccolis that Dalton was out and

222
00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:12.960
Brosna was in. It is he
does a little bit of theater and then

223
00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:18.680
he shows up here in the Rocketeer. I know they had offered the role

224
00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:22.000
to Charles Dance and Jeremy Irons,
who both passed, and I'm glad for

225
00:18:22.079 --> 00:18:26.960
that because I think either one of
them would have been fantastic, especially Charles

226
00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:33.920
Dance. But Timothy Dalton has a
has a charm and a swagger as Neville

227
00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:37.240
you like him. He's charismatic,
right, Yeah, And I think we

228
00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:41.599
would have gotten similar with Charles Dance, but I feel like it would have

229
00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:47.160
been I don't know his age at
that time, but it feels like there

230
00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:48.799
would be too much of an age
difference with Jenny. It would be a

231
00:18:48.799 --> 00:18:53.359
little bit more leering and not necessarily
like somebody who might have a shot.

232
00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:57.799
I gotcha. I think he does
a great job in this one. He's

233
00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:03.000
chewing the scenery, especially when he
starts wooing Jenny. It's that you know,

234
00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:06.640
your blood gets up a little bit
and you're like, come on,

235
00:19:06.759 --> 00:19:08.440
Cliff, come on, give this
ky out of the way. Well,

236
00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:12.839
like I said, he's I think
you have to have someone like Dalton,

237
00:19:14.279 --> 00:19:18.480
who's a little bit younger than than
Irons because because he, you know,

238
00:19:18.559 --> 00:19:25.200
Neville is this swashbuckling actor. You
know, he's the role is basically an

239
00:19:25.240 --> 00:19:30.359
homage to Errol Flynton. So you
know that when they're on set and he's

240
00:19:30.359 --> 00:19:33.359
doing like the what is it,
the the Laughing Bandit, I'm not gonna

241
00:19:33.400 --> 00:19:36.119
I'm not gonna lie, like I'm
not gonna lie. I kind of want

242
00:19:36.119 --> 00:19:37.559
to watch The Laughing Bandit. I
want to see that movie with Timothy Dalton

243
00:19:37.880 --> 00:19:42.160
because it looked great, but that's
true. Yeah, A couple a couple

244
00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:48.000
other people I want to talk about
real quick. Paul Sorvino, who only

245
00:19:48.039 --> 00:19:52.799
accepts the role of Valentine, the
gangster that's helping Neville out. Mm hm.

246
00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:56.920
He gets this after Joe Pesci says
no, Pa, she says no,

247
00:19:56.680 --> 00:20:00.000
and they say, well, who
else we got in Good Fellows?

248
00:20:00.880 --> 00:20:03.559
They go straight to Paul Servino and
he's like, yeah, I'm in I

249
00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:07.359
love Paul Sorvino in this because he
is a gangster. He's a bad guy,

250
00:20:08.039 --> 00:20:11.960
yeah, but with a heart of
gold, like at the end,

251
00:20:11.319 --> 00:20:15.599
Yeah, he's got that great turn
when he's he's got an awesome turn when

252
00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:18.160
he helps the FBI and he's like, I'm one hundred percent of American,

253
00:20:18.200 --> 00:20:22.440
buddy. Yeah, when he when
he finds out that that Neville is working

254
00:20:22.480 --> 00:20:25.920
for the Nazis, Yeah, and
he's like, hey, I don't I

255
00:20:25.880 --> 00:20:30.039
don't want a nice buck, but
I'm all American. Yeah. And then

256
00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:32.720
he even has like that that that
throw go get him, kid when the

257
00:20:32.799 --> 00:20:36.319
rocketeer goes after him and the in
the blump. YEP. Love Paul Servino

258
00:20:36.559 --> 00:20:40.920
in this. What did you think
of Tero Quinn as Howard Hugh's I thought

259
00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.559
that was fantastic. I think that's
the first time I remember seeing terro Quinn,

260
00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:49.799
and he definitely had He seemed to
have the quality that you would want

261
00:20:51.160 --> 00:20:55.960
Howard Hughes character in this movie to
have somebody that seems like a Tony Stark

262
00:20:56.039 --> 00:21:00.880
kind of up on a pedestal,
who is not in the for you know,

263
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:04.839
nefarious deeds or whatever. He chooses
to throw out the rocket pack blueprints

264
00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:08.680
because he's like, I should have
never built the damn thing. So he's

265
00:21:08.720 --> 00:21:11.720
on the up and up, and
I think he has that endearing quality to

266
00:21:11.880 --> 00:21:17.880
him that really works. We've talked
about him, well, you talked about

267
00:21:17.920 --> 00:21:22.960
him before with Andrew when you talked
about Space Camp in nineteen eighty six.

268
00:21:22.240 --> 00:21:26.960
He was the launch director. That's
right, Yeah, that's a deep cut.

269
00:21:26.599 --> 00:21:30.200
Even I was like, well I
did, no, Yeah, you're

270
00:21:30.200 --> 00:21:34.680
absolutely right. I remember him.
I always remember him in Young Guns.

271
00:21:36.440 --> 00:21:40.680
Yes, great role for him there. I mean he's probably most recognized for

272
00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:45.279
his role on Lost when he played
John Locke. But but I love his

273
00:21:45.519 --> 00:21:48.720
I love his performance as Howard Hughes. And we haven't really talked about it.

274
00:21:48.759 --> 00:21:53.000
But I love the fact that this
movie is kind of mashing real life

275
00:21:53.039 --> 00:21:59.160
with fantasy. Yeah. I mean, we have people that are playing real

276
00:21:59.240 --> 00:22:03.200
people in American history, you know, Howard Hughes, W. C.

277
00:22:03.359 --> 00:22:07.880
Fields, Clark Gable. I always
think it's cool when we get when we

278
00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:12.880
get people playing real people in films
well, and it adds to the realism,

279
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:18.240
which helps with a movie like this
because it's telling you, yes,

280
00:22:18.319 --> 00:22:22.160
it's a movie based on a comic
book, which we're not used to at

281
00:22:22.160 --> 00:22:26.160
this point. We're not lauding those
kind of things as fantastic movies. They're

282
00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:30.680
usually seen as for kids, whereas
this is leaning it into a little bit

283
00:22:30.799 --> 00:22:34.359
more of a serious end of the
spectrum. There's not a lot of gadgets,

284
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:37.440
there's not a lot of punchlines or
you know, one liners or anything

285
00:22:37.440 --> 00:22:41.519
else like that. And I think
that era of realism and that grounding in

286
00:22:41.559 --> 00:22:48.200
reality helps to make it seem like
a little bit more of a mature movie.

287
00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:51.839
So for a family movie, you've
got something the older audiences can appreciate

288
00:22:51.839 --> 00:22:55.400
with their kids. Yeah. Now, one thing, Scott, I want

289
00:22:55.400 --> 00:23:00.720
to mention before we move on.
I feel like this is maybe a missed

290
00:23:00.759 --> 00:23:07.359
opportunity. But over at the at
the airplane hanger, you know, you

291
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:12.680
got everyone kind of hanging out,
right, TV's got his buddies. Okay,

292
00:23:12.799 --> 00:23:18.359
so my first my first question to
you is you got you got William

293
00:23:18.400 --> 00:23:22.599
Sanderson. He's just there hanging out. He doesn't have I don't I don't

294
00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:26.319
think he has a single line.
M h Yeah. I just remember him

295
00:23:26.319 --> 00:23:27.720
as the guy when he was taking
off in the GB, when Cliff was

296
00:23:27.720 --> 00:23:30.720
taking off on the GB, he
kind of turns his head toward the camera

297
00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:34.319
because he's trying to avoid the dust
flat in his face. I mean,

298
00:23:34.359 --> 00:23:37.839
the guy, you know, blade
runner. I Well, we're not gonna

299
00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:41.240
get his filmography, but I mean
he's known enough that you would think,

300
00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:47.039
like give him, give him at
least one line, right, Yeah,

301
00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:49.799
yeah, you would think I do. Like Also, uh, one of

302
00:23:49.799 --> 00:23:56.640
the other guys hanging out, Eddie
Jones is there who I always recognize.

303
00:23:56.680 --> 00:24:00.960
You know, he played uh he
played Jonathan Kent Yeah on what was it?

304
00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:04.039
Loasa Clark yep. Yeah, kind
of feel bad for him in this

305
00:24:04.079 --> 00:24:08.359
movie. He's kind down down on
his luck type character, you know,

306
00:24:08.519 --> 00:24:12.680
can't catch a break. Yeah,
and when he you know, his heart's

307
00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:17.200
in the right place when he climbs
into the GB and yeah, well no

308
00:24:17.240 --> 00:24:22.480
it's not in the GB and the
biplane in Cliff's place as climbed the clown

309
00:24:22.519 --> 00:24:26.960
and the stunt show. Yeah,
the stunt show clown yep. And in

310
00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:32.079
that moment he kind of I kind
of got Randy Quibbs Randy Quaid vibes from

311
00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:36.400
Independence Day, even though I know
it's different. Like he wasn't drunk,

312
00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:37.960
he was he knew what he was
doing, and he was like, you

313
00:24:37.960 --> 00:24:41.400
know what, I'm not the best
pilot, but I'm going to do this

314
00:24:41.400 --> 00:24:44.200
because Cliff needs it. I mean, he's a good guy. He's yeah,

315
00:24:44.200 --> 00:24:48.799
he's well intentioned. Yeah, funny
you mentioned you mentioned Randy Quaid in

316
00:24:48.880 --> 00:24:53.200
INDEPENDENCEDA. We're gonna we're gonna talk
about him this Friday, actually on nineteen

317
00:24:53.279 --> 00:24:56.359
ninety six, but I'll I'll get
to that later. Anyone else you want

318
00:24:56.359 --> 00:25:02.559
to talk about before we move on. There's one actor that I don't think

319
00:25:02.599 --> 00:25:06.920
we can pass up. Goes by
the name of Tiny Ron and he played

320
00:25:07.319 --> 00:25:12.440
yeah, which was a fantastic addition. Now this is before this is before

321
00:25:12.519 --> 00:25:18.920
Dick Tracy, Am I right,
yes, And this seemed like the most

322
00:25:18.079 --> 00:25:22.680
Dick Tracy style character in the movie. It was probably one of the most

323
00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:26.480
cartoonish kind of aspects of it,
but it didn't go over the top,

324
00:25:26.960 --> 00:25:33.079
like Lothar looked like somebody who may
be of that stature, with those characteristics.

325
00:25:33.160 --> 00:25:37.519
He even had a few speaking lines, and I think he did a

326
00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:42.079
great job. He gives you that
menacing henchman that's got the strength to you

327
00:25:42.079 --> 00:25:48.279
know, throw people around and support
you know, Timothy Dalton's character. Now,

328
00:25:48.279 --> 00:25:52.119
eventually we're going to talk about Tiny
Ron. He had a couple he

329
00:25:52.160 --> 00:25:56.279
had a couple of roles in Star
Trek, so we'll talk about him in

330
00:25:56.359 --> 00:26:00.440
Phaser, set to stun Well,
hen Star Treking. Yeah, he was

331
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:07.359
in Voyager and quite a few episodes
on Star Trek Deep Space nine. I

332
00:26:07.400 --> 00:26:10.920
actually I had to look because I
wasn't one hundred percent sure. But actually

333
00:26:10.920 --> 00:26:14.799
Dick Tracy comes out the year before
this movie. But to your point,

334
00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:18.640
to your point, he's I feel
like he's a Dick Tracy villain upgrade.

335
00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:22.839
He got we got makeup by Rick
Baker. He's it's a little more realistic

336
00:26:23.000 --> 00:26:26.279
than what we see in Dick Tracy, a little more, a little a

337
00:26:26.279 --> 00:26:32.200
little less cartoony a little more menacing
and uh absolutely love it. Yeah.

338
00:26:32.200 --> 00:26:36.839
This guy, uh tiny Ron Ron
Taylor. I guess uh, as it

339
00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:41.559
goes his agent, you know,
there was already a Ron Taylor in SAgs.

340
00:26:41.599 --> 00:26:45.519
So his his agent, noting Andre
the Giant, tells the seven foot

341
00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:48.799
tall Ron Taylor, like, change
your name to tiny Ron because you'll stand

342
00:26:48.799 --> 00:26:52.839
out. Yeah, that's a good
call. I guess he does. Sure.

343
00:26:52.960 --> 00:26:56.799
Sure. Now, before we move
on to the film's background, can

344
00:26:56.839 --> 00:27:00.720
we can we take a minute to
talk about James Horner and his absolutely amazing

345
00:27:00.759 --> 00:27:04.440
score for this film. Yeah.
I mean even from the first notes when

346
00:27:04.480 --> 00:27:11.240
you hear it over the opening credits, it starts off as very slow and

347
00:27:11.319 --> 00:27:18.279
approachable. It sets you in that
kind of small town feel in exactly the

348
00:27:18.359 --> 00:27:25.440
right moments, and then picks up
precisely when it has to, taking you

349
00:27:25.480 --> 00:27:29.119
through all the twists and turns of
the aerial stunt, shows the action of

350
00:27:29.160 --> 00:27:33.400
the rocketeer flying around. I think
it's perfect for this one. You know,

351
00:27:33.440 --> 00:27:37.279
our buddy Wayne Whited this is a
top three composer for Wayne. Yeah,

352
00:27:37.640 --> 00:27:41.319
so I had to reach out to
Wayne. Here is what he has

353
00:27:41.359 --> 00:27:48.319
to say about James Horner's score.
For The Rocketeer. The Rocketeer is one

354
00:27:48.319 --> 00:27:51.720
of my favorite films of the nineteen
nineties, and, in my opinion,

355
00:27:51.799 --> 00:27:56.279
one of the best comic to film
adaptations ever made. I've been a fan

356
00:27:56.319 --> 00:28:00.400
of Dave Stephens's character since his debut
back in nineteen eighty two, and was

357
00:28:00.440 --> 00:28:03.079
incredibly excited when Disney brought the story
to life on the big screen in nineteen

358
00:28:03.160 --> 00:28:07.000
ninety one. But I was even
more excited when I heard that James Horner

359
00:28:07.039 --> 00:28:11.480
would be taking the scoring duties for
the film, as many of his more

360
00:28:11.480 --> 00:28:15.680
recent scores had been on continuous replay
in My Car's Tape Player, like Field

361
00:28:15.680 --> 00:28:21.720
of Dreams, Honey, I Shrunk
the Kids in especially Glory. James Horner

362
00:28:21.799 --> 00:28:26.880
was eager to take on this assignment
as he himself was enthusiastic about flying and

363
00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:32.359
had been wanting for years to score
a film about the subject, so it's

364
00:28:32.480 --> 00:28:37.920
no surprise that this score became a
favorite of his. Horner wrote three distinct

365
00:28:37.119 --> 00:28:41.960
themes for the film, used throughout
the score from beginning to end. The

366
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:47.400
first theme is the Rocketeers theme,
which is heard most prominently in the opening

367
00:28:47.480 --> 00:28:52.559
and closing credits as a rousing and
almost innocent full orchestra theme, and then

368
00:28:52.599 --> 00:28:56.960
again he used in a darker,
more menacing tone in the cues Rendezvous at

369
00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:03.039
Griffiths Park and during the big Battle
on the Zeppelin. His second theme is

370
00:29:03.240 --> 00:29:07.039
Jenny's love theme and in my opinion, is the highlight of the score.

371
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:11.400
It's one of the most beautiful pieces
of music Horner ever wrote in his career,

372
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:17.680
and is highlighted on this soundtrack album
as a concert suite. It's a

373
00:29:17.759 --> 00:29:22.720
romantic piece that allows the strings,
brass and the woodwinds to shine. The

374
00:29:22.759 --> 00:29:26.279
third and final theme that Horner wrote
is of course, created for the villain

375
00:29:26.319 --> 00:29:30.759
of the film, Nevill Sinclair,
which was brilliantly played by Timothy Dalton.

376
00:29:32.519 --> 00:29:36.920
It uses a four note motif in
the style of the old thirties and forty

377
00:29:37.039 --> 00:29:44.039
superhero shots and creates a sinister sounding
danger to the character on screen. It

378
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:48.319
can be heard best near the end
of the queue Neville Sinclair's House, and

379
00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:52.599
again in the Zeppelin, as both
this and the Rocketeer theme duel for superiority,

380
00:29:53.079 --> 00:29:59.000
mimicking the action as seen on screen. The standout for me is the

381
00:29:59.079 --> 00:30:03.519
end credits. Horner was a master
of crafting a great end credit cue,

382
00:30:03.799 --> 00:30:07.880
and was one of the few composers
in Hollywood at the time that still insisted

383
00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:12.720
on writing a full composition for his
end credits, while most composers gave the

384
00:30:12.799 --> 00:30:18.400
job to the music editor to call
something together from earlier cues, and in

385
00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:22.960
true Horner style, he borrows a
bit from an earlier score of his.

386
00:30:22.279 --> 00:30:26.319
This time it's from Star Trek three, the Search for Spock, nearly note

387
00:30:26.319 --> 00:30:32.359
per note to bring it to a
conclusion. It's a perfectly crafted suite of

388
00:30:32.400 --> 00:30:37.799
his themes, and the whole orchestra
brings out the best Horner has to offer

389
00:30:37.880 --> 00:30:42.480
one last time before the film phase
to black. This score has been released

390
00:30:42.519 --> 00:30:47.359
twice on CD. First, on
its original release from Hollywood Records back in

391
00:30:47.400 --> 00:30:51.519
nineteen ninety one, has fifty seven
minutes to music, including two songs heard

392
00:30:51.519 --> 00:30:56.680
from the film. Then, in
twenty sixteen, Introtto Records released a definitive

393
00:30:56.799 --> 00:31:00.599
two CD version of the soundtrack,
containing the entire eighty one minute score as

394
00:31:00.640 --> 00:31:04.559
heard in the film, as well
as a newly remastered version of the nineteen

395
00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:10.920
ninety one album on just two It
contained over twenty minutes of never before released

396
00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:15.119
music from the film and newly remastered
or remixed by Sean Murphy from the original

397
00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:22.240
Sony forty eight track session masters given
to him from Disney. Unfortunately, for

398
00:31:22.319 --> 00:31:25.839
all new soundtrack collectors who have just
discovered this score, it's now out a

399
00:31:25.880 --> 00:31:30.000
print on an unavailable except for the
secondary market. But I'm sure that sometime

400
00:31:30.079 --> 00:31:33.680
soon one of the labels will bring
this score back for everyone to enjoy.

401
00:31:33.759 --> 00:31:37.599
Once again, Thank you, Wayne. And with that, Scott, I

402
00:31:37.640 --> 00:31:41.400
say we take a quick break and
when we get back we will talk a

403
00:31:41.400 --> 00:31:49.000
little bit about this film's background and
production. Welcome back. We are talking

404
00:31:49.079 --> 00:31:56.720
about Joe Johnston's the Rocketeer. Scott. You mentioned Dave Stevens earlier. This

405
00:31:56.920 --> 00:32:00.440
is a comic book character that he
created. I believe he did views in

406
00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:04.480
Starslayer in nineteen eighty two. Is
that correct? Yeah, Starslayer two and

407
00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:07.720
three. It's kind of a side
story at the end of the issue.

408
00:32:08.759 --> 00:32:14.480
And I actually picked up Starslayer two
after seeing this movie. Oh so you

409
00:32:14.519 --> 00:32:15.920
have an actual copy of it,
because I was thinking like this would be

410
00:32:15.960 --> 00:32:19.960
a hard one to find, but
nope, not at the time. And

411
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:25.000
I was friends with a guy who
ran a comic book store at the time,

412
00:32:25.400 --> 00:32:31.079
and I got the poster and the
first appearance of the Rocketeer in the

413
00:32:31.119 --> 00:32:36.519
same place down there at Queen City
Comic and Card in Cincinnati. I absolutely

414
00:32:36.599 --> 00:32:42.039
love the look of this character.
He's actually I guess Stevens based him off

415
00:32:42.079 --> 00:32:45.160
of the nineteen thirty serials King of
the Rocketmen, as well as Commando Cody.

416
00:32:45.839 --> 00:32:50.039
Check out check out these pictures,
Scott, Like this is this is

417
00:32:50.039 --> 00:32:52.160
our first look at the Rocketeer way
back in the thirties. What do you

418
00:32:52.200 --> 00:32:58.440
think a little bit too, Buck
Rogers in my opinion, like, okay,

419
00:32:59.200 --> 00:33:04.200
there's a it was an interesting episode
of Tailspin that actually came out around

420
00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:07.200
this time where he plays a character
called bullet Heead, And that's what I

421
00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:10.799
think of when I see Commander Cody. Like the King of the Rocketman,

422
00:33:12.200 --> 00:33:15.440
it's a little bit too. It
doesn't have personality the way that the Dave

423
00:33:15.480 --> 00:33:21.640
Stevens design does. Scott. I
think you mentioned in your your synopsis you

424
00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:25.720
talk about Steve Miner, who I
absolutely love. He's the director of the

425
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:31.559
second and third Friday the Thirteenth films. So Stevens sells the rights to him

426
00:33:32.200 --> 00:33:37.519
and after several years of development,
he moves on, citing creative differences,

427
00:33:37.440 --> 00:33:42.960
which I think worked out for everyone
because he chooses to direct the nineteen eighty

428
00:33:42.960 --> 00:33:47.480
six Classic House instead of the Rocket. Wow. Right, well it's a

429
00:33:47.480 --> 00:33:54.680
good choice. Yeah. Eighty five, Stevens gives two guys, Danny Bilson

430
00:33:55.119 --> 00:34:00.319
and Paul Demo, the option to
write a screenplay. Absolutely loves what they

431
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:05.359
do because they respect the period setting
and their ideas are heartfelt and affectionate.

432
00:34:06.160 --> 00:34:07.960
They start pitching this at the wrong
time that great year. They start pitching

433
00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:13.239
this in nineteen eighty six to all
the studios. But like you had said,

434
00:34:13.239 --> 00:34:15.760
this is before Dick Tracy, this
is before Batman. We're kind of

435
00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:22.039
in that Superman three era where there
hasn't really been any other comic book heroes

436
00:34:22.480 --> 00:34:25.639
on the silver screen, and it's
because they just don't know how to develop

437
00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:30.119
them yet. So yeah, they
kind of run out of gas, and

438
00:34:30.159 --> 00:34:34.199
it just seems like they're just they're
doing serials of the same character, not

439
00:34:34.239 --> 00:34:37.920
necessarily digging for new ip or less
well known ip. Yeah, and we're

440
00:34:37.960 --> 00:34:42.239
doing so makes a big difference.
Yeah, And over the next five years,

441
00:34:42.800 --> 00:34:50.119
Disney fires and rehires them three separate
times. And this stems from Disney's

442
00:34:50.119 --> 00:34:54.599
interest in merchandising the picture with an
eye on toy sales. So the only

443
00:34:54.639 --> 00:34:57.920
reason Disney even signed on is like, hey, we can make some toys

444
00:34:57.920 --> 00:35:00.719
out of this, which makes me
sad. Yeah, I mean it seems

445
00:35:00.760 --> 00:35:06.159
like it's kind of exploiting it,
right, And I think you had said

446
00:35:06.199 --> 00:35:09.559
that Billy Campbell signed on for three
pictures for the three picture deals a series.

447
00:35:10.559 --> 00:35:15.320
I feel like, even though I
don't think it was intentional, they

448
00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:17.199
just wanted to stick with one.
But I think having this is a one

449
00:35:17.199 --> 00:35:22.400
shot is a much better choice than
trying to into a cereal interesting. Okay,

450
00:35:22.519 --> 00:35:27.400
Well, speaking of quitting, though, Johnston himself had threatened to quit

451
00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:32.320
during production because Disney's Michael Eisner,
You're not gonna believe this. He doesn't

452
00:35:32.320 --> 00:35:36.679
like the He doesn't like the look
of the helmet, which is ridiculus.

453
00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:39.559
I feel I feel like has like
that Iron Man Mark one look to it.

454
00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:44.440
Very cool. Yeah, well it
looks like something Howard Hughes would design.

455
00:35:44.960 --> 00:35:49.960
Yeah, but Eisner wants a NASA
styled helmet for the rocketeer. No

456
00:35:50.639 --> 00:35:54.440
is wrong. Yeah, he is
very wrong, and he Fortunately Johnston had

457
00:35:54.519 --> 00:35:58.639
enough credit that when he threatened to
quit, they were like, all right,

458
00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:01.360
fine, stick with the stick with
the old one. Yeah, and

459
00:36:01.400 --> 00:36:05.199
I mean he stuck. He stuck
to his guns about a lot of choices.

460
00:36:06.159 --> 00:36:08.599
Yeah. So they saw dollar signs
because they saw the chance to make

461
00:36:08.639 --> 00:36:14.400
this into toys. And it looks
like toy Biz had the rights to the

462
00:36:14.440 --> 00:36:17.440
toy line with a couple of different
versions of Cliff. It was going to

463
00:36:17.480 --> 00:36:23.239
be pretty similar to the Kenner Batman
line. They made a lot of prototypes,

464
00:36:23.320 --> 00:36:28.920
but it was promptly shut down because
I guess they thought it wasn't going

465
00:36:28.960 --> 00:36:31.480
to be successful enough of a movie
that it wouldn't sell the toys. I

466
00:36:31.519 --> 00:36:35.760
think they were wrong. I think
if they had made the toys, it

467
00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:38.559
probably would have helped with ticket sales. I absolutely it would have. I

468
00:36:38.840 --> 00:36:43.079
know. The one thing that that
that made it out was like that Bendi

469
00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:45.840
figure which looks like something you get, yeah, you know, the one

470
00:36:45.880 --> 00:36:50.119
I'm talking about with the wires and
you can kind of pose it. Yeah.

471
00:36:50.159 --> 00:36:52.360
Yeah, it just it looks like
something you get at like your local

472
00:36:52.400 --> 00:36:55.800
grocery store, as opposed to like
toys, you know, Toys r Us

473
00:36:55.920 --> 00:36:59.320
or something like that. It was
that it wasn't articulated at all. It's

474
00:36:59.400 --> 00:37:02.079
terrible makes no sense, especially because
toy Bis knows what they knew what they

475
00:37:02.079 --> 00:37:07.280
were doing. As far as action
figure designed, there's a lot of action

476
00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:10.119
features they could have done with that
with this property and made a lot with

477
00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:15.039
it. They had all these prototypes
and they just they at the last minute,

478
00:37:15.280 --> 00:37:16.119
like the eleventh hour, Disney just
dumped it and said, Nope,

479
00:37:16.119 --> 00:37:20.280
we're not doing it. I don't
kid it. Yep, i'd be I'd

480
00:37:20.280 --> 00:37:25.360
be interested to see if Jerome House
of Plastic has ever seen any prototypes pop

481
00:37:25.440 --> 00:37:28.880
up from toy biz. That'd be
fair. I'm sure. I'm sure he

482
00:37:28.920 --> 00:37:32.199
has. As far as merchandising,
there's another aspect of it. It's one

483
00:37:32.199 --> 00:37:36.559
of my favorite movie posters of all
time. And I think you know that

484
00:37:36.679 --> 00:37:38.000
the one that I'm talking about.
It's over my shoulder. It's the original

485
00:37:38.079 --> 00:37:43.400
art book at it. Man,
that thing's awesome, designed by John Meadows.

486
00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:49.199
I think it's it's iconic. It
certainly drew me to want to see

487
00:37:49.199 --> 00:37:53.480
the movie, but apparently the studio
wasn't wild about it because it didn't draw

488
00:37:53.559 --> 00:38:00.039
enough attention to the cast, including
Timothy Dalton, so they eventually changed the

489
00:38:00.039 --> 00:38:04.599
poster to feature all the main characters, but it loses that art deco style,

490
00:38:04.639 --> 00:38:07.079
which I think is a shame.
It's a shame, and I'm not

491
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:13.559
defending the studio, but I understand
their point. You've this is a time

492
00:38:13.599 --> 00:38:15.480
when Timothy Dalton, for the for
most of the world, they still know

493
00:38:15.519 --> 00:38:20.079
that he's James Bond. So to
not have his face on the poster,

494
00:38:21.280 --> 00:38:22.880
yeah, I get it. I
totally get it, because Billy Campbell's not

495
00:38:22.880 --> 00:38:25.719
gonna put butts in the seats yet
because no one knows who he is.

496
00:38:27.519 --> 00:38:31.800
And while the rocketeer looks gorgeous,
like the design looks just amazing, you

497
00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:35.360
need you know, this is nineteen
this is nineteen ninety one. We don't

498
00:38:35.360 --> 00:38:42.000
have the Internet, we don't have
the constant stream of information and behind the

499
00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:44.920
scenes set peaks and all that kind
of stuff, So you're relying on your

500
00:38:44.960 --> 00:38:47.119
stars. You kind of need Timothy
Dalton's face on the poster. As far

501
00:38:47.119 --> 00:38:51.519
as I'm concerned, I don't like
it. I'd prefer the Art deco,

502
00:38:51.599 --> 00:38:54.519
but I totally get where the company's
coming from on this one. Well,

503
00:38:54.559 --> 00:39:00.840
and you've got a very a very
good looking leading couple with this, and

504
00:39:00.960 --> 00:39:07.440
I think, yes, showing Billy
Campbell's face definitely showing Jennifer Connelly's face would

505
00:39:07.440 --> 00:39:13.119
put butts in the seats. If
that had been the poster I had seen,

506
00:39:13.159 --> 00:39:15.559
and I saw Jennifer Connelly, my
butt would be in the scene.

507
00:39:15.039 --> 00:39:21.159
But that's me and you know,
to be fair, it's like the redesign

508
00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:25.800
that has like the the actors' faces. It's not bad. I mean it's

509
00:39:25.920 --> 00:39:30.119
it should be a Dreu Drewsen style
poster, but it's not. But it

510
00:39:30.159 --> 00:39:34.559
still looks good, you know,
I don't. I don't hate it.

511
00:39:35.400 --> 00:39:37.159
The one you have on your wall
right there, I'm looking at that's the

512
00:39:37.199 --> 00:39:42.400
one to have. But right,
we got both, right, but we

513
00:39:42.480 --> 00:39:47.039
got one. Everybody went one of
the main everybody wins. Uh. I'm

514
00:39:47.079 --> 00:39:50.880
hoping. I'm hoping we'll keep talking
because I'm gonna ask you a question here

515
00:39:50.880 --> 00:39:52.920
and if you get the answer wrong, I'm just gonna I'm gonna kill your

516
00:39:52.920 --> 00:40:00.119
mic. There's one. There's if
there's a pivotal scene in this, tell

517
00:40:00.119 --> 00:40:02.960
me what it is. Well,
it's got to be the Cliff saving the

518
00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:07.639
stunt show as the rocketeer, right, the debt you the debut of the

519
00:40:07.679 --> 00:40:13.880
moment, Yes, and keeping with
his character, he just wants to save

520
00:40:13.920 --> 00:40:17.679
his friend, that's it. Horner's
score is is incredible at this moment.

521
00:40:19.519 --> 00:40:22.320
I don't know about you, but
it kind of gives me Superman seventy eight

522
00:40:22.400 --> 00:40:29.840
vibes when when Superman goes to save
Lewis with the helicopter. Yep, yeah,

523
00:40:30.039 --> 00:40:34.840
which we got that real vibe it
does, and it's it's it's the

524
00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:39.159
aerial choreography. I think that gets
it. And you know, you believe

525
00:40:39.159 --> 00:40:44.719
that a man could fly in that
suit, you know, and obviously in

526
00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:47.199
Superman seventy eight we covered in a
film. At forty five, we were

527
00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:54.079
very fortunate to have guest Aaron Spilensky
from that young Clark Kent. Oh yeah,

528
00:40:54.119 --> 00:40:59.159
young kal El. If you haven't
caught that episode, please go check

529
00:40:59.199 --> 00:41:01.480
it out. It's a rare rocker, but it's a good one. I

530
00:41:01.760 --> 00:41:06.199
tell you one thing I really love
about this moment too. Did you notice

531
00:41:06.199 --> 00:41:13.400
that the rocketeer is not exactly smooth
in flight. Cliff is still figuring it

532
00:41:13.400 --> 00:41:20.079
out. He's still trying to understand
the controls, so his his flying's a

533
00:41:20.119 --> 00:41:23.280
little erratic, it's a little clunky, it's a little haphazard. I think

534
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:28.320
that works. It lends to the
realism of the picture. Yeah, well,

535
00:41:28.360 --> 00:41:30.079
I mean it goes back to your
Peter Parker connection, you know,

536
00:41:30.159 --> 00:41:34.880
especially the Toby Maguire where he's still
kind of getting the hang of it,

537
00:41:34.360 --> 00:41:39.519
he's not completely fitting into the role, and it connects to him as a

538
00:41:39.519 --> 00:41:43.719
stunt pilot as well, because not
everything is going to go perfect, but

539
00:41:43.760 --> 00:41:46.760
he's making the best of it,
doing the best that he can. Absolutely.

540
00:41:46.800 --> 00:41:51.679
Well, I'll tell you what,
Scott. Let's take Let's take one

541
00:41:51.679 --> 00:41:59.400
more break and when we get back, we'll talk about Joe Johnston. Welcome

542
00:41:59.400 --> 00:42:02.719
back. We're talking talking about Joe
Johnston's the Rocketeer, Scott. I love

543
00:42:02.800 --> 00:42:06.760
the fact that we were talking about
Johnston at the beginning of the hour and

544
00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:10.679
you mentioned some of his work at
ILM, specifically the Millennium, the Millennium

545
00:42:10.679 --> 00:42:17.360
Falcon. I'll let our listeners know
he also designed the Iron Giant. Yep,

546
00:42:17.800 --> 00:42:22.280
he created the final designs for Yoda
and Boba fet, the X Wing

547
00:42:22.320 --> 00:42:29.920
Fighters, the at At Walkers,
and the Death Star. Yeah. One

548
00:42:29.960 --> 00:42:37.280
guy looks one guy is giving us
the final concepts for all these iconic things

549
00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:40.280
that we grew up with. That's
that's amazing to me, all because he

550
00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:45.000
saw a flyer that would get him
a better commute. Yeah, and speaking

551
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:50.840
speaking of the guy that wrote that
flyer, George Lucas, when Joe Johnston

552
00:42:51.119 --> 00:42:53.320
decided to leave ILM, you know, you mentioned he had a six week

553
00:42:53.400 --> 00:43:00.320
job, right, so his plan
when he left ILM was to travel with

554
00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:05.239
the money that he saved up.
Thankfully, George Lucas convinced him to enroll

555
00:43:05.280 --> 00:43:09.400
in USC Film School on the condition
that Lucas would pay his tuition. In

556
00:43:09.480 --> 00:43:15.119
exchange, he gets to keep Johnston
on as a part time employee. That's

557
00:43:15.199 --> 00:43:19.519
that's that's an offer you absolutely cannot
refuse. No, not at all,

558
00:43:19.559 --> 00:43:22.159
George, George Lucas is going to
get you into a USC film school,

559
00:43:22.360 --> 00:43:24.440
He's going to pay your tuition,
and he wants to keep you on his

560
00:43:24.480 --> 00:43:30.679
on his staff. That's unbelievable,
right, sick. Yeah, And is

561
00:43:30.719 --> 00:43:34.920
that before or after he did work
on nineteen eighty six? Is Howard the

562
00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:37.840
duck? I'm just curious what a
wise guy? No, No, I

563
00:43:37.880 --> 00:43:40.119
want to know, like, was
that this is? This is after?

564
00:43:40.480 --> 00:43:44.760
This is after his initial work,
you know, when he that six week

565
00:43:44.880 --> 00:43:50.119
job. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Keep in mind he also

566
00:43:50.519 --> 00:43:55.360
another fun fact about this this guy, he does have an Oscar for Best

567
00:43:55.400 --> 00:44:00.159
Visual Effects that he shares with Richard
Edlund, Kit West and Bruce Nickson for

568
00:44:00.199 --> 00:44:04.920
the work they did on Raiders of
the Lost Ark. Well deserved, yep,

569
00:44:04.960 --> 00:44:10.599
well deserved. And talking about The
Rocketeer, he's quoted as saying,

570
00:44:12.519 --> 00:44:15.760
I'd love to make a sequel to
The Rocketeer. The film didn't do as

571
00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:20.000
well at the box office as we
all hoped, but it has endured and

572
00:44:20.119 --> 00:44:23.559
generated a following. One thing,
if I could, if I could just

573
00:44:23.800 --> 00:44:27.920
jump back one real quick, just
based on his quote, I will tell

574
00:44:27.920 --> 00:44:31.760
you this Scott. We mentioned that
Billy Campbell and Jennifer Connelly had multi picture

575
00:44:31.800 --> 00:44:37.960
deals pinning the success of this film. The Rocketeer open in fourth place behind

576
00:44:38.199 --> 00:44:45.199
Robinhood, Prince of Thieves, City
Slickers and Dying Young, and ended up

577
00:44:45.199 --> 00:44:50.119
doing forty six point seven million dollars
on a budget of thirty five million,

578
00:44:50.920 --> 00:44:57.119
and sadly Disney deemed that a commercial
disappointment. So no, No Rocketeer part

579
00:44:57.119 --> 00:45:00.760
two. Let's talk about this guy's
filmography though. You ready for that?

580
00:45:00.800 --> 00:45:05.639
Yeah? So he started as a
director for Honey I Shrunk the Kids in

581
00:45:05.679 --> 00:45:08.039
eighty nine, right, yeah,
nineteen eighty nine, Talk about making a

582
00:45:08.119 --> 00:45:13.119
directorial debut Honey, I Shrunk the
Kids. Yeah, which was we got

583
00:45:13.119 --> 00:45:16.119
to think blockbuster, blockbuster, and
you got to think this is a hands

584
00:45:16.119 --> 00:45:22.320
on director who has cut his teeth
on special effects and model making and storyboarding.

585
00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:27.320
I kind of feel like, you
know that that lends to the success

586
00:45:27.320 --> 00:45:31.440
of this film. Yeah. Well, and it's it's in keeping with the

587
00:45:31.880 --> 00:45:37.079
vibe that we got from the Rocketeer, like it's a it's a family movie,

588
00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:40.000
but it's not patronizing, it's not
talking down to kids. It's something

589
00:45:40.039 --> 00:45:45.239
that everybody can enjoy. And one
last thing I love about Honey, I

590
00:45:45.239 --> 00:45:49.960
Shrunk the Kids. You gotta remember
Moranis is not even the first choice to

591
00:45:49.960 --> 00:45:54.039
play Selensky. It's John Candy.
Yeah, it's John Candy who doesn't want

592
00:45:54.079 --> 00:45:58.280
to do it but says, hey, check out my buddy Rick Moranis.

593
00:45:59.000 --> 00:46:02.480
He'd be perfect for this, and
he was Andy's right, obviously. But

594
00:46:02.639 --> 00:46:07.000
the irony here is that this is
not the first time that John Candy has

595
00:46:07.039 --> 00:46:10.480
done this, because if you think
back to nineteen eighty four, Rick Moranis

596
00:46:10.480 --> 00:46:15.639
plays Lewis Tolly in Ghostbusters. That
wasn't his role to begin with. That

597
00:46:15.679 --> 00:46:17.880
was John Candy's and Candy didn't want
to do it, so they pull in

598
00:46:17.960 --> 00:46:22.760
Rick Moranis. Thank you, John
Candy. Thank you John Candy for not

599
00:46:22.840 --> 00:46:24.599
that he wouldn't have done a good
job in both roles. But I think

600
00:46:24.639 --> 00:46:29.159
we're better off for having Rick Moranis
in those roles. We are, we

601
00:46:29.199 --> 00:46:34.079
Are. We've been talking about the
Rocketeers. That's his picture in nineteen ninety

602
00:46:34.119 --> 00:46:37.079
one, Scott. He does,
over the next couple of years do a

603
00:46:37.079 --> 00:46:43.199
couple episodes of the Young Indiana Jones
Chronicles, which I gotta go back.

604
00:46:43.199 --> 00:46:45.840
I'd love to go back and see
which ones are his, because I've seen

605
00:46:45.840 --> 00:46:49.079
the whole series. I love the
whole series, and now now I'm ready

606
00:46:49.119 --> 00:46:53.239
for that. Yeah. Ninety four
he did the live action sequences for that

607
00:46:53.360 --> 00:46:58.960
Macaulay Culkin movie, The Page Master. I never saw it. Was it?

608
00:46:59.000 --> 00:47:01.039
Did you say it was any good? I didn't see it. No,

609
00:47:01.639 --> 00:47:06.239
I don't know. I don't know
why, but yeah, I'll tell

610
00:47:06.239 --> 00:47:10.559
you what hits everyone. Nineteen ninety
five Jumanji. Yeah, and again,

611
00:47:10.840 --> 00:47:15.760
so going back to what I said
before about Rocketeer being a family movie that

612
00:47:15.800 --> 00:47:22.599
doesn't talk down to people. It's
something that adults can enjoy with their kids.

613
00:47:22.719 --> 00:47:24.119
You get that with Rocketeer, you
get that with Honey Asher Kids,

614
00:47:24.119 --> 00:47:28.639
and you definitely get it with Jumanji. So I think he's got effected there.

615
00:47:29.360 --> 00:47:34.760
You know what's amazing about Jumanji is
Johnston. It's not that he didn't

616
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:37.920
want to cast Robin Williams, but
he was very nervous about Robin Williams taking

617
00:47:37.960 --> 00:47:45.679
on the role because Robin Williams has
this big reputation for doing improv and Johnston

618
00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:49.719
wants to get what's on the page. Cool thing though, is you know

619
00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:55.039
Williams, he understands it's got to
be a tightly structured story and he kind

620
00:47:55.039 --> 00:47:58.920
of plays ball, you know,
he think he only does a little bit

621
00:47:58.960 --> 00:48:02.519
of improvising, but it's usual with
the Bonnie Hunt scenes, just when when

622
00:48:02.559 --> 00:48:08.920
you see Robin Williams kind of kind
of going off course. Yeah, yeah,

623
00:48:09.480 --> 00:48:13.559
that's a that's a fantastic film.
I never would have thought it would

624
00:48:13.559 --> 00:48:16.719
have moved in the direction it has, you know, with the Rock taken

625
00:48:16.760 --> 00:48:20.760
over, that whole franchise. But
those movies are good too, They're they're

626
00:48:20.800 --> 00:48:23.360
fun. I think those movies are
fantastic. Yeah, I love them.

627
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:29.960
Uh, what'd you think nineteen ninety
nine, he does October Sky with Tobey

628
00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:32.199
Maguire. Did you ever check that
one out? That one I did not

629
00:48:32.360 --> 00:48:37.000
catch. I feel like I should
have, but I have. It's a

630
00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:40.800
fun it's a it's a feel good
movie. Uh, he's a Maguire's playing

631
00:48:40.840 --> 00:48:45.559
Homer him Hickam. I think it's
Hicckham. You know cole Miner's son.

632
00:48:46.800 --> 00:48:51.599
Uh, you know he sees spot
Nick launch and he wants to talk rockets,

633
00:48:52.440 --> 00:48:55.280
you know, take up building rockets, even though his dad's a farmer.

634
00:48:55.320 --> 00:48:58.800
He doesn't want him to do it. Yeah, sos from you know,

635
00:48:59.000 --> 00:49:00.800
he's still you know, John's still
got the rocket blood in him.

636
00:49:01.599 --> 00:49:05.239
You know, we're not getting Rocketeer
sequel, so we'll just we'll go to

637
00:49:05.239 --> 00:49:08.199
October Sky. You at least get
rockets. You at least get rockets.

638
00:49:09.000 --> 00:49:15.079
I thought he was a great choice
for the Jurassic Park franchise. He's in

639
00:49:15.079 --> 00:49:19.000
two thousand and one. He does
Jurassic Park three. This one. So

640
00:49:19.079 --> 00:49:23.400
here's the thing I feel like after
a Jurassic Park two was a little bit

641
00:49:23.400 --> 00:49:28.920
of a letdown, that's fair to
say. Yeah, look, he gets

642
00:49:28.960 --> 00:49:30.480
he gets the band back together.
He's got Sam Neil back. He's got

643
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:37.519
uh, doctor m Malcolm, Jeff
Goldbloom is back. Everyone, everyone's showing

644
00:49:37.599 --> 00:49:40.079
up, right, So I don't
understand, Like, why why didn't this

645
00:49:40.119 --> 00:49:44.960
movie do as good as it did
well? Wasn't this the one with the

646
00:49:44.960 --> 00:49:49.920
talking raptors? I don't remember talking
raptors. There's a there's a scene where

647
00:49:49.920 --> 00:49:53.039
he has a dream, he has
a dream sequence on the plane and there's

648
00:49:53.039 --> 00:49:57.480
a raptor that talks to him and
awakes m Ovens, says Alan, And

649
00:49:57.559 --> 00:50:00.960
it's just a little bit. But
maybe that's why I didn't do you know

650
00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:06.159
what? And I got a backtrack
here. It's not Jeff Goldbloom, it's

651
00:50:06.159 --> 00:50:09.599
way mah Macy, that's right.
But Sam Neil is definitely back. That's

652
00:50:09.920 --> 00:50:14.719
what it was. The second one
had Jeff Goldbloom, but you didn't have

653
00:50:15.639 --> 00:50:19.880
you didn't have Sam Neil, and
you didn't have Laura durn. Yeah.

654
00:50:20.079 --> 00:50:22.840
Third time they're like, well,
right, bring Sam back, but we

655
00:50:22.840 --> 00:50:24.719
don't bring the other two backs.
So yeah, you know, the more

656
00:50:24.719 --> 00:50:28.159
we talk about it, the more
I'm starting to realized why it didn't maybe

657
00:50:28.719 --> 00:50:30.719
do as well as we thought it
would do. To another one. Uh,

658
00:50:31.880 --> 00:50:35.599
I'll be fair, I haven't seen
this one two thousand and four Hidalgo

659
00:50:35.920 --> 00:50:40.840
with a Vigo Mortensten not that have
I It's just I don't know, it's

660
00:50:40.880 --> 00:50:45.920
just horse racing around the world or
whatever it was. It just didn't didn't

661
00:50:45.920 --> 00:50:47.920
appeal to me. Honestly, I
don't think I got past the poster on

662
00:50:47.960 --> 00:50:52.440
this one. Let's move on.
Let's move on, because twenty ten I

663
00:50:52.440 --> 00:50:54.840
absolutely loved his take on The wolf
Man. Did you see that one?

664
00:50:55.199 --> 00:51:00.760
Yes? Very original? Did you
transformation scenes in there? Now? Did

665
00:51:00.840 --> 00:51:04.920
you? Did you watch the director's
cut, which is the superior version,

666
00:51:05.000 --> 00:51:08.599
or did you watch the theatrical?
Theatrical? Okay, interested to see the

667
00:51:08.599 --> 00:51:13.760
director's cut, check out the director's
cut because it answers so much more.

668
00:51:14.760 --> 00:51:17.320
This is a fantastic film, though
it's it's period piece wolf Man Story two,

669
00:51:17.679 --> 00:51:22.400
so that right there. Again.
I feel like if you need to

670
00:51:22.400 --> 00:51:25.960
do a period film, whether it's
an adventure story or horror story, Joe

671
00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:30.960
Johnson should be on. He should
be the first person you call, right,

672
00:51:30.880 --> 00:51:34.880
Yeah, well, I mean it
taps into the universal monster roots.

673
00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:40.440
It makes the lun Cheney design menacing. Yeah right, But ni Cil del

674
00:51:40.440 --> 00:51:46.079
Toro is fantastic playing the younger Talbot. You got Anthony Hopkins, Emily Blunt.

675
00:51:46.320 --> 00:51:51.079
That film is fantastic. It's it's
definitely a you know when I'm in

676
00:51:51.079 --> 00:51:58.280
the Werewolf cycle of my my horror
watching in October. Yep, that's that's

677
00:51:58.320 --> 00:52:01.880
definitely on the list. Scott.
We can't talk period films without his next

678
00:52:01.880 --> 00:52:07.480
one, twenty eleven, he does
Captain America The First Avenger. Yeah.

679
00:52:07.599 --> 00:52:10.239
Now, this is probably the Joe
Johnson movie that I've probably seen the most.

680
00:52:10.960 --> 00:52:15.639
This one I have on heavy rotation. I think it's it's one that

681
00:52:15.679 --> 00:52:22.119
I'm kind of bothered whenever I hear
that people aren't wild about it, because

682
00:52:22.159 --> 00:52:25.719
I think it was absolutely perfect for
a first outing with Cat. I can't

683
00:52:27.239 --> 00:52:30.440
that's funny you say that. I've
not heard anyone down on Captain America the

684
00:52:30.440 --> 00:52:37.280
First Adventer M and I think they're
I would have to disagree with them if

685
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:40.000
they were. This is a fantastic
This is one of the better films in

686
00:52:40.039 --> 00:52:45.159
the MCU. This say, as
far as I'm a specific tone for the

687
00:52:45.320 --> 00:52:49.079
MCU, well, that set it
in the right direction, like it sets

688
00:52:49.079 --> 00:52:52.400
it in the run of Rodgers.
We don't have the MCU we have today.

689
00:52:52.039 --> 00:52:57.880
I think the great thing here too, is that Dizney knows what they've

690
00:52:57.880 --> 00:53:02.119
got to do and all the and
despite all the disputes that they had with

691
00:53:02.239 --> 00:53:07.079
Joe Johnston during The Rocketeer, he
gets this job because of the Rocketeer.

692
00:53:07.719 --> 00:53:12.000
The suits are smart enough to go, hey, look what he did for

693
00:53:12.280 --> 00:53:14.960
the Rocketeer. This is this is
what we want. This is the aesthetic

694
00:53:14.960 --> 00:53:19.840
that we want. Kevin Feige wants
captain America in this timeline with this kind

695
00:53:19.880 --> 00:53:27.000
of heart. You gotta call Johnston
first Avenger is fantastic. Scott twenty fourteen.

696
00:53:27.880 --> 00:53:29.920
I got some homework to do because
I want to see this movie.

697
00:53:30.920 --> 00:53:35.159
He does one called Not Safe for
Work. Yeah, this sounds like a

698
00:53:35.199 --> 00:53:38.559
fascinating premise. So apparently it's an
office worker trapped inside a building where a

699
00:53:38.679 --> 00:53:43.559
killer is on the loose. That
is a fascinating concept. And I don't

700
00:53:43.599 --> 00:53:49.039
know why this didn't hit my radar. Well, okay, so in the

701
00:53:49.079 --> 00:53:52.840
interest of fairness, I just feel
this definitely feels like an independent film.

702
00:53:52.880 --> 00:54:00.000
I'm looking at the cast list,
I don't recognize anybody, so it's definitely

703
00:54:00.079 --> 00:54:02.599
I don't know if this was like
a this was made straight for like Netflix

704
00:54:02.719 --> 00:54:07.039
or Hulu or something like that.
But but man, this the premise sounds

705
00:54:07.039 --> 00:54:10.679
good, and I think we gotta
check it out. Yeah, I mean

706
00:54:10.719 --> 00:54:19.639
there is one space that I recognize, Molly Hagen, who I remember from

707
00:54:19.960 --> 00:54:22.760
Herman's Head that was kind of a
random Wow TV show back in the day,

708
00:54:23.039 --> 00:54:29.840
The Deepest of Cuts Herman's I've seen
her on plenty of things, and

709
00:54:30.159 --> 00:54:31.639
I think she always does a great
job. So that's one reason that I'd

710
00:54:31.679 --> 00:54:35.320
be deviting into this. All right, Yeah, I'm definitely gonna check this

711
00:54:35.320 --> 00:54:39.079
one out. Not Safe for work. Year later, twenty fifteen, he

712
00:54:39.119 --> 00:54:44.440
does a TV movie called Lumen twenty
eighteen. Scott, You've got children?

713
00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:47.880
What can you tell me about the
Nutcracker and the Four Realms? I can

714
00:54:47.920 --> 00:54:52.119
tell you that I haven't seen it. I can tell you that this is

715
00:54:52.119 --> 00:54:58.000
not something that would ever hit my
cue. But it does have Morgan Freeman

716
00:54:58.039 --> 00:55:00.880
and Helen Mirren in it, so
maybe we need to you take another look

717
00:55:00.920 --> 00:55:02.880
at it. Possibly, Okay,
okay, fair enough, fair enough.

718
00:55:04.360 --> 00:55:06.760
I bet I bet Amber Lewis can
tell me about this one. I think

719
00:55:06.800 --> 00:55:10.239
she's a she's a fan of the
Nutcracker, so that's all right, Amber,

720
00:55:10.360 --> 00:55:14.079
Well, I'll be calling you here
in a minute, Scott, you

721
00:55:14.119 --> 00:55:19.599
would talk about what is coming up
next for Joe Johnston. Yeah. So

722
00:55:20.039 --> 00:55:22.559
the first one that I know about
is Chronicles of Narnia the Silver Chair.

723
00:55:23.440 --> 00:55:29.320
Okay, it sounds like that's in
development with him in the director's chair.

724
00:55:29.320 --> 00:55:31.800
Again. This is the one for
Netflix, right, I believe, so,

725
00:55:32.119 --> 00:55:35.800
yeah, yeah, yeah, I
think we're a ways off from the

726
00:55:35.840 --> 00:55:39.599
Chronicles of Narnia, but that that
could be good. What I'm really excited

727
00:55:39.599 --> 00:55:45.800
about he's in pre production on Shrunk
and yes, this is the sequel to

728
00:55:45.840 --> 00:55:49.800
Honey I Shrunk the Kids. Like
I know, we've had a couple,

729
00:55:50.239 --> 00:55:55.360
but apparently this time it is one
of the kids that's doing the shrinking that

730
00:55:55.480 --> 00:56:00.400
he's an adult because Rick moranis is
back. But we also got Josh Gad,

731
00:56:00.400 --> 00:56:04.239
who let's tell you right now I'm
not a fan of. But yeah,

732
00:56:05.000 --> 00:56:08.320
but we've got Rick Morana's back.
I mean, yeah, here,

733
00:56:08.559 --> 00:56:15.039
yeah, yeah, Josh Gadd's playing
his son Nick. But uh, but

734
00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:17.760
but Rick is back. So as
long as we've got I'm just worried it's

735
00:56:17.760 --> 00:56:22.280
gonna be like a glorified cameo.
I want Rick moranis in the movie.

736
00:56:22.320 --> 00:56:27.159
I just don't want like a a
glorified cameo, if that's if that's fair

737
00:56:27.199 --> 00:56:30.719
to say, I hope you're right, and I would think that with the

738
00:56:30.159 --> 00:56:35.199
pull of Joe Johnston in the director's
chair, Yeah, it would be a

739
00:56:35.320 --> 00:56:38.880
crime to have Rick just be a
cameo. And I feel like that's the

740
00:56:38.960 --> 00:56:44.039
kind of Joe is the kind of
a person that could pull Rick out of

741
00:56:44.079 --> 00:56:46.360
retirement for a little more, a
little bit more than a cameo, I

742
00:56:46.360 --> 00:56:52.239
think. So. The Rocketeer currently
streaming on Disney Plus. Is this where

743
00:56:52.239 --> 00:56:55.480
you watched it? Scott Yep,
yep. Although I've got a copy on

744
00:56:55.599 --> 00:57:00.000
DVD. It's not quite like a
criterion collection kind of thing, but it's

745
00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:01.360
in the collection justin I'd love to
see this. I'd love to get a

746
00:57:01.360 --> 00:57:05.800
four K blu ray of this if
it's if it's available, because I want

747
00:57:05.800 --> 00:57:07.000
to audio commentary. I want I
want all the behind the scenes stuff,

748
00:57:07.039 --> 00:57:09.679
the extras, you know, you
know, definitely went behind the scenes.

749
00:57:09.840 --> 00:57:15.199
Yeah. Yeah, Well, I
think this one's fantastic. Uh. I'm

750
00:57:15.199 --> 00:57:21.800
sad that it wasn't as successful at
the box office, but I'm glad it

751
00:57:21.800 --> 00:57:24.480
it is underrated enough that we could
we had the opportunity to talk about this,

752
00:57:24.599 --> 00:57:29.920
uh, this fourth of July holiday. So yeah, and I mean,

753
00:57:30.000 --> 00:57:32.679
you know, it speaks to how
well it's held up. The people

754
00:57:32.719 --> 00:57:36.280
are still watching it and talking about
it. I know, it's had a

755
00:57:36.360 --> 00:57:39.119
couple of follow up series that have
come after it, and it's it just

756
00:57:39.400 --> 00:57:44.000
it just talks to the the quality
of the movie. Listeners, what do

757
00:57:44.079 --> 00:57:45.719
you think of the Rocketeer? You
can let us know on social media.

758
00:57:45.840 --> 00:57:50.559
You'll find us on Facebook, Instagram, x. You can check out a

759
00:57:50.599 --> 00:57:53.559
film by podcast dot com for all
of our episodes that are streaming free on

760
00:57:53.599 --> 00:57:57.719
the platform of your choice. You
can write to us at a film by

761
00:57:57.800 --> 00:58:01.119
Podcast at gmail dot com with your
question, comments, and concerns. We

762
00:58:01.199 --> 00:58:05.679
may just read your response on the
show and send you some of my film

763
00:58:05.679 --> 00:58:09.559
by swag. Join us tomorrow for
the return of our Star Trek themed series

764
00:58:09.760 --> 00:58:15.360
Basers Set to stun Scott. It's
been a couple of weeks. What do

765
00:58:15.400 --> 00:58:17.239
you guys got in store for us? Wayne and I are going to be

766
00:58:17.239 --> 00:58:22.199
talking about a twenty eighteen documentary called
What We Left Behind Looking Back at Star

767
00:58:22.280 --> 00:58:27.880
Trek Deep Space nine. That's going
to be a great conversation and a great

768
00:58:27.960 --> 00:58:31.719
primer for when we eventually cover that
in Starter Treks. Well, let me

769
00:58:31.719 --> 00:58:36.679
speak for a lot of our star
trek loving listeners, happy that you guys

770
00:58:36.760 --> 00:58:40.519
are back in Back on the Bridge. On Friday, our limited series nineteen

771
00:58:40.599 --> 00:58:45.199
ninety six returns with our friend Jason
Colvin. We're going to discuss the biggest

772
00:58:45.239 --> 00:58:50.760
film of that year, and it's
the perfect week to do it, talking

773
00:58:50.800 --> 00:58:54.719
about Independence Day. That'll be fantastic. Jason's always a great guest. And

774
00:58:54.800 --> 00:59:00.559
next time on a film by Amber
Lewis, will talk swords fantasy and Matthew

775
00:59:00.559 --> 00:59:04.880
Broderick when we talk about a film
by Richard Donner. To all of you

776
00:59:04.960 --> 00:59:08.599
listening every week, hitting those like
and follow buttons and subscribing to our Patreon,

777
00:59:09.559 --> 00:59:10.079
we thank you.