Sept. 30, 2024

Mike Nichols - Wolf

Mike Nichols - Wolf
Apple Podcasts podcast player badge
Spotify podcast player badge
Goodpods podcast player badge
Pandora podcast player badge
Amazon Music podcast player badge
iHeartRadio podcast player badge
Castbox podcast player badge
Deezer podcast player badge
TuneIn podcast player badge
Podcast Addict podcast player badge
Podchaser podcast player badge
Spreaker podcast player badge
JioSaavn podcast player badge
Castro podcast player badge
RSS Feed podcast player badge
Apple Podcasts podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconGoodpods podcast player iconPandora podcast player iconAmazon Music podcast player iconiHeartRadio podcast player iconCastbox podcast player iconDeezer podcast player iconTuneIn podcast player iconPodcast Addict podcast player iconPodchaser podcast player iconSpreaker podcast player iconJioSaavn podcast player iconCastro podcast player iconRSS Feed podcast player icon
Season 5A Film By...

Amber and Jeff offer their thoughts on the unique blend of horror and dark comedy in Mike Nichols' 1994 romantic horror thriller, Wolf. After suffering a bite from a wolf, Jack Nicholson delivers a primal performance as a man struggling with his identity, dangerous power, and the wildness lurking within each of us!

For exclusive episodes and content, check out A Film By... Podcast on our Patreon with a FREE 7-day trial. You can also sign up as a free member! 

Check out www.afilmbypodcast.com/ for more information.
Email us at afilmbypodcast@gmail.com with your questions, comments, and requests.
Find us on Instagram, X, and Facebook @afilmbypodcast.

WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:03.640
It's October. We've got a lot of spooky stuff for

2
00:00:03.680 --> 00:00:06.519
our listeners this month. So let's jump in with a

3
00:00:06.559 --> 00:00:10.640
movie starring Michelle Pfeiffer dealing with animal attraction.

4
00:00:11.599 --> 00:00:16.000
Amber, we already did that this season. Remember Lady Hawk,

5
00:00:16.800 --> 00:00:18.239
she was in love with the guy who was a

6
00:00:18.280 --> 00:00:19.239
wolf by night.

7
00:00:20.239 --> 00:00:24.440
I'm not talking about Rugger Howard. I'm talking about Jack Nicholson.

8
00:00:25.199 --> 00:00:27.839
Right, So you don't mean the one where she fell

9
00:00:27.879 --> 00:00:30.399
in love with a wolf. You're talking about the one

10
00:00:30.399 --> 00:00:33.520
where she falls for Jack Nicholson. We did that too.

11
00:00:34.320 --> 00:00:36.039
Remember we discussed Whitches of Eastwickers.

12
00:00:36.679 --> 00:00:40.039
Jeff, I'm talking about the one where she falls in

13
00:00:40.159 --> 00:00:44.159
love with a wolf starring Jack Nicholson.

14
00:00:44.560 --> 00:00:48.359
Oh okay, then let's talk about a film by Mike Nichols,

15
00:00:49.079 --> 00:01:19.519
his nineteen ninety four romantic horror film Wolf. Hello everyone,

16
00:01:19.959 --> 00:01:24.680
and welcome back. I'm Jeff Johnson, I'm Amber Lewis, and

17
00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:29.400
this is a film Buy podcast Amber. Before we begin,

18
00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:33.599
I do want to welcome our four new Patreon members

19
00:01:33.760 --> 00:01:39.760
to the Film By Family, Michael Bacsarti, Chuck Brian, Jason

20
00:01:39.840 --> 00:01:44.040
Mack and j El. We are excited to have you

21
00:01:44.120 --> 00:01:46.920
join us on our Patreon page and we look forward

22
00:01:47.040 --> 00:01:48.519
to interacting with each of you.

23
00:01:49.239 --> 00:01:51.599
Welcome friends, Yeah.

24
00:01:51.359 --> 00:01:53.280
And listen. If you want to join the fun like

25
00:01:53.319 --> 00:01:57.519
these guys, all you need is an email address. And

26
00:01:57.560 --> 00:02:00.480
that's for the free membership, because Amber, we're doing we

27
00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:02.319
do a couple free episodes a month, and we do

28
00:02:03.200 --> 00:02:07.079
then we have the exclusive stuff, right, yes, and that

29
00:02:07.120 --> 00:02:09.280
costs you for as little as three dollars a month.

30
00:02:09.479 --> 00:02:12.000
You can get in on all of it. But let's

31
00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:14.639
get to it. Amber. I want to talk about Wolf.

32
00:02:15.039 --> 00:02:19.000
And I'm a little worried about your synopsis because the

33
00:02:19.080 --> 00:02:21.319
last one you gave me on the text thread was,

34
00:02:21.560 --> 00:02:25.080
and I'm quoting here, it's a film you'll watch it.

35
00:02:28.240 --> 00:02:30.719
Can you tell us about Mike Nichols Wolf?

36
00:02:34.800 --> 00:02:39.680
Well, the IMDb synopsis is about that succinct. It just

37
00:02:39.680 --> 00:02:43.840
says publisher Will Randall becomes a demon wolf and has

38
00:02:43.879 --> 00:02:46.639
to fight to keep his job demon wolf.

39
00:02:46.759 --> 00:02:48.879
Did you notice. I mean, let's let's call it what

40
00:02:48.919 --> 00:02:51.680
it is. This is a werewolf movie. And yes, at

41
00:02:51.719 --> 00:02:54.599
no point during this movie, and I've watched it many

42
00:02:54.599 --> 00:02:56.960
many times, at no point do they ever use the

43
00:02:57.000 --> 00:03:00.520
word werewolf, which I can kind of.

44
00:03:00.520 --> 00:03:03.719
Like because it you know, where wolf can be a

45
00:03:03.759 --> 00:03:06.120
little it can feel melodramatic?

46
00:03:06.840 --> 00:03:10.080
Does it does it give this film a little more gravitas?

47
00:03:10.120 --> 00:03:11.560
Like does it make it a little more real that

48
00:03:11.599 --> 00:03:14.680
people aren't using the term wolf man or where wolf?

49
00:03:14.840 --> 00:03:15.159
You think?

50
00:03:16.000 --> 00:03:19.360
I think so because I'll be honest, I hadn't watched

51
00:03:19.400 --> 00:03:24.080
this since it first came out. So it came out

52
00:03:24.120 --> 00:03:27.599
on on DVD or video or whatever, and I watched it,

53
00:03:28.360 --> 00:03:31.280
and I haven't watched it since, so I had like

54
00:03:31.400 --> 00:03:33.280
almost no memory of anything.

55
00:03:33.479 --> 00:03:34.520
Whoa no memory?

56
00:03:34.599 --> 00:03:37.800
Okay, Yeah, Like I literally was like watching it for

57
00:03:37.800 --> 00:03:40.639
the first time. So the whole time in the beginning,

58
00:03:40.719 --> 00:03:44.000
I was kind of like, is it's Mike Nichols, Like

59
00:03:44.159 --> 00:03:48.000
is the wolf thing a metaphor? Like is he really

60
00:03:48.039 --> 00:03:50.919
gonna turn a top wolf? Is it some kind of

61
00:03:51.000 --> 00:03:54.560
psychological thing? Like what is happening? But I liked how

62
00:03:54.639 --> 00:03:57.080
it played out where like you weren't really sure are

63
00:03:57.080 --> 00:04:01.639
we watching something supernatural or we just you know, watching

64
00:04:01.680 --> 00:04:03.280
a guy go through a mid life crisis.

65
00:04:03.639 --> 00:04:05.800
Yeah. Well there's even moments in the in the scene

66
00:04:05.800 --> 00:04:08.360
like there's a moment where Michelle Pfeifer's character tells him

67
00:04:08.360 --> 00:04:10.520
like you might have a brain tumor, Like, yeah, you're

68
00:04:10.719 --> 00:04:14.680
you're symptomatic. Let's get in my rye before we Yeah,

69
00:04:14.879 --> 00:04:16.639
he's like, oh, I wish I had that, and she's

70
00:04:16.680 --> 00:04:21.959
like yeah, I mean wow, let's jump into this one.

71
00:04:22.720 --> 00:04:28.839
Jack Nicholson playing editor in chief Will Randall Amber this

72
00:04:28.879 --> 00:04:30.839
is This is a bit of a passion project for Jack.

73
00:04:31.639 --> 00:04:35.360
He gets final say on who directs the film, and

74
00:04:35.399 --> 00:04:39.680
Mike Nichols is his only choice, which makes this their

75
00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:41.279
fourth and final collaboration.

76
00:04:41.959 --> 00:04:45.600
I was gonna say it wasn't surprising because they work

77
00:04:45.680 --> 00:04:50.600
so well together. But I love Jack's performance in this.

78
00:04:50.759 --> 00:04:55.279
He is amazing, so like subtle and he's kind of

79
00:04:55.319 --> 00:04:58.399
playing like a schlove at the beginning. But it's not

80
00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:05.000
real forced comedic, you know, like the guy who spills

81
00:05:05.040 --> 00:05:07.199
coffee on his tie, you know, and stuff like that.

82
00:05:07.279 --> 00:05:12.399
It's just real life world Weary's.

83
00:05:10.920 --> 00:05:13.600
A bit of a sad sack. Yeah. Yeah, he's kind

84
00:05:13.600 --> 00:05:16.519
of burned out, kind of down on his luck.

85
00:05:17.120 --> 00:05:19.279
Grass making these changes at work. Then.

86
00:05:19.439 --> 00:05:21.439
Yeah, he's about out.

87
00:05:21.279 --> 00:05:23.240
The door for a younger guy.

88
00:05:23.519 --> 00:05:26.279
Yeah. Before we get too deep into this, I do

89
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:30.720
we got to talk about the wolf makeup because we're

90
00:05:30.800 --> 00:05:35.399
talking about special makeup effects. Legend Rick Baker, He's the

91
00:05:35.399 --> 00:05:39.439
guy responsible am or he makes an informed decision to

92
00:05:39.560 --> 00:05:44.079
kind of take inspiration from famous creature makeup artist of

93
00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:47.920
the nineteen thirties and forties, Jack P. Pierce, who worked

94
00:05:47.920 --> 00:05:50.040
on all the Universal Monster movies. And when you when

95
00:05:50.040 --> 00:05:53.279
you see how Jack looks, when you see how how

96
00:05:53.480 --> 00:05:57.519
James Spader looks, it's definitely got like that Wolfman of

97
00:05:57.560 --> 00:06:00.639
London feel too, and it's got that old skill.

98
00:06:00.720 --> 00:06:04.439
It made me think of the Spencer Tracy version of

99
00:06:04.519 --> 00:06:11.720
Jacqueline Hyde where they did his transformation. Yeah, the makeup

100
00:06:11.839 --> 00:06:15.000
was very reminiscent of that because they didn't go too

101
00:06:15.279 --> 00:06:18.759
over the top with the hide makeup in that movie.

102
00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:23.319
Yeah. Did you happen upon the funny story that, uh,

103
00:06:23.720 --> 00:06:27.120
that Rick Baker has doing doing makeup for Jack Nicholson?

104
00:06:27.160 --> 00:06:27.800
Did you see that?

105
00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:31.079
Are you talking about the spirit gum story?

106
00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:33.839
Yes, tell me about the spirit gum story.

107
00:06:34.360 --> 00:06:38.439
The story that I read was that Jack had of

108
00:06:38.480 --> 00:06:44.920
course famously done special effects makeup before for the Jokers,

109
00:06:45.040 --> 00:06:48.680
so he knew that he was allergic to spirit gum,

110
00:06:48.680 --> 00:06:51.920
and he told Rick Baker this, well, you don't really

111
00:06:52.480 --> 00:06:55.920
like spirit gum. It's not very It's effective, but not comfortable,

112
00:06:56.800 --> 00:06:59.360
sir Rick Baker was like, ah, he's just winging like

113
00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:04.639
fine and used it anyway, And I think maybe there

114
00:07:04.680 --> 00:07:06.439
was like a mistake there too, like you grab the

115
00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:10.839
wrong thing or something. Yeah, deliberately like use it. But anyway,

116
00:07:10.920 --> 00:07:13.120
Jack comes in the next day with like a horrible

117
00:07:13.240 --> 00:07:15.439
rash and he was just I could just hear his

118
00:07:15.519 --> 00:07:19.720
voice go like, yeah, he is the spirit, didn't you?

119
00:07:20.240 --> 00:07:26.160
Yeah to get I'm so sorry, yeah, causing Ricky boy, Yeah,

120
00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:30.279
Ricky boy, you use the spirit yea, yeah, because because

121
00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:34.800
Baker had some medical adhesive which takes a lot longer,

122
00:07:34.920 --> 00:07:37.560
does not work as well. And what I what I'd

123
00:07:37.560 --> 00:07:42.160
read about was he did mistakenly use the James Spader spirit. Gum.

124
00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:43.079
Oh is that what it was?

125
00:07:45.519 --> 00:07:47.560
Yeah? Well, and what do you do when Jack Nicholson

126
00:07:47.600 --> 00:07:49.560
walks in with a swollen red face.

127
00:07:49.519 --> 00:07:50.360
That's what I'm saying.

128
00:07:50.879 --> 00:07:54.680
All you do apologize.

129
00:07:53.360 --> 00:07:56.839
Like Jack from the Shining like coming in like darling,

130
00:07:57.759 --> 00:08:00.199
like my life.

131
00:08:00.639 --> 00:08:05.839
Yeah, you know, Rick Baker is apologizing profusely, and Jack

132
00:08:05.959 --> 00:08:08.879
just says, let's not happen. Let's not let it happen again.

133
00:08:11.279 --> 00:08:13.279
You're probably gonna be very careful with the spirit. Come

134
00:08:13.319 --> 00:08:15.920
at that point, Oh my god, yes, Now I love

135
00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:18.639
Jack's performance in this This is this was It's one

136
00:08:18.639 --> 00:08:22.839
of my favorite Jack Nicholson performances probably. But let's talk

137
00:08:22.879 --> 00:08:26.720
about Michelle Pfeiffer. She's playing Laura Alden.

138
00:08:27.560 --> 00:08:30.360
Okay, I have thoughts. Are we doing spoilers?

139
00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:33.279
Yeah, this movie's been on since ninety four. We can

140
00:08:34.360 --> 00:08:35.080
one double.

141
00:08:34.919 --> 00:08:38.639
Check she percent is the wolf that bit him in

142
00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:39.120
the beginning.

143
00:08:39.840 --> 00:08:42.000
Well, hold on, just okay, settle down.

144
00:08:42.399 --> 00:08:45.120
Like I was blown away when we got to the

145
00:08:45.200 --> 00:08:45.639
end of the movie.

146
00:08:45.639 --> 00:08:49.720
I was like I had I had a theory that

147
00:08:49.759 --> 00:08:51.080
I was gonna try and wow you with.

148
00:08:51.440 --> 00:08:52.600
Oh I'm so sorry.

149
00:08:52.919 --> 00:08:56.559
No, no, yeah, well listen, you are astute. Let's kick that.

150
00:08:56.639 --> 00:08:59.559
Let's kick that down the road for a minute. We'll

151
00:08:59.559 --> 00:09:04.159
get to that. But before we get to that, so

152
00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:09.799
let's talk about the role of Laura Alden. Sharon Stone says, no, no,

153
00:09:09.919 --> 00:09:13.679
thank you. A nett binning also turns it down.

154
00:09:14.440 --> 00:09:16.360
I think a net betting might have been interesting.

155
00:09:17.240 --> 00:09:19.639
I definitely think a net binning would have been interesting.

156
00:09:21.200 --> 00:09:22.639
I could, I can, and I can definitely see her

157
00:09:22.639 --> 00:09:27.799
having chemistry with Jack, but ultimately it's it's a miss Pfeiffer.

158
00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:32.679
She asks for the part because after Batman returns in

159
00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:36.360
the Age of Innocence, she didn't want to do another accent,

160
00:09:36.919 --> 00:09:39.519
didn't want to put on a wig, didn't want to

161
00:09:39.519 --> 00:09:43.200
put on another corset, and instead just wanted to do

162
00:09:43.279 --> 00:09:47.480
something more modern, And on top of that, she just

163
00:09:47.559 --> 00:09:52.240
wanted to work with Nicholson again and Mike Nichols. So yeah,

164
00:09:52.440 --> 00:09:56.039
it's I'm looking. I'm looking at my notes, Amber, and

165
00:09:56.159 --> 00:09:58.639
my next note, I just I'm gonna read it to you.

166
00:09:59.320 --> 00:10:00.720
I have a theory I want to throw at you

167
00:10:00.759 --> 00:10:02.759
about her character, but I'll save it for later. So

168
00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:06.159
I love the fact that you're like, are we talking spoilers? Sure,

169
00:10:07.080 --> 00:10:12.879
she's the word right to the end. Yeah, yeah, Amber Lewis,

170
00:10:13.039 --> 00:10:17.240
it's a film. You'll watch it and then closing credits.

171
00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:20.279
And then at the end. Yeah, everyone does at the end.

172
00:10:24.039 --> 00:10:27.720
But I think it you're blown away at the end

173
00:10:27.879 --> 00:10:33.159
if you make that connection, just because there was nothing

174
00:10:33.159 --> 00:10:36.960
to really hint at it before. But if you look

175
00:10:37.000 --> 00:10:40.639
at her performance and the character that she develops, this

176
00:10:40.759 --> 00:10:45.480
is Michelle Pfiffer being very like, very hard and kind

177
00:10:45.519 --> 00:10:51.159
of aggressive, and you know she doesn't fall for all

178
00:10:51.200 --> 00:10:55.720
of Jack's charm right away. You know, she's kind of

179
00:10:55.720 --> 00:10:59.519
holding everybody at a distance, So that could you know,

180
00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:03.519
into that idea of you know, she's an alpha predator

181
00:11:03.559 --> 00:11:05.559
that just kind of does her own thing, and.

182
00:11:06.279 --> 00:11:08.519
Well, we're gonna we're doing it now because I got

183
00:11:08.519 --> 00:11:09.519
I got thoughts too.

184
00:11:09.519 --> 00:11:11.559
So sorry, I can't. I can't stay away from it

185
00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:13.600
because it blew my mind when we got to the

186
00:11:13.720 --> 00:11:14.279
end of the movie.

187
00:11:15.200 --> 00:11:17.720
No, no, I'm totally cool with it. Let's let's do this.

188
00:11:18.639 --> 00:11:22.720
Here's the thing. At no point is she ever bitten,

189
00:11:23.440 --> 00:11:27.919
not by Jack, not by James Spader. So it would

190
00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:30.440
make sense because we know at the end of this film,

191
00:11:30.519 --> 00:11:33.519
you know she has the eyes, she's we got that

192
00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:39.080
weird tracking through the through the the wilderness type of shot,

193
00:11:39.080 --> 00:11:43.440
whether she's clearly a wolf or she's about to become one.

194
00:11:44.120 --> 00:11:46.879
I had just a little bit of a like, wait

195
00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:51.759
a minute kind of moment when they had their their

196
00:11:51.799 --> 00:11:52.519
love scene.

197
00:11:52.960 --> 00:11:53.799
Yeah, and.

198
00:11:55.200 --> 00:11:58.200
She sort of rolls towards him in bed and you

199
00:11:58.240 --> 00:12:01.080
can see her naked back and she has this like

200
00:12:01.600 --> 00:12:04.440
tattoo on our shoulder, like on our shoulder blade.

201
00:12:04.600 --> 00:12:07.240
Uh huh, yeah, right shoulder, and.

202
00:12:07.519 --> 00:12:10.200
I that just triggered me for some reason. I was like,

203
00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:14.120
that means that is what's going on. So I kind

204
00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:17.200
of feel like maybe that was a clue or something like.

205
00:12:17.399 --> 00:12:19.679
See now, now you got me wanting to watch Michelle

206
00:12:19.679 --> 00:12:23.159
Feiffer movies to see if that's if that's actually like, oh,

207
00:12:23.279 --> 00:12:26.240
Michelle Pfiffer got a tattoo on spring or if it's

208
00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:27.440
something because what I had.

209
00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:28.519
To google it, but like.

210
00:12:29.360 --> 00:12:32.360
A spider or yeah, something was something a little on

211
00:12:32.399 --> 00:12:32.720
this like.

212
00:12:32.720 --> 00:12:35.399
I could see her having a tattoo, but probably not

213
00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:37.120
that I don't know.

214
00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:41.080
It's interesting, but listen, I mean, the only way she

215
00:12:42.519 --> 00:12:45.320
becomes a wolf in the middle of this movie would

216
00:12:45.320 --> 00:12:47.879
be the love scene, which I've never all the werewolf

217
00:12:47.879 --> 00:12:50.200
movies I've seen, I don't think getting busy with the

218
00:12:50.200 --> 00:12:51.960
wolf man necessarily turns you into werewolf.

219
00:12:52.000 --> 00:12:57.080
You have to be. So there is a pretty significant

220
00:12:57.159 --> 00:13:01.840
gap between you know, her kind of bidding him farewell

221
00:13:02.279 --> 00:13:07.159
at the end, and then the kind of epilogue of

222
00:13:07.200 --> 00:13:09.679
the cops showing up and her dad's showing up and

223
00:13:10.120 --> 00:13:12.320
she comes out of the house and she looks completely different,

224
00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:14.720
like she had time, even if she wasn't aware of

225
00:13:14.840 --> 00:13:18.159
she had time to shower, change her clothes, put on makeup,

226
00:13:18.240 --> 00:13:18.919
do her hair.

227
00:13:18.919 --> 00:13:21.720
Like, Oh, she comes out in the slinky, like all

228
00:13:21.759 --> 00:13:24.320
black outfit where she looks like she's about to, you know,

229
00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:26.600
do some mission impossible break in shit.

230
00:13:27.600 --> 00:13:32.519
Yeah, so you know, there was definitely time for Jack

231
00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:33.919
to be like, you want to come with me?

232
00:13:34.559 --> 00:13:38.960
And Okay, so you're you're saying maybe off off camera, yeah,

233
00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:41.159
you know, maybe he gives her a little I.

234
00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:45.120
Don't think so. I think that was a huge reveal. No.

235
00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:49.679
I you know, you can support a few a theory,

236
00:13:49.720 --> 00:13:51.720
you can refute a theory. You can't prove a theory.

237
00:13:51.759 --> 00:13:56.879
But I'm supporting the theory. Michelle Pfeiffer was the wolf

238
00:13:57.600 --> 00:13:59.559
in Vermont that bites him at the beginning, because there.

239
00:13:59.480 --> 00:14:00.919
Was a whole them too.

240
00:14:01.639 --> 00:14:02.120
Mm hmmm.

241
00:14:02.320 --> 00:14:04.360
Like I thought that was gonna be the Spader reveal.

242
00:14:04.440 --> 00:14:07.559
I kind of forgot that Jack bit him, yep. And

243
00:14:07.639 --> 00:14:10.120
I thought the reveal was going to be at some

244
00:14:10.159 --> 00:14:12.000
point we were gonna find out like they were all

245
00:14:12.039 --> 00:14:16.399
fucking vampires or were wolves and you know, like Christopher

246
00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:18.919
Plummer was one and like it was a whole coven

247
00:14:19.039 --> 00:14:19.480
kind of thing.

248
00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:22.799
Oh, that wouldn't have worked for me at all. I'm glad.

249
00:14:22.919 --> 00:14:26.039
I'm glad it's a pack with that wolf that he hit.

250
00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:28.720
There were several of them in the in the forest.

251
00:14:28.759 --> 00:14:33.679
And let's not forget she kinda is, uh, the black

252
00:14:33.679 --> 00:14:36.679
sheep of the family. She's gone for long periods of time.

253
00:14:36.840 --> 00:14:39.159
She kind of she's kind of a drifter. She shows

254
00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:42.519
up whenever she wants to, and she purposely takes like

255
00:14:42.559 --> 00:14:45.480
the guest house, which is like a country mile from

256
00:14:45.519 --> 00:14:49.279
like Christopher Plumber is a state. So I don't know.

257
00:14:49.320 --> 00:14:51.799
I think I think she's I think she's a she wolf.

258
00:14:52.440 --> 00:14:56.279
But you mentioned Spader. Jace Spader playing Stuart Swinton. He

259
00:14:56.399 --> 00:15:01.960
is the protege of Jack's character. I I am a

260
00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:05.720
longtime fan of Spader. Yes, I think he rules. You know,

261
00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:08.960
I'm talking eighty Spader where I get it. You know,

262
00:15:09.080 --> 00:15:11.559
he perceivingly plays a jerk in some of some of

263
00:15:11.559 --> 00:15:14.360
the movies he does. But he's just too cool, you know. Yes,

264
00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:18.080
he's a little bit he's a little bit of a

265
00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:20.000
cad in this he's a little kind of he's kind

266
00:15:20.000 --> 00:15:22.960
of sniveling. I mean, I know he needs to be

267
00:15:23.159 --> 00:15:25.759
and I like, I like him in this, but this

268
00:15:25.840 --> 00:15:28.320
is not cool Spader, at least until he wolves out

269
00:15:28.360 --> 00:15:31.200
at the end. Then he's yeah, he's very cool Spader,

270
00:15:31.240 --> 00:15:35.759
but he's also a little invasion of your personal space.

271
00:15:36.600 --> 00:15:41.080
Yeah, you know what I'm doing that scene with Michelle Pfeiffer,

272
00:15:41.159 --> 00:15:42.919
I was like physically gagging.

273
00:15:44.279 --> 00:15:45.879
He's a little too close, isn't he?

274
00:15:46.120 --> 00:15:49.440
Like she played it so cool and like held it

275
00:15:49.519 --> 00:15:50.799
together so well, and I.

276
00:15:50.759 --> 00:15:55.120
Was just like, oh, well, just and I haven't watched

277
00:15:55.159 --> 00:15:58.000
this in a while, so I forgot that he's a

278
00:15:58.039 --> 00:16:00.519
little bit of a close talker in that moment, which

279
00:16:00.559 --> 00:16:02.879
he needs to be because now he's you know, he's

280
00:16:02.919 --> 00:16:07.840
the intimidating Spader, he's the threatening Spader. Yes, but the

281
00:16:07.879 --> 00:16:12.399
whole sniffing at her down below was I was like, whoa,

282
00:16:12.639 --> 00:16:16.000
I forgot all about that, And you're right, she she

283
00:16:16.159 --> 00:16:19.200
knows the situation that she's in and for her to

284
00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:22.120
play it as cool as she does, I thought it's

285
00:16:22.159 --> 00:16:23.320
a great moment for her character.

286
00:16:23.799 --> 00:16:25.960
Well, and I liked it that she didn't just kind

287
00:16:25.960 --> 00:16:29.399
of she wasn't just a damsel in distress in that moment,

288
00:16:29.559 --> 00:16:34.440
like she was kicked him in the face and smack.

289
00:16:35.960 --> 00:16:40.080
She's not the damsel or something. Yeah. I liked She's

290
00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:45.159
a fighter. I love her character. I love James Spader's character,

291
00:16:45.519 --> 00:16:47.679
just the fact that you know, you you know, you're like, oh, okay,

292
00:16:47.639 --> 00:16:50.600
he's an ally. Then we find out he's a backstabber,

293
00:16:51.480 --> 00:16:54.879
and then he's a shit shitty friend. Right.

294
00:16:54.960 --> 00:16:57.960
I mean, I love the scene in the bathroom. That

295
00:16:58.360 --> 00:16:59.200
was so funny.

296
00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:01.080
We're gonna get to that. We're gonna get to that.

297
00:17:01.320 --> 00:17:04.319
You put it in in that one. Okay. Uh more

298
00:17:04.359 --> 00:17:08.559
on this cast, let's suh. Kate Nelligan is playing Will's

299
00:17:08.920 --> 00:17:09.839
wife Charlotte.

300
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:10.480
Mm hmm.

301
00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:14.880
I've never seen her before. And interesting fact here, yeah

302
00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:17.319
I have. Where have I seen her?

303
00:17:17.640 --> 00:17:20.519
Have you seen the Franklin Jella Dracula?

304
00:17:21.079 --> 00:17:27.039
Of course it's awesome and she's in it. Mina, Okay, yeah,

305
00:17:27.240 --> 00:17:28.160
I completely.

306
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:31.279
Forgot yep, And then a ton of things like you've

307
00:17:31.319 --> 00:17:32.319
seen her and stuff, you just.

308
00:17:32.240 --> 00:17:34.559
Aren't that Dracula. That's seventy nine, that's it's celebrating its

309
00:17:34.559 --> 00:17:36.000
forty fifth anniversary this year.

310
00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:38.400
I love that. My mom and I call that the

311
00:17:38.480 --> 00:17:42.240
sexy Dracula is so hot.

312
00:17:42.079 --> 00:17:47.160
That Jella is hot, Amber, Amber, you were talking about

313
00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:50.039
about Jack Nicholson being hot in the Witches of Ea Stuee.

314
00:17:50.119 --> 00:17:54.279
Now now we got sexy Franklin, Jella and Dracula. Yeah,

315
00:17:55.000 --> 00:18:03.960
I'm wondering here. I oh boy. Mia Farrow initially has

316
00:18:04.000 --> 00:18:06.880
this role and has to drop out due to scheduling

317
00:18:06.880 --> 00:18:09.759
conflicts arising from the Woody Allen scandal.

318
00:18:10.599 --> 00:18:13.640
Uh, which I think is a disappointment. I really like

319
00:18:13.720 --> 00:18:15.799
her as an actress, so I think she would have

320
00:18:15.839 --> 00:18:16.319
been fine.

321
00:18:16.599 --> 00:18:17.920
I think she would have been great. But you know,

322
00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:18.440
I think.

323
00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:21.680
It's not much of a of a character, like I

324
00:18:21.720 --> 00:18:25.119
don't really understand why she was cheating on him, well,

325
00:18:25.200 --> 00:18:27.440
rather than just because.

326
00:18:27.880 --> 00:18:31.240
I would say that she was an opportunist, but I

327
00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:33.000
think there's that that that you know they're having that

328
00:18:33.039 --> 00:18:35.279
like the little dinner and she's talking. It sounds like

329
00:18:35.319 --> 00:18:39.799
she either she's a doctor or she's a pharmaceutical executive

330
00:18:39.799 --> 00:18:42.519
who's talking to journalists. She's a journalist.

331
00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:43.680
She's a journalist.

332
00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:44.759
I missed that.

333
00:18:44.799 --> 00:18:48.680
Then, Yeah, she wanted the story about oh that's what

334
00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:52.920
it was, like a science breakthrough and they put her

335
00:18:52.920 --> 00:18:57.799
on a story about like a breast cancer medication or something.

336
00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:01.839
Yeah you understand. Yeah, okay, that makes sense. That also

337
00:19:01.880 --> 00:19:03.680
makes sense why they'd be together then, because he's the

338
00:19:03.799 --> 00:19:08.119
editor of the publishing house, so okay, all right. Speaking

339
00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:12.599
of the publishing house, First off, you can't not notice

340
00:19:12.720 --> 00:19:15.680
that that that publishing house. The offices are the Bradbury Building,

341
00:19:16.160 --> 00:19:17.000
which is awesome.

342
00:19:17.880 --> 00:19:21.559
That whole interior is just breathtaking.

343
00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:27.400
I will always associate that building with Blade Runner. However,

344
00:19:28.400 --> 00:19:30.240
I mean it's been used time and time again in

345
00:19:30.319 --> 00:19:35.599
TV movies, music videos. Just just digging around about this building,

346
00:19:35.799 --> 00:19:38.559
I found out it's a National Historic Site and they

347
00:19:38.599 --> 00:19:40.880
actually do tours. So the next time I'm heading to California,

348
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:42.200
You're heading to California.

349
00:19:41.799 --> 00:19:44.160
Soon add to my list.

350
00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:47.319
We add that to your list. Take some photos at

351
00:19:47.319 --> 00:19:50.440
Will Randall's office for us, because I think would be awesome.

352
00:19:51.119 --> 00:19:53.880
But Christopher Plummer, he's playing Raymond Alden. He's the new

353
00:19:54.759 --> 00:19:58.359
owner of the publishing house. He's he's the one making

354
00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:02.880
changes ambers. Speaking of changes that you wouldn't like. Initially,

355
00:20:03.880 --> 00:20:08.720
Marlon Brando was interested in this role. He would so

356
00:20:08.799 --> 00:20:11.839
far as to tell the producers, Hey, I think I

357
00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:15.039
want this, But they weren't interested in Brando. It was

358
00:20:15.079 --> 00:20:17.160
Plumber from from the get go.

359
00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:20.519
I mean, I love Christopher Plumber. I'm totally fine with this.

360
00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:24.200
Here's the thing, he I'm not gonna say, he's the

361
00:20:24.279 --> 00:20:25.319
villain of the film.

362
00:20:25.920 --> 00:20:29.480
But he's he's definitely the hinge.

363
00:20:29.720 --> 00:20:35.640
Yeah, he's he's certainly an adversary. Yes, he's so damn charming.

364
00:20:36.519 --> 00:20:38.720
You have to like it, right, I love I love

365
00:20:38.759 --> 00:20:44.079
Christopher Plumber the whole time, even though he's up he's well, yeah.

366
00:20:43.839 --> 00:20:46.160
He's more. I don't know that he's a villain. He's

367
00:20:46.160 --> 00:20:50.240
just very self involved. So he's very focused on his

368
00:20:50.359 --> 00:20:53.240
publishing house and what he wants to make it successful.

369
00:20:53.359 --> 00:20:58.400
And if that is, you know, hurtful to people losing

370
00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:01.680
their jobs, he's like, eh, well that's life, you know.

371
00:21:01.759 --> 00:21:05.279
So he's heartless. But he's very charming, is he is?

372
00:21:05.319 --> 00:21:08.640
He's charming? Is he is the perfect word for his

373
00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:11.799
performance in this He's he's a debonair man and he's charming.

374
00:21:12.000 --> 00:21:14.599
And I only wish we could add more scenes with him.

375
00:21:14.920 --> 00:21:17.920
Yes, yeah, I wanted a whole lot more of him.

376
00:21:18.359 --> 00:21:19.920
There were a lot of people. I mean, for this

377
00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:22.319
movie being two hours, which I definitely feel like they

378
00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:26.359
could have cut like thirty min's out, but there were

379
00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:27.920
characters that I wanted more of.

380
00:21:28.720 --> 00:21:32.039
Well, let's talk about one of those characters. David Hyde

381
00:21:32.039 --> 00:21:37.640
Pierce Old beloved Niles Crane. He's playing Roy, who isn't

382
00:21:37.880 --> 00:21:41.359
Will Randall's protege. But but is it feels.

383
00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:42.880
Like definitely more loyal to him.

384
00:21:43.079 --> 00:21:44.079
Oh, he's certainly loyal.

385
00:21:44.839 --> 00:21:46.079
Spader is like.

386
00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:50.640
Yeah, I think David Hyde Pierce gives this film a

387
00:21:50.680 --> 00:21:54.200
certain levity, like like I smile, I'm smiling when he

388
00:21:54.279 --> 00:21:56.359
when he's on the camp, when he's on the scene. Yeah,

389
00:21:56.440 --> 00:21:59.119
you know, because he just has these these quick little

390
00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:04.160
quips where he's he's enamored with Jack, you know, with

391
00:22:04.200 --> 00:22:07.400
Will Randall. But also, like you said, he's loyal, he's not.

392
00:22:07.559 --> 00:22:11.519
He's not a cartoon character of any sort. He's he's

393
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:14.640
just you know, he's smart, he's he's fun. And this

394
00:22:14.680 --> 00:22:16.279
would be the one I would have wanted to see

395
00:22:16.279 --> 00:22:16.920
a lot more of him.

396
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:18.240
Yeah, we could for sure.

397
00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:22.279
How about uh, you know, we're talking Frasier. Uh for

398
00:22:22.319 --> 00:22:24.240
a quick second, how about Alison Janney.

399
00:22:24.880 --> 00:22:29.559
She didn't like her film and the second like we go,

400
00:22:29.799 --> 00:22:32.519
we fade to black, and then we're fading in on

401
00:22:32.519 --> 00:22:36.319
this party and you hear her voice before you see her,

402
00:22:36.720 --> 00:22:39.480
and I love the West Wing so much and love

403
00:22:39.559 --> 00:22:42.160
her so much. The second I heard her voice, I

404
00:22:42.200 --> 00:22:44.440
was like, Alison what, Oh.

405
00:22:44.359 --> 00:22:47.039
Yeah, I had the same feeling. It's like, wait a mane, Alison,

406
00:22:47.079 --> 00:22:49.960
Jeanie's not in this. Uh there she is? She isn't it?

407
00:22:50.720 --> 00:22:53.960
And again back to Christopher Plumber being just so charming.

408
00:22:54.039 --> 00:22:57.079
She has some kind of odd ball statement and he

409
00:22:57.240 --> 00:23:01.440
just kind of kind of gives her the okay whatever,

410
00:23:01.599 --> 00:23:01.799
you know.

411
00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:05.119
But like you could tell she was melting even as

412
00:23:05.359 --> 00:23:07.240
he said, he kind of like blows her off.

413
00:23:07.400 --> 00:23:09.400
He try to rushes off and then she's like, oh

414
00:23:09.440 --> 00:23:10.920
he's so I'm.

415
00:23:10.720 --> 00:23:15.839
Like I'm like yeah, same, just same. I'm here.

416
00:23:16.559 --> 00:23:19.599
Yeah, I'll tell you what. Let's let's take a quick

417
00:23:19.599 --> 00:23:22.119
break and when we get back we can talk a

418
00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:28.519
little bit about this film's background. Welcome back. We are

419
00:23:28.559 --> 00:23:33.880
talking about Mike nichols nineteen ninety four demon wolf film

420
00:23:34.119 --> 00:23:39.519
Amber Wolf, So we kind of talked about this would

421
00:23:39.559 --> 00:23:41.119
This was a little bit of a passion project for

422
00:23:41.200 --> 00:23:45.079
Jack Nicholson. He spends twelve years trying to get this

423
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:50.400
into production with his friend, author Jim Harrison, who, if

424
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:53.200
the name sounds familiar, this is the guy that wrote

425
00:23:53.359 --> 00:23:57.599
Legends of the Fall. He wrote Revenge, which we covered

426
00:23:58.400 --> 00:24:03.160
gosh back in our second season. Ultimately the studio feels

427
00:24:03.160 --> 00:24:06.720
Harrison's script is a little too detailed and reads like

428
00:24:06.759 --> 00:24:10.599
a novel, which is not what you want to say

429
00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:14.440
to Jim Harrison. So he gets a little upset, he

430
00:24:14.559 --> 00:24:18.799
leaves the project, and because of this experience, he leaves

431
00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:20.839
Hollywood never comes back.

432
00:24:21.680 --> 00:24:24.680
I mean, that's just I saw that criticism and I

433
00:24:24.759 --> 00:24:29.279
kind of didn't get it. It's kind of well, like, OK,

434
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:32.759
does that mean that studio producers just don't have the attention.

435
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:35.519
Span to maybe I don't know.

436
00:24:35.559 --> 00:24:38.000
Maybe they were saying it was like six hundred pages

437
00:24:38.039 --> 00:24:42.759
and completely unproducible, like yeah, you know, it was more

438
00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:45.400
the structure. It sounded like they had a problem with him. Like, guys,

439
00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:46.279
you can work around this.

440
00:24:46.680 --> 00:24:49.400
I would love to get a look at the original

441
00:24:49.960 --> 00:24:55.759
script and see what Harrison was doing. At any rate,

442
00:24:56.640 --> 00:24:59.720
Wesley Strick is called in to punch it up. Now.

443
00:24:59.799 --> 00:25:02.480
I bring this up because one of his suggestions is

444
00:25:02.519 --> 00:25:06.400
to change the role of Raymond Olden, who is played

445
00:25:06.400 --> 00:25:11.079
by Christopher Plummer. His thought is, let's make that character

446
00:25:11.319 --> 00:25:15.319
her brother instead of her father. And this info is

447
00:25:15.319 --> 00:25:18.519
out there, it's being gossiped in Hollywood. You know, people

448
00:25:18.519 --> 00:25:21.240
are talking and it probably wouldn't have been a big

449
00:25:21.240 --> 00:25:24.319
deal if someone didn't show up to the studio and

450
00:25:24.359 --> 00:25:28.720
interrupt the production meeting asking for a meeting to discuss

451
00:25:28.799 --> 00:25:31.559
playing the brother Amber. Do you do you do you

452
00:25:31.599 --> 00:25:32.599
know who I'm talking about?

453
00:25:32.920 --> 00:25:39.119
Yes, only Mick Jagger walk a lot and be like

454
00:25:39.519 --> 00:25:41.240
I want to have a mating.

455
00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:47.240
Yeah. The Rolling Stones just showed up and you know,

456
00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:50.000
it's like, hey, I think I could do this, and

457
00:25:50.039 --> 00:25:53.079
the producers were like, I'm not telling him. You know,

458
00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:56.160
they look at him, they look at Wesley Strick. They're like,

459
00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:58.640
this was your idea to make him a brother and

460
00:25:58.680 --> 00:26:00.920
we're not doing that. So you go tell him. Could

461
00:26:00.960 --> 00:26:04.319
you imagine this guy is like, hey, make a big

462
00:26:04.400 --> 00:26:05.599
fan of.

463
00:26:06.759 --> 00:26:07.200
This word.

464
00:26:07.319 --> 00:26:14.000
Very often, it's gonna be a no. Yeah, tough day

465
00:26:14.039 --> 00:26:18.440
for Wesley Strick. Uh. In the production meetings, there's a

466
00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:20.559
couple of scenes I want to talk about Amber and

467
00:26:20.599 --> 00:26:22.880
I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of combine them. We're gonna

468
00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:26.519
do like little little one for ones here before we

469
00:26:26.519 --> 00:26:29.000
get to the pivotal scene. So first I do want

470
00:26:29.000 --> 00:26:32.519
to talk let's talk, let's talk Jack and Michelle. So

471
00:26:33.599 --> 00:26:36.200
we got the meeting. The the initial meeting with Laura

472
00:26:36.680 --> 00:26:40.720
and then we have lunch with Laura. And I love

473
00:26:41.759 --> 00:26:45.319
how the initial meeting it's a little awkward, it's a

474
00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:49.000
little embarrassing for Jack. He has a little bit, a

475
00:26:49.000 --> 00:26:53.000
little bit of an embarrassing moment, you know. Uh. But

476
00:26:53.119 --> 00:26:56.079
the lunch that he has the PBN J and and

477
00:26:56.079 --> 00:26:58.640
and milk, he is at the top of his game.

478
00:26:58.960 --> 00:27:01.599
He's he's kind of it's kind of checking her here.

479
00:27:01.680 --> 00:27:03.279
So can we can we talk about these two scenes.

480
00:27:04.119 --> 00:27:05.559
I'd love to hear I'd love to hear your thoughts

481
00:27:05.599 --> 00:27:08.799
on on her character and how she handles.

482
00:27:08.519 --> 00:27:13.039
Herself well in hindsight, you know, as we're talking about this,

483
00:27:13.039 --> 00:27:18.160
this theory that she was was always a werewolf. The

484
00:27:18.200 --> 00:27:21.960
scene where they first meet, I think could show that

485
00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:26.200
very well because she has to know what he's going through.

486
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:30.400
She like is right there with what he needs, hands him,

487
00:27:30.519 --> 00:27:33.240
you know, a glass of scotch and so here, take this.

488
00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:36.960
I'll make you feel better. You know, she talks him down.

489
00:27:37.720 --> 00:27:43.599
She's very like empathetic and understanding and even though it

490
00:27:43.680 --> 00:27:46.400
is a little a masculating for him, she gets him

491
00:27:46.400 --> 00:27:49.200
through it. You know, she's a good partner in that

492
00:27:49.920 --> 00:27:53.559
in that moment. But I was cracking up during the

493
00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.480
lunch scene because he's he put out one or two

494
00:27:56.519 --> 00:27:59.440
pretty good moves and she was like, hmm, I don't think.

495
00:27:59.279 --> 00:28:04.920
So well okay, So he's nothing if not persistent, you know,

496
00:28:04.960 --> 00:28:07.960
because they just you know, like Christopher Plumbers like, oh,

497
00:28:07.960 --> 00:28:11.279
we're having lunch with the Buchanans or something. She's like, no,

498
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:14.240
I'm having lunch with him. And you know, Christopher Plumber's

499
00:28:14.240 --> 00:28:16.039
got that great. Mom was like, look, it doesn't matter

500
00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:19.319
who you are, what you do. She she already knows

501
00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:21.799
I don't like you and I don't approve, so but

502
00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:23.920
then you know, she's like, hey, sorry, you're you know,

503
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:26.519
I don't have anything. And he's like, ah, we're doing

504
00:28:26.559 --> 00:28:29.599
this and she's like, you know, and I just love

505
00:28:29.640 --> 00:28:33.039
how he's He's trying to make conversation in a polite conversation,

506
00:28:33.119 --> 00:28:34.160
you know, so what do you do? And she's like,

507
00:28:34.200 --> 00:28:37.839
what do you care? He's like, I don't. I'm like, yes,

508
00:28:38.279 --> 00:28:42.039
that was that is That is such a gunslinger thing

509
00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:44.599
to say to a to a woman that's being a

510
00:28:44.599 --> 00:28:48.279
little a little stand offish, a little aggressive with you. You know,

511
00:28:49.319 --> 00:28:51.359
I just I dig that whole, that whole thing. And

512
00:28:51.359 --> 00:28:53.039
then he like it. Then he goes forward. He keeps

513
00:28:53.079 --> 00:28:55.440
on and he's like basically insults her, you know, kind

514
00:28:55.440 --> 00:28:59.839
of kind of psychoanalyzes her and and smiles as he says, hey, here,

515
00:29:00.599 --> 00:29:05.240
it's ironic, you are your problem. And she's like, let's

516
00:29:05.400 --> 00:29:08.000
let's continue lunch out on the credenza or whatever she's said,

517
00:29:08.559 --> 00:29:11.240
you know, like he's he's winning her over, you know.

518
00:29:12.200 --> 00:29:14.960
I love I love those moments. Let's talk about another

519
00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:18.279
good uh jack too for here, and I'm talking about

520
00:29:18.440 --> 00:29:21.880
where the wolf's starting to come out. So catching his

521
00:29:21.960 --> 00:29:26.960
wife with Stuart. He's got that weird half jog arms

522
00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:30.880
that is that was so funny. The hell's going on

523
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:34.000
with that? That that that that you know, like dude,

524
00:29:34.079 --> 00:29:37.920
pump your arms like but but it was kind of

525
00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:39.599
it made him a little more primal, It made him

526
00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:42.480
a little more analystic. So I did dig it, and

527
00:29:42.519 --> 00:29:44.680
we were starting to see a little bit more of

528
00:29:44.720 --> 00:29:48.240
the wolf coming out. Uh, just the pacing that he does,

529
00:29:48.920 --> 00:29:50.920
like like a like an animal on the cage.

530
00:29:51.359 --> 00:29:55.759
I love that he could smell it. Yeah, it started

531
00:29:55.799 --> 00:29:58.240
with the scent. He smelled it on her clothes.

532
00:29:58.240 --> 00:30:00.640
He smells Stuart on her clothes. She's supposed to be

533
00:30:00.680 --> 00:30:04.200
at some conference or whatever. And uh, and then we

534
00:30:04.240 --> 00:30:06.400
start to see like some of the physical feats that

535
00:30:06.400 --> 00:30:08.680
he's capable of. You know, he's kind of taking the

536
00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:10.440
steps two at a time and then kind of lunges

537
00:30:10.440 --> 00:30:19.079
and yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, oh fantastic. But uh, great

538
00:30:19.119 --> 00:30:22.039
moment for Jack. But then when he's like I would

539
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:25.640
say three quarters wolf the would be mugging is one

540
00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:29.720
of my favorite moments in this movie because terrifying. It

541
00:30:29.799 --> 00:30:33.839
was terrifying, but I love the fact that these guys

542
00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:37.480
are like, we need some money, you know, yeah, and

543
00:30:37.519 --> 00:30:40.240
he just says I've got a thousand dollars in my wallet,

544
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:45.640
like five, you need ten? Just like that. I mean,

545
00:30:45.640 --> 00:30:48.119
could you imagine like what's going through their heads at

546
00:30:48.119 --> 00:30:51.079
this point, like, hey, this middle aged man is taunting us.

547
00:30:52.000 --> 00:30:54.200
And then then yeah, he goes from taunting to thrashing

548
00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:56.799
them and you know, tearing their throats out. But I

549
00:30:56.839 --> 00:30:59.759
love that moment, you know. And and Nichols does something

550
00:30:59.759 --> 00:31:05.039
here where it's not graphic, it's not overtly violent, it's

551
00:31:05.079 --> 00:31:06.359
it's pretty bloodless.

552
00:31:06.839 --> 00:31:08.920
Yeah, he pans over to the shadows.

553
00:31:09.160 --> 00:31:12.839
Yeah, we get to watch the shadow of this character

554
00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:17.279
just you know, full carnage on these three muggers, who,

555
00:31:18.039 --> 00:31:20.640
let's be honest, got what they deserved. I for being

556
00:31:20.839 --> 00:31:21.480
I loved at.

557
00:31:21.400 --> 00:31:24.960
The end that like granted cheeses mom, but like the

558
00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:27.359
one guy's mom was like crying at the police station,

559
00:31:27.480 --> 00:31:31.440
going who cuts off a guy's fingers? Like who does that?

560
00:31:31.720 --> 00:31:37.039
And I'm like he was, Robbie, he's a criminal. I'm

561
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:41.720
not saying you know that, that's okay, but you're defending yourself.

562
00:31:44.400 --> 00:31:50.720
So let's talk about the Will Stewart relationship for a minute.

563
00:31:51.480 --> 00:31:53.200
You kind of spoke about a scene that you you

564
00:31:53.319 --> 00:32:00.000
absolutely loved, marking your territory. Okay, I'm gonna tell you

565
00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.039
ever because I know you don't. I know you don't

566
00:32:02.039 --> 00:32:05.119
spend any time in men's men's rooms, but uh, there's

567
00:32:05.160 --> 00:32:09.400
an unwritten rule that you you never take the stall

568
00:32:10.359 --> 00:32:12.640
next to the urinal. You never take the one right

569
00:32:12.680 --> 00:32:17.680
next to the guy. You know, there's always a buffer urinal.

570
00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:22.160
You're supposed to leave one in between. And Stuart, you know,

571
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.359
he made the mistake. He got right up in Jack's business.

572
00:32:25.599 --> 00:32:27.119
Yeah, and you know.

573
00:32:28.759 --> 00:32:30.200
Why you get, that's why you get, that's how you

574
00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:31.440
get pissed in your Swede shoes.

575
00:32:33.119 --> 00:32:35.720
He's walking out, he just doesn't say he goes these are.

576
00:32:37.920 --> 00:32:39.079
Yeah.

577
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:42.039
It was such a great line and such a great delivery.

578
00:32:42.400 --> 00:32:43.240
It's funny.

579
00:32:43.440 --> 00:32:46.519
It's the first time we see Stewart for who he

580
00:32:46.559 --> 00:32:49.559
really is, like the the intimidating Stuart because he's like,

581
00:32:49.759 --> 00:32:52.799
I am what's best for this firm. You know it,

582
00:32:52.880 --> 00:32:55.400
everybody knows it, you know, because he goes from like

583
00:32:55.519 --> 00:32:58.599
please don't fire me, don't let me leave, and yeah,

584
00:32:58.680 --> 00:32:59.839
he's just well.

585
00:32:59.880 --> 00:33:02.680
And it's one of those moments in the office as

586
00:33:02.720 --> 00:33:06.880
well where you're really seeing Jack like take control and

587
00:33:06.920 --> 00:33:09.079
he's like I'm not going out quietly, like I'm not

588
00:33:09.119 --> 00:33:10.599
just gonna roll over and take it.

589
00:33:11.880 --> 00:33:15.799
Another great moment for Jack, just smiling, I'm gonna get

590
00:33:15.839 --> 00:33:21.000
you Stuart, and it just just walks out. Yeah, okay,

591
00:33:21.880 --> 00:33:24.680
what'd you think of the jump it to the end.

592
00:33:24.720 --> 00:33:28.519
Let's the showdown Will versus Stuart, you know, when they

593
00:33:28.519 --> 00:33:33.240
are fully wolfed out in the Horse the Horse barn I.

594
00:33:33.160 --> 00:33:39.079
Loved that they were still humanoid. Yes, I liked that

595
00:33:39.279 --> 00:33:43.000
a lot because it's just look right. Yeah, just to

596
00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:47.599
watch like two dogs fighting is a completely different vibe,

597
00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:53.160
but to see two animalistic men fighting is is just

598
00:33:53.759 --> 00:33:57.240
really powerful and terrifying. And I really was thrown Like

599
00:33:57.839 --> 00:34:02.640
from the moment Spader like kills the guard and busts

600
00:34:02.680 --> 00:34:06.279
through the gate. Like from that point on, I was

601
00:34:06.720 --> 00:34:12.079
just completely shocked, Like this was way more aggressive and

602
00:34:12.119 --> 00:34:16.800
way more physical and intense than I was prepared for.

603
00:34:16.880 --> 00:34:17.920
I was like, holy.

604
00:34:17.679 --> 00:34:18.800
Crack, Yeah you're talking.

605
00:34:18.880 --> 00:34:20.840
You're talking amazing, You're.

606
00:34:20.679 --> 00:34:24.599
Talking physical and intense. This is a moment where again,

607
00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:27.599
we we've we've kind of spoke to this. Michelle Pfeiffer

608
00:34:27.719 --> 00:34:31.719
is not the damsel in distress, but how terrified are

609
00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:35.760
you for her in that moment when Will is locked

610
00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:39.440
up and Stewart is just going at her, you know,

611
00:34:40.039 --> 00:34:43.840
and she's doing everything she can to kick and get

612
00:34:43.840 --> 00:34:47.239
herself away from him. I'm legitimately scared for Michelle Pfeiffer

613
00:34:47.280 --> 00:34:51.360
in that moment, just how just how how abrasive he is,

614
00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:53.840
like grabbing her and pulling her back to him and

615
00:34:54.559 --> 00:34:57.440
you know, clawing at her and trying to get to her. Terrifying.

616
00:34:57.760 --> 00:35:00.400
It was terrifying because you're like, is he trying to

617
00:35:00.519 --> 00:35:04.000
rape her? Is he trying to kill her? Like what's

618
00:35:04.039 --> 00:35:06.199
the end of the scene gonna be? And she was

619
00:35:06.239 --> 00:35:10.480
so smart. She's grabbing stuff like the fire extinguisher and

620
00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:13.159
you know, kicking him in the face. I mean, she

621
00:35:13.400 --> 00:35:17.599
was really intense, but you did feel that vulnerability as

622
00:35:17.599 --> 00:35:20.519
a woman of like she was completely overpowered.

623
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:24.920
And yeah, I gotta say the way it reads, I

624
00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:26.559
don't think he's trying to kill her in that moment.

625
00:35:26.599 --> 00:35:31.320
I think he's trying to. I think he's trying to. Really,

626
00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:33.679
it's it's not so much that's a sexual thing. I

627
00:35:33.719 --> 00:35:38.159
think he's trying to emasculate Will in that moment because Will, Yeah,

628
00:35:38.199 --> 00:35:42.159
he's trying. She's got your left up huh yeah, And

629
00:35:42.199 --> 00:35:45.880
it's it's as helpless as she is. Will is helpless

630
00:35:45.880 --> 00:35:49.000
in that moment as well, and Spader knows that, and

631
00:35:49.039 --> 00:35:51.920
Spader knows how he feels about her. So I think

632
00:35:51.960 --> 00:35:53.320
that's the you know.

633
00:35:54.239 --> 00:35:56.119
I just was shouting at the screen. I was like,

634
00:35:56.199 --> 00:35:57.719
rip the bed dallion off.

635
00:35:58.079 --> 00:36:00.840
Yeah, yeah, that's all you needed to do. And then

636
00:36:01.119 --> 00:36:03.760
you know he's he fully wolfs out and then we

637
00:36:03.800 --> 00:36:08.280
get this amazing fight. I absolutely love it. And I

638
00:36:08.639 --> 00:36:12.239
kind of did the fact that we're not fully going

639
00:36:12.239 --> 00:36:16.360
into the werewolf floor because yes, obviously the security guard

640
00:36:16.360 --> 00:36:20.840
wasn't carrying silver bullets and it is forty five a moment.

641
00:36:20.519 --> 00:36:23.000
Though when she unloads on him where I was like,

642
00:36:23.320 --> 00:36:26.119
oh shit, is it gonna work? These weren't super bullets,

643
00:36:26.159 --> 00:36:27.800
Like is he gonna die? Is he just gonna keep

644
00:36:27.840 --> 00:36:29.119
coming back? Like what are we gonna do?

645
00:36:29.599 --> 00:36:32.400
Yeah, but we get that moment where we immediately start

646
00:36:32.480 --> 00:36:34.800
like that classic thing in werewolf movies where you kill

647
00:36:34.800 --> 00:36:37.639
the werewolf and then he starts to to uh to

648
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:40.159
turn back into a man. Yeah, you know that the

649
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:42.480
nails start to shrink and the hair starts to shrivel,

650
00:36:42.519 --> 00:36:45.719
and so yeah, I don't know. I love this, love this,

651
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:49.880
love this movie. Oh is there a pivotal scene for you,

652
00:36:49.960 --> 00:36:53.440
like where you're just like, this is the moment, this

653
00:36:53.480 --> 00:36:54.960
is what's making the movie for you.

654
00:36:57.440 --> 00:37:02.960
I had kind of too. There was the scene where

655
00:37:03.079 --> 00:37:06.599
Richard Jenkins is plays a detective and he shows up

656
00:37:06.599 --> 00:37:11.239
at the hotel room and to tell them that uh

657
00:37:11.920 --> 00:37:16.960
Will's wife has been murdered. Okay, and so you're watching

658
00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:22.519
Jack Nicholson's shock and Michelle Pfeiffer's like trying to cover up,

659
00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:26.159
and you know, all of that going on. And then

660
00:37:26.199 --> 00:37:28.440
there's the scene right after it where they're driving to

661
00:37:28.519 --> 00:37:32.000
her house and Jack Nicholson falls asleep in the car

662
00:37:32.079 --> 00:37:33.880
and she's looking at him. He's guys foot up on

663
00:37:33.920 --> 00:37:37.079
the dashboard and she sees like mud caked all over

664
00:37:37.159 --> 00:37:41.639
as loafers, and you can watch her go, oh my god,

665
00:37:41.800 --> 00:37:42.800
this might be real.

666
00:37:43.360 --> 00:37:46.039
She's starting to put it together. Yeah, it's funny you

667
00:37:46.039 --> 00:37:49.760
mentioned Jenkins because my my pivot, my pivotal scene definitely

668
00:37:49.800 --> 00:37:53.960
a Jenkins moment. And it's again it's the realization that

669
00:37:54.039 --> 00:37:57.960
she feels when she has the phone call with him,

670
00:37:58.239 --> 00:38:01.320
like the following day, Yes, and you know, she's like,

671
00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:04.159
she's starting to put it together. She's starting to think, Okay,

672
00:38:04.400 --> 00:38:07.280
Will has been telling me the truth. He maybe he

673
00:38:07.400 --> 00:38:09.119
is I don't believe it, but maybe he is a

674
00:38:09.119 --> 00:38:12.079
were wolf. And then she has this moment where she's like,

675
00:38:12.119 --> 00:38:14.119
do you still want blood and tissue samples from him?

676
00:38:14.159 --> 00:38:17.400
And he's like, ah, no, it's it's no use. I

677
00:38:17.400 --> 00:38:18.920
think we had some kind of a mistake because we

678
00:38:18.960 --> 00:38:22.480
found canine DNA at the murder scene, so the tech

679
00:38:22.519 --> 00:38:25.840
probably was petting their dog or we don't know. And

680
00:38:25.840 --> 00:38:28.519
then like the look of horror on her face. Yes,

681
00:38:29.239 --> 00:38:30.960
now I'm gonna be. I'm gonna be clear on something

682
00:38:31.760 --> 00:38:34.199
we've been talking about, how this theory of her being

683
00:38:34.199 --> 00:38:37.480
the the apex predator. You know, she's she's a wolf.

684
00:38:38.320 --> 00:38:42.719
My thought is that maybe she doesn't realize that she like,

685
00:38:42.719 --> 00:38:45.039
like consciously, I don't think she realizes that she is.

686
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:48.559
You know, maybe she's on a subconscious level. She she

687
00:38:49.119 --> 00:38:52.320
is attracted to Jack because of she's kind of picking

688
00:38:52.400 --> 00:38:55.960
up on his vibe, you know, as he's becoming more

689
00:38:56.000 --> 00:38:59.480
and more wolf like. But she she legitimately in that moment,

690
00:38:59.519 --> 00:39:03.639
feels a little a little scared for herself, like holy shit,

691
00:39:03.760 --> 00:39:08.480
like it's it's real, unless she's maybe thinking, oh my god,

692
00:39:08.519 --> 00:39:09.800
he actually really.

693
00:39:09.599 --> 00:39:13.920
Thought maybe it was she knew he didn't do it, Yeah,

694
00:39:13.960 --> 00:39:18.559
and she was going and like she knows who's in

695
00:39:18.599 --> 00:39:21.880
the pack, so she's like, oh shit, there's another one

696
00:39:21.920 --> 00:39:22.719
out there somewhere.

697
00:39:23.679 --> 00:39:27.000
She knows he didn't do it. So it's never really

698
00:39:28.039 --> 00:39:31.400
put forth, but in your like when you watch this

699
00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:37.360
movie Amber, was Charlotte murdered by will or because there's

700
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:39.559
there you know, we have the evidence there, right, you know,

701
00:39:39.599 --> 00:39:42.400
there's some there's some evidence there. Or was she murdered

702
00:39:42.400 --> 00:39:43.280
by Stuart?

703
00:39:43.559 --> 00:39:45.119
Do you think I thought it was Stuart.

704
00:39:45.679 --> 00:39:47.719
I'm thinking, Stuart, you don't want to you clearly you

705
00:39:47.719 --> 00:39:50.280
don't want to think Jack Nicholson's gonna wolf out and

706
00:39:50.360 --> 00:39:52.599
murder his wife. So it's gotta Stewart, right.

707
00:39:52.679 --> 00:39:55.039
I feel like he would have done it maybe in

708
00:39:55.119 --> 00:39:59.519
the moment, like when he confronted her at Stuart's apartment.

709
00:39:59.639 --> 00:40:01.920
He he didn't attack her, He just kind of gave

710
00:40:01.960 --> 00:40:05.960
her a disgusted look and walked away. Yeah, but I mean,

711
00:40:06.360 --> 00:40:12.039
I think Stewart is such a planner, mm hmm. And

712
00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:16.320
I think that he was much more quick to embrace

713
00:40:16.719 --> 00:40:19.440
his change, his physical changes, than Jack was.

714
00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:22.679
Jack's fighting it the whole time. He's got the million, He's.

715
00:40:22.519 --> 00:40:25.280
He's kind of afraid of it. He's yeah, you know,

716
00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:27.800
And I think Spader was like, hey, this is cool.

717
00:40:28.079 --> 00:40:30.480
You know you gotta remember too, though, when when Jack

718
00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:33.519
goes to see the old uh like the medicine man.

719
00:40:34.400 --> 00:40:38.000
You know, he basically says, like, the wolf makes you

720
00:40:38.079 --> 00:40:42.280
more of what you are, So yeah, kind of kind

721
00:40:42.280 --> 00:40:43.480
of like a Jack on High thing, like you know,

722
00:40:43.519 --> 00:40:46.320
it'll make you if you're a good guy or Captain America.

723
00:40:46.360 --> 00:40:48.679
You know, you take it to take it. It's gonna

724
00:40:48.679 --> 00:40:50.360
make If you're a good guy, you become a great guy.

725
00:40:50.400 --> 00:40:52.199
If you're a bad guy, you become a worse guy.

726
00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:56.760
So I think that that would explain why Spader changes

727
00:40:56.800 --> 00:41:01.519
so abruptly, or I think it's right. It's he's embraced. Yeah,

728
00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:05.079
And I gotta tell you, as much as I like

729
00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:10.079
Jack's makeup as in the in the Wolf makeup, Spader's

730
00:41:10.119 --> 00:41:15.719
makeup that Rick Baker does is just awesome. Yes, I mean,

731
00:41:15.760 --> 00:41:20.840
he is terrifying looking while still looking slightly human.

732
00:41:22.400 --> 00:41:25.199
That's the part that just blows me away is that

733
00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:31.400
you can still see that this is a person. It's

734
00:41:31.440 --> 00:41:35.280
not like teenage werewolf where it looks kind of silly.

735
00:41:35.880 --> 00:41:38.920
You know. And again we talked about, you know, there's

736
00:41:38.960 --> 00:41:41.239
some comedic beats here and there. I love what he

737
00:41:41.280 --> 00:41:44.519
pulls up to the gate. He's fully wolfed out, and

738
00:41:44.559 --> 00:41:47.440
the guards like, can I help you? He's like, George,

739
00:41:47.480 --> 00:41:50.880
I'm here to see Laura. George like begins and ends

740
00:41:50.880 --> 00:41:53.239
the sentence with the guy's name, and he's got such

741
00:41:53.280 --> 00:41:57.679
a delightful look in his face. It's fantastic. All right, Amber,

742
00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:00.480
Let's take one last break and when we can back,

743
00:42:01.039 --> 00:42:07.519
we're gonna talk a little bit about Mike Nichols. Welcome back, Amber.

744
00:42:08.519 --> 00:42:14.559
I've decided to zag incident. Now we've been lately, we've

745
00:42:14.599 --> 00:42:16.599
been talking. You know, when we talk about our director,

746
00:42:16.760 --> 00:42:18.800
we'll talk about, you know, two or three things, we

747
00:42:19.480 --> 00:42:22.840
throw out a quote. Right, We're gonna do that. But

748
00:42:22.920 --> 00:42:26.159
then I'm gonna ask you a different question than I

749
00:42:26.239 --> 00:42:30.639
usually do because we're not we're not gonna specifically, we're

750
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:34.159
not going to talk about his filmography, and I'll look at.

751
00:42:34.079 --> 00:42:36.679
That one of my favorite directors.

752
00:42:36.119 --> 00:42:39.239
I knew that, and I'm gonna get to it. Hold on,

753
00:42:39.559 --> 00:42:41.599
I think you're you're sad right now, but I think

754
00:42:41.599 --> 00:42:45.000
I'll make you happy. Okay, But let's talk a little

755
00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:46.880
bit about Mike Nichols. So a couple of fun facts

756
00:42:46.880 --> 00:42:51.239
about him. First off, Mike Nichols is the ninth person

757
00:42:51.679 --> 00:42:56.480
to achieve egot status, and Amber, for everyone that just

758
00:42:56.519 --> 00:43:00.199
heard me say that and is saying, what's that? You

759
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:01.639
want to tell us what an egot is?

760
00:43:01.679 --> 00:43:01.760
Like?

761
00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:03.519
What do you got to do to be to have

762
00:43:03.559 --> 00:43:04.159
the egot?

763
00:43:04.719 --> 00:43:09.039
Uh? To have the egot you have to win an Emmy,

764
00:43:09.960 --> 00:43:14.039
a Grammy, an Oscar and a Tony Award.

765
00:43:14.920 --> 00:43:17.960
This is not something that happens all the time, right.

766
00:43:18.440 --> 00:43:21.039
I mean, there's a very short list of people that

767
00:43:21.079 --> 00:43:23.880
have achieved this, and Mike Nichols is one of them.

768
00:43:24.559 --> 00:43:31.440
This next piece absolutely shocks me. He initially wanted to

769
00:43:32.000 --> 00:43:37.840
direct nineteen eighty two's First Blood with Dustin Hoffman in

770
00:43:37.880 --> 00:43:40.480
the role of John Rambo. Think about that for just

771
00:43:40.719 --> 00:43:41.280
a second.

772
00:43:41.519 --> 00:43:42.480
Have you read the book?

773
00:43:43.199 --> 00:43:45.920
Yes, Now it's not exactly the film, it's a little

774
00:43:45.920 --> 00:43:46.760
bit different from the.

775
00:43:46.679 --> 00:43:49.159
So having read the book, do you think.

776
00:43:49.519 --> 00:43:52.679
I was shocked? But then I'm thinking about Dustin Hoffman,

777
00:43:52.679 --> 00:43:57.199
a marathon man. Yeah, and I'm like, you know what, Oh,

778
00:43:57.320 --> 00:44:02.079
yeah it works. Now clearly you don't see Dustin Hoffman

779
00:44:02.119 --> 00:44:05.000
and Rambo First Blood Part two. That's never gonna wear it.

780
00:44:06.679 --> 00:44:12.719
But Dustin Hoffman, like early eighties Dustin Hoffman struggling with

781
00:44:12.880 --> 00:44:16.840
PTSD and being a vet that's back home and has

782
00:44:16.920 --> 00:44:20.599
no one to support him, no one to talk to,

783
00:44:20.719 --> 00:44:22.760
no one to listen, and just not finding his way.

784
00:44:22.800 --> 00:44:26.440
I could see it. I would love to go. You know,

785
00:44:26.480 --> 00:44:29.159
we talk occasionally about the Alternate Universe video store. I

786
00:44:29.199 --> 00:44:32.440
would love to go there and pick up Mike Nichol's

787
00:44:32.639 --> 00:44:35.119
First Blood starring Dustin Hoffin. I'm I'm gonna put that

788
00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:37.400
on my list because yeah.

789
00:44:37.360 --> 00:44:42.519
I mean, like you said, it's not the sequel is

790
00:44:42.559 --> 00:44:47.360
not Rambo. And the skills that that John Rambo has

791
00:44:47.400 --> 00:44:49.559
in the first one, like they're all acquiable.

792
00:44:50.280 --> 00:44:55.119
Yes, when you like think Marathon Man, Dustin Hoffman can

793
00:44:55.239 --> 00:44:58.239
pretty much do everything that John Rambo is doing in

794
00:44:58.320 --> 00:45:03.480
First Blood. Yeah, so it'd be interesting. Yeah, for sure,

795
00:45:04.000 --> 00:45:06.199
I'm gonna have I'll tell you what, when I head

796
00:45:06.280 --> 00:45:08.920
the Alternate Universe, I'll see if I can bring back

797
00:45:08.920 --> 00:45:11.840
a copy for you. Okay, thank you. One more thing.

798
00:45:12.760 --> 00:45:16.360
During the two thousand and three Kennedy Center Honors for

799
00:45:16.519 --> 00:45:22.280
Mike Nichols, Meryl Streep and Candice Bergen read what Mike

800
00:45:22.400 --> 00:45:27.280
Nichols calls the five Rules for Filmmaking, and here they are,

801
00:45:27.639 --> 00:45:30.320
because I know you're wondering what they are. Number one,

802
00:45:31.239 --> 00:45:36.039
the careful application of terror is an important form of communication.

803
00:45:36.719 --> 00:45:38.320
That's cryptic, it's.

804
00:45:38.199 --> 00:45:40.039
Interesting, very manipulative.

805
00:45:40.559 --> 00:45:45.400
Yes it is. Number two, anything worth fighting for is

806
00:45:45.480 --> 00:45:52.599
worth fighting dirty for. Oh agree, okay, all right. Number three,

807
00:45:53.559 --> 00:46:01.960
there's absolutely no substitute for genuine lack of preparation makes sense. Yeah.

808
00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:06.199
Number four, if you think there's good in everybody. You

809
00:46:06.320 --> 00:46:12.639
haven't met everybody. Mike Nichols telling it like it is

810
00:46:14.239 --> 00:46:19.159
number five. Friends may come and go, but enemies will

811
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:24.760
certainly become studio heads. Gotta love the snark of this guy.

812
00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:30.519
And let me throw a quote at you. Talking about

813
00:46:31.280 --> 00:46:34.519
working with Jack Nicholson, he says, and I'm quoting here,

814
00:46:35.280 --> 00:46:38.400
Jack is the sort of guy who takes parts others

815
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:43.199
have turned down, might turn down, and explodes them into

816
00:46:43.239 --> 00:46:47.079
something nobody could have conceived of. All of his brilliance

817
00:46:47.119 --> 00:46:52.480
of character and gesture is consumed and made invisible by

818
00:46:52.480 --> 00:46:54.119
the expanse of his nature.

819
00:46:54.760 --> 00:46:55.360
Wow.

820
00:46:56.159 --> 00:47:00.840
Very deep. Right, Yes, So I told you we're not

821
00:47:00.880 --> 00:47:04.599
gonna go through his filmography, and you are not happy

822
00:47:04.599 --> 00:47:06.480
about that? Why am I doing it? Yeah? You're like,

823
00:47:06.519 --> 00:47:10.519
this is a we're friends. You're like, I got another

824
00:47:12.039 --> 00:47:15.039
another Michelle fiv for movie, another Jack Nicholson movie. It's

825
00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:16.840
my director that I really like. But here's what I'm

826
00:47:16.840 --> 00:47:20.599
gonna do. I'm gonna ask you if someone had never

827
00:47:20.679 --> 00:47:27.599
seen a film by Mike Nichols, what hey, Han solo,

828
00:47:27.599 --> 00:47:29.760
don't choot from the hip. You don't know where I'm

829
00:47:29.760 --> 00:47:35.760
gonna go with this? All right? For everyone that that

830
00:47:35.840 --> 00:47:40.519
didn't catch that. I'll repeat myself if someone had never

831
00:47:40.559 --> 00:47:45.079
seen a film by Mike Nichols, pause for dramatic effects.

832
00:47:46.440 --> 00:47:49.679
What are your three recommendations?

833
00:47:50.320 --> 00:47:51.239
Oh? I get three?

834
00:47:51.400 --> 00:47:55.639
Okay, yes, give me you three. I got my three.

835
00:47:55.880 --> 00:47:57.119
I want to see what you know. You're a fan

836
00:47:57.159 --> 00:47:58.880
of Mike Nichols. I want to see, like, think about this.

837
00:47:58.880 --> 00:48:01.760
Someone is like, I don't know him. You have a

838
00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:04.280
responsibility here, Embert. What are you gonna What three movies

839
00:48:04.320 --> 00:48:06.320
are you gonna show this person to make them a

840
00:48:06.320 --> 00:48:07.440
fan of White Nichols.

841
00:48:07.639 --> 00:48:12.159
Well, so, I'm not a huge fan of his early filmography.

842
00:48:12.920 --> 00:48:15.480
I haven't seen them all, but the ones I have

843
00:48:15.519 --> 00:48:19.039
I'm kind of like it. Just so starting in the

844
00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:22.480
eighties is when I and on is when I'm just

845
00:48:22.559 --> 00:48:27.559
a huge, huge fan. So I would say that, first

846
00:48:27.559 --> 00:48:29.960
of all, I'm a cheat, because why not?

847
00:48:31.119 --> 00:48:33.360
What is your name? Scott Hoffman? Is that what's happening here?

848
00:48:33.599 --> 00:48:36.719
Because I'm the voice of reason and you'll see why

849
00:48:36.719 --> 00:48:41.960
I'm right. Okay, I'm gonna send this person to YouTube

850
00:48:42.159 --> 00:48:45.840
and tell them to look up Nichols and may what

851
00:48:46.599 --> 00:48:51.159
a hell that he started his career in the sixties

852
00:48:51.920 --> 00:48:56.360
doing comedy routines with Elaine May, and they were known

853
00:48:56.360 --> 00:49:03.679
as Nichols and May. Okay, and they do absolutely hysterical sets.

854
00:49:04.199 --> 00:49:06.760
All right, So you're cashing in. You're cashing in one

855
00:49:06.760 --> 00:49:08.639
of your choices that go on.

856
00:49:08.599 --> 00:49:12.840
YouTube and watch one of their bits, like they are hysterical.

857
00:49:14.400 --> 00:49:15.679
So I'm gonna give up a movie.

858
00:49:16.440 --> 00:49:19.400
Uh, just you mentioned you mentioned her? Okay, So you

859
00:49:19.440 --> 00:49:24.440
mentioned her? Uh are you aware that she is the

860
00:49:24.440 --> 00:49:27.519
the hotel operator that wakes Jack Nicholson up.

861
00:49:28.360 --> 00:49:29.599
No, I couldn't hear it.

862
00:49:30.239 --> 00:49:33.639
That's her voice. Oh my gosh, hey you she's like

863
00:49:33.679 --> 00:49:35.280
you ask for a wake up cob and trying to

864
00:49:35.280 --> 00:49:37.360
reach you. You've been a bad funny because they do

865
00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:40.280
a whole telephone bit that that's her.

866
00:49:40.599 --> 00:49:42.159
Oh my god. I have to watch it with like

867
00:49:42.199 --> 00:49:45.800
headphones or something because I didn't hear at all. I

868
00:49:45.800 --> 00:49:47.320
thought it was like a one sided conversation.

869
00:49:47.960 --> 00:49:51.079
No, he's like, actually I'd been a good boy. You know.

870
00:49:50.679 --> 00:49:52.840
He's getting a little flirty with her on the phone.

871
00:49:53.360 --> 00:49:55.679
All right, So you you just burned one of your picks.

872
00:49:55.960 --> 00:49:58.960
So what to wat Nichols films? Are you going to

873
00:49:59.000 --> 00:49:59.920
suggest to this person?

874
00:50:00.920 --> 00:50:05.800
And then I am going to say, for an example

875
00:50:05.960 --> 00:50:12.039
of just directing amazing performances and just creating like a

876
00:50:12.079 --> 00:50:14.119
whole reality Silkwood.

877
00:50:14.880 --> 00:50:16.800
Good good choice, good choice.

878
00:50:18.039 --> 00:50:24.920
It is so incredibly believable, just just breathtakingly amazing. And

879
00:50:24.960 --> 00:50:27.239
then my number one.

880
00:50:29.039 --> 00:50:32.199
Guess your number, your your your last pick, but you

881
00:50:32.280 --> 00:50:35.079
are story shot from the hips, shot from the hip pond.

882
00:50:35.199 --> 00:50:38.679
Yeah. Working Girl absolutely one of my all time favorite.

883
00:50:39.679 --> 00:50:43.039
I could quote the entire movie. I watched this movie

884
00:50:43.039 --> 00:50:46.679
all the time, like, Working Girl is absolutely one of

885
00:50:46.719 --> 00:50:47.719
the best movies ever.

886
00:50:48.199 --> 00:50:51.199
All Right, I just wrote down if you were playing

887
00:50:51.239 --> 00:50:55.119
by the rules, I just wrote down the film, the

888
00:50:55.159 --> 00:50:58.079
Mike Nichols film that I had expected you to say.

889
00:50:58.880 --> 00:51:00.440
So I'll tell you what I'll give you. I'll get

890
00:51:00.480 --> 00:51:03.199
a free pass on the YouTube, Like, hey, while you

891
00:51:03.280 --> 00:51:06.800
wait to go to the video store, check out this,

892
00:51:07.239 --> 00:51:11.400
you know YouTube clip. We'll just say you could have that.

893
00:51:12.400 --> 00:51:17.079
So what would be your third choice? I know what

894
00:51:17.119 --> 00:51:18.440
you're going to pick, and I wrote it down here.

895
00:51:18.440 --> 00:51:20.559
I want to see if I'm right, do you though

896
00:51:21.079 --> 00:51:21.320
I do?

897
00:51:23.719 --> 00:51:25.639
It's so hard. I love them all.

898
00:51:25.920 --> 00:51:26.840
Only one come.

899
00:51:28.239 --> 00:51:29.599
I'm gonna say the bird cage.

900
00:51:30.320 --> 00:51:30.559
What.

901
00:51:31.239 --> 00:51:33.119
Yeah, I'm gonna say the bird cage.

902
00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:36.360
That's not what I had. I know that's a bird

903
00:51:36.400 --> 00:51:39.719
Cage is a remake, Yeah, and I thought, I thought,

904
00:51:39.719 --> 00:51:42.039
Amberlis is like, you know what, I want to say,

905
00:51:42.039 --> 00:51:45.119
bird cage, but I'm not because it's actually a remake.

906
00:51:45.800 --> 00:51:47.440
And that's why I'm going And I.

907
00:51:47.320 --> 00:51:52.239
Love the stage musical is if you head over to

908
00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:55.800
Docum Base seventy seven, we did a Lakacha fall versus

909
00:51:56.119 --> 00:51:58.519
the bird Cage and we broke it all down, and

910
00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:01.519
the whole time I'm yelling at Dayton and Robert going, yeah,

911
00:52:01.559 --> 00:52:02.960
but it's the musical though.

912
00:52:04.119 --> 00:52:05.559
You know what, here's what you're supposed to say.

913
00:52:05.599 --> 00:52:07.159
I'm gonna show you what do you have?

914
00:52:07.440 --> 00:52:08.519
Look what I look what I wrote?

915
00:52:09.119 --> 00:52:11.480
Oh my god, I almost said it to I know

916
00:52:11.599 --> 00:52:14.480
you did he wrote down.

917
00:52:14.280 --> 00:52:17.960
Heartburn, Heartburn nineteen eighty six because you're like.

918
00:52:18.320 --> 00:52:21.559
His knowing of my mind. And I shouldn't have done

919
00:52:21.559 --> 00:52:23.519
that because I really almost said that one.

920
00:52:23.840 --> 00:52:26.199
Do you remember the conversation we had when you were like, hey,

921
00:52:27.000 --> 00:52:29.440
we're doing you did this nineteen eighty six series and

922
00:52:29.480 --> 00:52:31.280
we got a couple more so when are we doing heartburn?

923
00:52:31.320 --> 00:52:36.199
I was like, uh no, we're not. You gave me

924
00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:38.920
the business. Yeah, you gave me the business that day.

925
00:52:39.239 --> 00:52:41.679
I'll remind you. So I'll tell you what.

926
00:52:41.679 --> 00:52:43.880
I love that movie so much.

927
00:52:44.039 --> 00:52:48.840
I like that. Your three and a half picks are

928
00:52:48.920 --> 00:52:53.000
not my picks. Just like, Hey, Nichols is a great director.

929
00:52:53.039 --> 00:52:55.400
He's gonna he's he's all kinds of appeal. So I'm

930
00:52:55.400 --> 00:52:58.239
gonna go with if someone's in front of me, they're like,

931
00:52:58.840 --> 00:53:02.679
give me three Nichols movies. I'm gonna say, watch the

932
00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:07.039
Graduate Classic. What do you mean We'll get to that.

933
00:53:07.039 --> 00:53:09.800
We'll get to that another time. I'm gonna say, watch

934
00:53:09.840 --> 00:53:11.159
Wolf because it's awesome.

935
00:53:11.239 --> 00:53:12.719
Oh yeah, yeah.

936
00:53:12.760 --> 00:53:15.639
And lastly, you talked about getting great performances out of people.

937
00:53:16.480 --> 00:53:19.800
I'm gonna go Harrison Ford in regarding Henry.

938
00:53:20.519 --> 00:53:21.639
It is so good.

939
00:53:21.920 --> 00:53:26.480
It's amazing. It is, it is, it is. I'll tell

940
00:53:26.519 --> 00:53:28.920
you what, you were a good sport. We'll take a

941
00:53:28.920 --> 00:53:32.800
look at Mike nichols pomography. Maybe, well, we can do

942
00:53:32.800 --> 00:53:35.480
a Mike Nichols movie. We'll do another one next season,

943
00:53:35.480 --> 00:53:35.960
how about that?

944
00:53:36.760 --> 00:53:37.559
Yeah?

945
00:53:37.599 --> 00:53:40.199
And I'll you know, we listen to we typically focus

946
00:53:40.280 --> 00:53:44.199
on underrated movies. But I'm gonna give you card Blanche

947
00:53:45.719 --> 00:53:48.000
pick pick the one that we haven't done. So we're

948
00:53:48.000 --> 00:53:50.760
obviously we're not gonna talk about Wolf again. But yeah,

949
00:53:50.880 --> 00:53:52.239
and we're not doing it. We're not doing the Bard

950
00:53:52.280 --> 00:53:54.800
Cage because I'll just tell people to go listen to

951
00:53:54.800 --> 00:53:55.719
Docum Bay seventy seven.

952
00:53:55.800 --> 00:53:57.320
Yes, because it's that episode.

953
00:53:57.360 --> 00:54:01.159
Is it was good? Anytime you Robert get together, it's always.

954
00:54:00.960 --> 00:54:03.199
I was gonna say anytime Robert and I especially, I

955
00:54:03.199 --> 00:54:07.800
think when we argue, it's a better episode when we disagree, it.

956
00:54:07.639 --> 00:54:13.639
Is all right. Uh Amber, your recommendation for.

957
00:54:13.639 --> 00:54:17.440
Wolf, Oh my gosh, I was so like, where has

958
00:54:17.480 --> 00:54:19.480
this movie been on my life? Like? This is definitely

959
00:54:19.480 --> 00:54:23.159
going in the the spooky list of stuff to hit

960
00:54:23.239 --> 00:54:24.079
up in October.

961
00:54:24.400 --> 00:54:27.800
Yeah, I'll say, I'll say it's a top ten werewolf movie.

962
00:54:28.559 --> 00:54:31.559
So put in Yeah, put in your rotation this Halloe

963
00:54:31.599 --> 00:54:35.199
season listeners, We want to know what you think of Wolf.

964
00:54:36.039 --> 00:54:39.639
Let us know on social media. You'll find us on Facebook, Instagram,

965
00:54:39.719 --> 00:54:42.679
and x You can check out a Film by Podcast

966
00:54:42.719 --> 00:54:46.639
dot com for film and TV articles and our entire library,

967
00:54:46.679 --> 00:54:49.559
which is streaming free. You can write to us at

968
00:54:49.559 --> 00:54:51.880
a Film by a Podcast at gmail dot com with

969
00:54:51.920 --> 00:54:55.880
your questions, comments and concerns. We may just read your

970
00:54:55.880 --> 00:54:58.559
response on the show and send you some a film

971
00:54:58.599 --> 00:55:02.159
by Swag. Please join us tomorrow for our Star Trek

972
00:55:02.199 --> 00:55:06.159
theme series Phaser Set to Stun. Wayne, David, and Scott

973
00:55:06.239 --> 00:55:10.599
are continuing their conversation about the next generation movies with

974
00:55:10.760 --> 00:55:12.280
Star Trek Insurrection.

975
00:55:13.400 --> 00:55:15.199
I can't wait to hear this one.

976
00:55:15.840 --> 00:55:19.199
I there they they got like two left, I think

977
00:55:19.239 --> 00:55:21.559
so yeah. And then Lower Dex is coming back. I

978
00:55:21.599 --> 00:55:23.280
know they're gonna be talking about Lower Ducks every week.

979
00:55:23.320 --> 00:55:26.000
So I'm excited for it too. I'll say what use

980
00:55:26.000 --> 00:55:30.159
I'm excited for. On Friday, our limited series A Film

981
00:55:30.199 --> 00:55:34.239
at forty five will celebrate the forty fifth anniversary of

982
00:55:34.280 --> 00:55:35.480
the Amityville Horror.

983
00:55:36.159 --> 00:55:39.920
Oh yes, and hot Dog.

984
00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:43.599
Oh yeah, Wayne, Wayne's gonna join them on that one,

985
00:55:44.239 --> 00:55:46.199
and I'm gonna I'm gonna gonna put it out there.

986
00:55:46.320 --> 00:55:49.960
Wayne not a fan of the Amityville Horror because of

987
00:55:50.000 --> 00:55:52.719
how super scary it is. They're making this, poor man

988
00:55:52.840 --> 00:55:58.760
watch the movie, just baby. Yeah. So you know, prayers

989
00:55:58.760 --> 00:56:02.440
for Wayne and Namber for all of you out there

990
00:56:02.480 --> 00:56:06.400
subscribing to our Patreon. Andrew Blakelee and I are taking

991
00:56:06.480 --> 00:56:12.880
ten minutes to discuss two minutes from Alfred Hitchcock's masterpiece Psycho.

992
00:56:13.800 --> 00:56:17.039
Ooh, I can't wait for this, you guys, this is

993
00:56:17.079 --> 00:56:22.320
definitely worth the Patreon subscription. I love this series and

994
00:56:22.360 --> 00:56:24.079
I'm very excited for this one.

995
00:56:24.519 --> 00:56:31.119
Andrew Blakely is absolutely brilliants. Two minutes, He'll Amber, he

996
00:56:31.199 --> 00:56:33.800
just hits me up, he says, hey, let's do let's

997
00:56:33.840 --> 00:56:35.559
do ten minutes on this movie. I'm like, and this

998
00:56:35.599 --> 00:56:36.000
is one.

999
00:56:35.840 --> 00:56:38.760
Of my all time favorites. So I cannot And.

1000
00:56:38.679 --> 00:56:40.119
I'm gonna tell you. I'm gonna leave you on the

1001
00:56:40.159 --> 00:56:44.800
hook here because there's a very famous scene in Psycho. Obviously, yes,

1002
00:56:45.480 --> 00:56:46.920
but we're not talking about that one.

1003
00:56:48.440 --> 00:56:49.639
That makes it even better.

1004
00:56:50.880 --> 00:56:55.360
Yes, Amber, it's always a pleasure talking with you. Glad

1005
00:56:55.360 --> 00:56:57.480
you're back always. I know you're coming back a couple

1006
00:56:57.480 --> 00:57:00.119
of weeks, so you know, yes, talk about where us.

1007
00:57:00.119 --> 00:57:02.719
We're gonna be talking about Vampire soon enough. And to

1008
00:57:02.760 --> 00:57:07.559
those of you listening or perhaps lurking on our social

1009
00:57:07.599 --> 00:57:11.639
media channels and haunting our Patreon, we wish you a

1010
00:57:11.760 --> 00:57:15.079
frightfully fun time until we return.