Phasers Set To Stun: recapping Discovery: Lagrange Point

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Space the Final Frontier. Join us
for a bold conversation our prime directive to

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recap our favorite Star Trek shows,
both new and old, to engage and

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debate about all things Trek. Prepare
to energize with Phasers Set to Stunt.

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Hello, listeners, and welcome back
to a new episode of Phasers Set to

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Stunt, where we continue to show
our love for everything Star Trek in this

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ongoing series from a film by podcast
which focuses on every system of the expanding

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Star Trek universe by covering television,
movies, animation, directors, merchandise,

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and much much more. Plotting our
course on this voyage is our Core Trek

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team. I'm Wayne Whited, I'm
David Byrne. Then I'm Skot Hoffman.

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And here we are almost at the
end of Star Trek Discovery Season five,

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of the series' final season. The
series has taken us to all corners of

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the galaxy, from the planet's q
Maw, Trill and Helmo, to the

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Bad Lens, to the Mirror universe, and from Starfleet headquarters to the Eternal

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Gallery and Archive. The map to
the Progenitor's technology has been completed and lost

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to the Breen and now In this
week's episode, Lagrange Point, the Discovery

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are on a race to get there
first. So this is black alert,

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folks. There are spoilers ahead,
and if you haven't seen this episode,

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please stop and shovel yourself to the
nearest view screen to catch it on Paramount

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Plus. Then come back and rejoin
us for this discussion. Now, Scott,

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why don't you give us a short
summary of this episode? Hey?

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First of all, I gotta give
it to you for rocking right through those

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three pronunciations of those planets. I
know, right, man, that's a

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lift away. And like you said. In the penultimate episode of the season

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and the series, Discovery finally reaches
its destination, the fabled Progenitor technology.

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They find the prize nestled between two
black holes in a binary star system at

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a lagrange point, which apparently has
nothing to do with the z top and

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everything to do with a position of
gravitational equilibrium, creating a perfectly dangerous and

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stationary parking spot for it. The
prize is deceptively simple, an ornate cylinder

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that resembles a monolithic oil barrel,
although finding the answers they seek within is

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far from easy. Discovery barely has
time to consider the object before the Breed

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rip it from their hands. The
chase seems to be over, but Discoveries

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resolve leads to a bold plan infiltrate
the Breen Dreadnought disguised as Breen soldiers and

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take it back. Adira, Reese, Book and Burnham form the away team,

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while Discovery's remaining crew figures out how
to help them escape with a Progenitor

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tech. Meanwhile, Moel gains confidence
as a temporary leader of the Breed by

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cracking open the canister and trying to
solve the mystery inside before a competing Breen

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leader arrives to seal it from her. Eventually, the away team is unmasked

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and Burnham finds herself pulled into the
canister along with several unfortunate Breen volunteers.

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Discovery creates a plan that frees the
canister from the Dreadnought, flinging it into

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open space, where it forms a
larger and more stable portal. The episode

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wraps with Rainer and crew determined to
get Burnham back while defending the Progenitor Prize

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from two warring Breen factions. We'll
see if they make it in episode ten,

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The Last of the season and the
series. Yeah, that's quite a

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synopsis. But you know, this
episode is really pactful as stuff, so

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you know, yeah, you had
to go through it one by one and

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all of it was great. I
love this episode. You know, it's

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really hard to decide where to begin
to talk about it. It really is.

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I mean, the biggest thing we
need to talk about is the directed

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by Jonathan Freaks. Oh definitely,
yeah. You know, I love every

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episode that he has directed, every
movie he's directed, so and we all

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love him as coming to a writer
of course. Oh yeah. But yeah,

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there's a lot going on in this
episode. And I don't know what

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when my favorite part would be of
this episode because there was so much in

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it. I just know that when
they shoved Discovery to the shuttle way of

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the uh, the dreadnock is like, are they really going to do that?

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Yeah? I mean I think that
was even the reaction of the bridge,

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are really going to do this?
And I just thought that entire sequence

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was incredible. And again I'll talk
about the special effects, the visual effects.

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They were incredible in this episode,
especially that scene they were and that

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shot at the beginning. We've seen
that last last week on the clip,

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but where it was warping well damaged
when it's spun was really cool. And

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then you know, there was that
shot. I just love that shot where

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it was in half cloak kind of
you know, flying pap plast the two

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black holes. That's probably one of
the most beautiful space sh So they've done

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this whole season. Yeah, you
know this effects the team that does the

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FX has done an incredible job this
year, you know, so I like

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to give it a shout out to
It's Piximondo is the main visual effects company

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and as well as quite a few
others, but their work on the series

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has been phenomenal. Yeah, that
cloaking effect was really well done. I

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mean, I need to show an
invisible ship but you can still see it

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so you still have the context to
know where it's going. Yeah, I

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would definitely say The headline is directed
by Jonathan Frakes. Of course, written

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by Sean cochrane and Ari Friedman.
A great combination for this one. A

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very action packed episode. A lot
of things have to get kind of wrapped

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up and resolved as we get toward
the end. I would say the subhead

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to this one is Siru's back.
Yes, from the top, right,

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I mean kind of he's coming back, but he's not great there. Well,

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here's my thoughts on this, okay, and this is kind of give

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going to give away what I think
is coming in episode ten. I think

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they're leading to his death. Really, there's a lot of stuff that happens

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in this episode where there's a lot
of things that you don't say or do,

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like in a horror movie, that
you if you do and say it,

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you're pretty much going to end your
character's life coming down the road of

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the movie him basically, you know, coming back giving the flowers and then

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volunteering for this mission, and you
know the talk that he had with Burnham,

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you know, and those kind of
things. You know, we kind

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of don't have enough time right now, but you know, hey, it's

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good to have you back, those
kind of things. I could be wrong,

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and I hope I'm wrong, but
I really feel like that's where they're

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leaning. I hope not. I
mean it could be. I really it's

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all guessing. I really have no
idea where they're gonna or how they're gonna

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end this with the characters, but
I hope not because I like him.

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I love this character. I always
have since the beginning, and I missed

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him for these last what was six
seven episodes that he's been gone. I

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think that scene with him and Karina
was so good and so well played by

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by both of them. You know, when when the series, when the

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season started, I wasn't really sure
if I cared about the storyline with their

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marriage. Sure, you know,
I just I wasn't feeling that. But

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just you know, as this season
is progressed, I'm really liking them more

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and more, and I hope they
get married. I hope you're you're wrong

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day, but we don't know.
We won't know until you know, next

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week. Yeah, but no,
when I do agree with you, I

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feel like the romance was kind of
awkward at first at the beginning of the

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season, but in this episode it
felt very fluid. It felt very good

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to have those two together. Sure
it might be because we could see the

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ruin Streen again, but the two
of them were just perfect together in that

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scene. I agree. Yeah,
yeah, And I mean, there there

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are characters that you might not necessarily
think of as having a traditional romantic relationship

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just because of the you know,
the vulcan background. I also hope that

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you're wrong you feel like it's like, hey, everybody, we've got soda,

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but it's been sitting out for seven
hours. It's like, Dave,

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you had to say something that sounds
like it's right. But yeah, it's

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entirely possible, and I think there's
probably going to be moral implications of you

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know, yes, we have this
tech that could technically bring back a fallen

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colleague, but should we I think
there's a lot of that that's probably going

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to come out with this progenitor tech. It's kind of like the question isn't

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necessarily who should have the progenitor tech, it's more like should anyone? Is

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it something that's better left to history
and science? Yeah? I agree on

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their relationship angle as well. I
think it's perfectly written, and I think

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it does a great job of going
through traditional kind of relationship beats that are

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appropriate for each of these characters that
are not, you know, stereotypically overly

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romantic, but the feelings are genuine
and you can tell how much they care

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for each other and how much they
also respect the positions that they're in and

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the responsibilities they have. Yeah,
I agree. You know the one scene

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in this episode that I was like, really that that just happened, now

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what, And the bridge crew had
the same reaction it was when the dreadnaught

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gets showed up, grabbed it and
we got it. It happened so fastened.

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Really we went through all that and
that fast and they took it and

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it's over, and like the bridge
group felt like that, dude, now

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what right? Right? Well?
And then you know, I also kind

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of wonder, you know, it's
floating out there like a you know,

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it feels produced by anybody else.
It would have like Pepsi logo on the

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side or something like that. They've
got this perfectly dangerous hiding spot for it,

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so you can't kind of fly in
there and grab it. But they

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didn't think about somebody with a tractor
beam. They could just I just pull

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it away, you know. I
mean that feels like it should have been

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a little bit more of a struggle, like don't have them just reach off

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the shelf and grab it. But
of course, you know, I mean,

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eight hundred years has passed, so
maybe back then next generation time trains

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are tractor beams couldn't quite reach that
far or weren't that sue, Yeah,

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they should have at least had one
of those you know stereotypical bridge shots where

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there's like sparks flying and things catch
fire because it's hard to do you know,

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yeah whatever it guess it's a little
tough. I do want to give

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out a shout out to instant Towel
because of her going instow going on the

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away mission. You know, everybody
even looked like, uh, really we

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should we be doing this? Is
this really happening? And you know,

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just the bravery that's how showed right
there was fantastic. Even Burnam was kind

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of struggling at first and they realized, no, I mean, how is

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the quickest when it comes in and
that's exactly what they need, you know,

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is speed, and tow was fantastic
in this episode. Yeah, and

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the the concern that you see on
standds, you know, like I know

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that they're ready. I want them
to be able to do so, but

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this is extraordinarily dangerous, Like this
is the brain and you're basically going to

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dress up like the brain and then
go on their dreadnought which is filled with

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brain that want to kill you,
which was incredible by the way of them

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dressing up as the brain, although
that was fantastic. Yeah. Well,

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and the way that they kind of
navigated that. That's I guess. The

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next thing that caught my attention is
how much more we get into breed culture

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and military structure. You know,
there was a lot of nuance to that,

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you know, changing the logo so
they're on the science team, for

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example, knowing how to navigate an
awkward conversation, actually more than one awkward

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conversation, just with dialogue, we
really see the xeno anthropology side of Burnham

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come through. And they were all
extraordinarily brave for it doesn't seem like they

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missed a beat. There was no
like you know, hesitation, stammering,

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doubt. They just went full on
into it. Well they knew, they

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knew what was on the table.
Man, you know, this is it.

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I mean, if we do not
get this from the brain, it

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is over. And they knew it. So I mean they don't you don't

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have a choice in the situation.
But you know, and even as powerful

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as the dramatic moments were. Again, one thing I love about Star Trek

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is they have those comedic beats that
you get sometimes too. I laughed so

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hard when Book was flirting with the
Breen. Yeah, I laughed so hard

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there and then Burnham was just giving
into it as well, like, really,

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this is happening? Are you sure
you don't want to get into that

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oil bath, like yeah, it's
so good. Yeah, you know.

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I also have to mention you mentioned
the fact that the episode was directed by

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Jonathan Frakes. That's really what made
this episode for me, what what made

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it stand out from the others,
because his direction I thought was was nominal,

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and he's directed so much Star Trek
over the years. You know,

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I don't even know how many Nextoration
episodes he directed, but you know he

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did some of my favorite episodes of
all the series. Yeah. He did

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Search and Past Tense for ad Space
nine. He directed quite a few episodes

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of Voyager. He directed No When
Scenario for A Card's Season three, which

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I thought was a phenomenally good episode. But this episode, more than any

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of the other ones that I just
mentioned it it looks like it was directed

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by the man who directed Star Trek
First Contact. If that makes any sense

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to you, I don't know it, does you know, because I think

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you know First Contact. I think
we all agree that is a beautifully directed

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film. It's one of one of
our favorites. Got you know, it's

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well timed, the pacing is great, the action is great. When he

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dialogue from the actors, you know, everyone looks like they're enjoying their time

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with the director. And I see
that here. Yeah, you know,

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more so than the other episodes that
he directed. It's got his fingerprints all

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over it. And I loved that
the episode because of that. So there

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is some definitely Jonathan Frake shots I
could see and like towards the beginning of

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the episode and a little bit later
on too, that we had seen in

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his past that he did, but
he went a little bit more further with

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some of his directing in this one
and gave us some originality stuff that really,

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you know, Frakes hasn't done before. And what I what I liked

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was I remember talking about in the
first episode of this season when they did

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the split screen of the two characters
side by side on the screen. We

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didn't like that he did it here
with three characters, but it worked because

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it is so quick and so fast
paced and what was going on all around

204
00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:41.559
it fit in here perfectly and I'm
so glad Freaks did it there. Yeah.

205
00:14:41.639 --> 00:14:46.519
Yeah, it helped establish that kind
of Iron Man heads up to helmet.

206
00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:50.360
That's exactly what I felt. It
felt like iron man. Yeah,

207
00:14:50.480 --> 00:14:54.840
the heads up gibberish on the side
that was like what is all this for?

208
00:14:54.120 --> 00:14:58.600
But yeah, it did work really, really well, And I'm glad

209
00:14:58.679 --> 00:15:01.080
you mentioned that because that's one of
the things to cut my attentions like,

210
00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:05.279
oh, last time we saw this
not so great, but did a good

211
00:15:05.320 --> 00:15:09.000
job of establishing, you know,
their their communication and you know, kind

212
00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:15.320
of reminding you who's there on the
team to keep moving forward. But yeah,

213
00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:18.759
way in the other aspect, as
you mentioned, and having similarities with

214
00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:26.759
First Contact, it's it's knowing how
to create the established, establish the atmosphere

215
00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:35.080
within an immense alien vessel. Yes, we had so many different aspects of

216
00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:39.480
seeing the Breen ship, so much
complexity to try to work with, from

217
00:15:39.759 --> 00:15:45.960
you know, flying Discovery into the
Shuttle pay which you know speaks to the

218
00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:52.360
immense size of this Dreadnaught, but
a lot of the establishing shots, a

219
00:15:52.399 --> 00:15:56.519
lot of the a lot of the
scenes that helped to just kind of deal

220
00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:02.440
with all the space dynamics of you
know, two ships dealing with a certain

221
00:16:02.480 --> 00:16:06.320
situation. It was just very well
done. I can imagine him, you

222
00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:08.399
know, going through the storyboard process
with the you know, a ship in

223
00:16:08.440 --> 00:16:11.919
his hand going like it would kind
of tilt like this, That just seems

224
00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:15.480
like it could be a lot of
fun. But yeah, and Freakes definitely

225
00:16:15.559 --> 00:16:19.440
knows how to give you those camera
angles that will match the characters in situations

226
00:16:19.519 --> 00:16:23.879
with action, you know, with
drama, whatever it is. I almost

227
00:16:23.879 --> 00:16:30.320
called him Riker Frakes does an incredible
job of doing that and building that tension

228
00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:33.960
throughout the episode, which he's done
in so many episodes that you mentioned Wayne,

229
00:16:34.559 --> 00:16:37.360
even in First Contact, he did
so good with it. But seeing

230
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the brain on screen like that and
seeing you know, the camera angles he

231
00:16:41.879 --> 00:16:45.559
chose and the movements of the camera
that we see, he really does such

232
00:16:45.559 --> 00:16:49.480
a good job with grabbing what's going
on on screen and just building it that

233
00:16:49.600 --> 00:16:53.480
tension up and just does it so
well. Yes, he does. Yeah,

234
00:16:53.639 --> 00:16:57.039
really, do you have one little
issue with the episode? Of course,

235
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you know, the tricky in me
has to to tell me you got

236
00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:03.759
to pick what I picked? Go
ahead, Well, what was up with

237
00:17:04.119 --> 00:17:07.880
them pulling the hose out of the
back of the brain suit? Uh to

238
00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:11.759
in catacitate it? I mean I
was under the impression that the brain suits

239
00:17:11.799 --> 00:17:15.559
were more of a of a uniform, not like in an environmental suit.

240
00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:18.960
Grease. We've seen them, you
know, we've seen them breathe and outside

241
00:17:19.039 --> 00:17:23.319
the the you know, with with
Locke, yeah or not, you know,

242
00:17:23.400 --> 00:17:27.160
And so that really didn't make any
sense to me. I mean,

243
00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:32.359
it was cool, but I I
don't know was it a mistake or not.

244
00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:36.119
I'm not sure. I do have
a possible solve for that, but

245
00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:40.680
it might be, you know,
it might be like BS dialogue. That's

246
00:17:41.000 --> 00:17:48.960
mean to do. So just the
sense that when Locke took his helmet off

247
00:17:48.799 --> 00:17:56.240
in the first second episode and there
was that kind of moment, or we

248
00:17:56.279 --> 00:18:02.319
saw the amorphous nature of their biology. I wonder if there's a certain period

249
00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:06.240
of adaptation they have to go through
to say, I'm making a conscious decision

250
00:18:06.319 --> 00:18:11.720
to adapt to the environment outside of
the suit, so I have to spend

251
00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:17.599
the time going through that change,
otherwise it would knock me out, not

252
00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:23.519
necessarily kill them. But it might
be previous state exactly exactly. I didn't

253
00:18:23.519 --> 00:18:26.079
think of that. That's that's a
very good explanation. Okay, Well,

254
00:18:26.119 --> 00:18:30.599
then I don't have a I don't
have a nigga anymore. I still have

255
00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:34.440
one. I still have one so
I know a lot's going on and a

256
00:18:34.440 --> 00:18:38.400
lot of stuff has happened with Burnham, but use this time to have a

257
00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:42.000
heart to heart with Book. Yes, yeah, I agree with that one.

258
00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:45.039
Yeah. Pulling off to the side
to be like, yay, let's

259
00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:49.720
get cozy and chat right, No, no, what if somebody walks by

260
00:18:51.000 --> 00:18:56.240
like that seemed kind of unnatural and
risky at that moment. But yeah,

261
00:18:56.319 --> 00:18:57.519
I mean again, I know a
lot was going on. You know,

262
00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:02.160
there's a continuing part from the last
episode. You know, they just escaped

263
00:19:02.200 --> 00:19:03.400
the Dreadnock. You know they're trying
to get this ship fixed. They didn't

264
00:19:03.400 --> 00:19:07.240
have a lot of time, but
I still don't think that was the moment

265
00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:10.079
to do it. There's a time
and a place. Yeah, and that

266
00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:12.640
was not it. I'll definitely tell
you that. It seems like it seemed

267
00:19:12.680 --> 00:19:17.240
like there was a little bit of
time between last episode and this episode where

268
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:21.599
that could have been done. It's
gonna great, this is great. I'm

269
00:19:21.640 --> 00:19:25.359
glad, but your timing really sucks. We gotta go, we gotta go,

270
00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:30.119
come on, come on. I've
talked about this character quite a bit

271
00:19:30.279 --> 00:19:33.119
over I don't know how many episodes, but quite a bit. Rayner again.

272
00:19:33.559 --> 00:19:38.160
Guys, when he's on the bridge
taking charge. He's just so good

273
00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:42.279
at it. But I don't know
who mentioned it, Scott Wayne episode ago

274
00:19:42.359 --> 00:19:45.880
or two episodes ago, that he
never gets into the captain's chair. That

275
00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:49.640
was he was addressed. It was
finally addressed in this episode by Tilly.

276
00:19:51.400 --> 00:19:53.960
Happy to hear that. Yeah,
I loved that. And when she went

277
00:19:53.960 --> 00:19:56.720
over and tis like, you know, if he's not good, he's avoiding

278
00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:00.279
it, you know, getting out
again. Yeah, he's putting it the

279
00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:03.000
plague. We've all noticed it,
you know, and it's like it's true.

280
00:20:03.480 --> 00:20:07.160
And then when she tried to confront
Rainer about it, you know,

281
00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:11.200
it was he really you know,
I don't think he gave her an answer,

282
00:20:11.200 --> 00:20:14.359
a direct answer. It was basically, you know, and I thought

283
00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:15.359
it was a credit to her that
he picked her as number one, of

284
00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:19.200
course, but it's basically, you
know, don't don't question what I'm doing.

285
00:20:19.240 --> 00:20:22.759
I guess maybe is what it was. Who was his answer to that,

286
00:20:23.200 --> 00:20:26.839
if we were stuck in a foxhole, I wouldn't kill you for giving

287
00:20:26.839 --> 00:20:29.640
me the warm and fuzzy encouragement that
I don't need. Yeah, there you

288
00:20:29.680 --> 00:20:33.960
go. Yeah, Yeah, And
it's just I love Rainer so much he's

289
00:20:33.000 --> 00:20:37.000
become one of my favorite characters in
this season. Well, I'll see your

290
00:20:37.079 --> 00:20:42.640
Rayner and raise you Atilly, because
I think the relationship in here those beats

291
00:20:42.640 --> 00:20:47.880
that we've already mentioned in particular,
but I also noticed kind of a subtlety

292
00:20:48.039 --> 00:20:56.400
when Tilly catches herself saying too much
yeah and says thank you for your yes,

293
00:20:56.440 --> 00:20:59.400
we'll do that, and it's almost
like she was cutting words, right,

294
00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:04.039
yeah, So she is meeting him
halfway and acknowledging that he has to

295
00:21:04.079 --> 00:21:10.440
do the same, but giving him
room to do so. And when she

296
00:21:10.559 --> 00:21:12.880
mentions that on the bridge, it's
not in a way that calls him into

297
00:21:12.960 --> 00:21:17.960
question or whatever, and he's receptive
to it, right. He says that,

298
00:21:18.079 --> 00:21:18.920
you know, if we were in
a foss law, I wouldn't kill

299
00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:22.799
you, with kind of a rye
kind of smile on his face, right,

300
00:21:23.640 --> 00:21:29.119
And it shows that their relationship has
grown, and I think that's going

301
00:21:29.200 --> 00:21:33.160
to advance her so much as a
teacher and a leader, and him so

302
00:21:33.279 --> 00:21:38.160
much more as a commander and eventual
captain, because I know he's headed back

303
00:21:38.200 --> 00:21:44.039
to that seat. Was yes,
and that was a great beat to point

304
00:21:44.079 --> 00:21:47.559
out that idea. And then finally
at the end of the episode for him

305
00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:52.240
to not only take the chair but
to almost kind of give his you know,

306
00:21:52.440 --> 00:21:56.920
engage kind of phrase right when he's
sitting in it. Oh yeah,

307
00:21:56.960 --> 00:22:02.960
And it's so much has changed for
him and the crew because remember the crew

308
00:22:03.039 --> 00:22:07.000
really was just not fond of him
at all. Nobody was and even if

309
00:22:07.039 --> 00:22:08.880
as an audience were kind of like
he was rubbing us the wrong way,

310
00:22:10.200 --> 00:22:12.440
especially how he was wanting to learn
who everybody was. He didn't want to

311
00:22:12.440 --> 00:22:17.000
take the time. But then over
the episodes, man, he has really

312
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:22.839
grown on us and he has become
such a great dynamic with Burnham, you

313
00:22:22.880 --> 00:22:26.359
know, the way they was to
communicate with each other. I mean you

314
00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:29.200
saw how Burnham, you know,
did what that via code that she did

315
00:22:29.599 --> 00:22:33.200
to get Rayner to realize what's going
on, you know, what to do.

316
00:22:33.240 --> 00:22:37.440
You know, Yeah, you're so
well done. But you know that

317
00:22:37.480 --> 00:22:41.680
final scene that opened in the Cliffhanger, when he does set down, it

318
00:22:41.759 --> 00:22:45.880
makes you think, you know,
he wouldn't sit in that chair because because

319
00:22:45.880 --> 00:22:48.920
Burnham was the captain, he had
raised respect for the captain's position. But

320
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:53.480
now he's set down, does he
you know, think that he's now the

321
00:22:53.519 --> 00:22:59.759
captain. Is Burnham gone? Could
be Yeah, yeah, entirely possible that

322
00:22:59.799 --> 00:23:03.319
he's kind of coming to terms with
that to say, you know, look,

323
00:23:03.359 --> 00:23:06.640
we need somebody in the chair,
literally in the chair, yeah,

324
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:11.039
because it's you know, it's coming
up to the end moment here, even

325
00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:14.559
though he's not like I'm about to
do this because it's almost the last episode.

326
00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:15.960
Got to get in and see when
I can. But more like,

327
00:23:17.119 --> 00:23:21.960
you know, Burnham might not come
back from this progenitor void, right,

328
00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:25.440
and she might not, but we
don't know. I mean, this is

329
00:23:25.480 --> 00:23:27.759
this is the end game. We
don't know what's going to happen. And

330
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:30.799
you know, and I love Rainer's
Lyne. You know, failure is not

331
00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:33.680
an option, and it's it's not
because if they fail, that could be

332
00:23:33.720 --> 00:23:37.400
the whole universe, the galaxy all
going up because of the Bream. What

333
00:23:37.400 --> 00:23:41.119
they're gonna happen under their control,
we don't know. Yeah. I also

334
00:23:41.160 --> 00:23:44.960
thought it was kind of interesting that
this I didn't think about it until it

335
00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:49.000
was happening. But like a lot
of the Quest story arcs where you're solving

336
00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:53.200
puzzles and solving puzzles and solving puzzles, of course you get to the destination.

337
00:23:53.319 --> 00:23:57.920
It's just one more puzzle away from
being solved. Yeah, I'm sure

338
00:23:57.920 --> 00:24:00.279
that's gotta be a little bit.
There's got to be somebody on the ship

339
00:24:00.319 --> 00:24:07.240
that's like, really, come on, man, we're there just opening.

340
00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:11.519
But it'll be interesting to see where
they go. And there's kind of that

341
00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:17.400
teaser of Burnham's puzzle that says something
about the form where they all come together

342
00:24:18.119 --> 00:24:21.920
or something like that, and that
made me think it's got to be possibly

343
00:24:21.960 --> 00:24:26.160
something about the shared characteristics between all
the races the progenitors had kind of pointed

344
00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:29.240
out, or the fact. Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up too,

345
00:24:29.279 --> 00:24:32.839
because that also me think is Burnham
is the only one that knows that

346
00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:37.000
clue, that that's the actual clue
to make that to make the stuff work.

347
00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:41.559
And it makes me think that,
you know, one person, one

348
00:24:41.680 --> 00:24:47.759
race cannot activate this this technology,
but maybe all of them working together are

349
00:24:47.759 --> 00:24:52.480
more than one working together as a
whole as one could possibly make it actives,

350
00:24:52.480 --> 00:24:56.519
which which gives me thoughts about what
could happen next episode. You know,

351
00:24:56.839 --> 00:25:00.599
if you keep in mind who's inside
the void right now, I mean,

352
00:25:00.640 --> 00:25:03.160
are they going to somehow have to
come together and get it to work.

353
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:08.400
I don't know. Yeah, and
the whole foreshadowing too of Mole transporting

354
00:25:08.440 --> 00:25:11.680
Locke so that he could they can
preserve his body, and then she puts

355
00:25:11.720 --> 00:25:17.119
that on herself, so she basically
took lock with her when she went in.

356
00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:22.200
I have my theories of what's going
to happen, but I really don't

357
00:25:22.200 --> 00:25:25.759
know. I'm just just guessing.
Yeah. So, now that we've given

358
00:25:25.799 --> 00:25:29.000
our thoughts and opinions on the episode, let's take a look at the characters

359
00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:33.359
themselves. Which character do you think
shine the most this week? David,

360
00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:40.559
Oh, okay, that's one interesting. Sorry. Sorry, I'm going to

361
00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:44.079
choose Burnham for this one. You
know, she gets a lot off her

362
00:25:44.160 --> 00:25:48.960
chest to book, albeit in a
bad spot. She gets to pretend to

363
00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:52.759
be a Breen. She shows her
smarts as we know she is. She

364
00:25:52.799 --> 00:25:56.799
gets to kick some butt, all
the while showing extraordinary bravery by jumping into

365
00:25:56.799 --> 00:26:02.759
the portal not knowing what it will
do or where it will lead. That's

366
00:26:02.759 --> 00:26:06.079
why I thought it had to be
earning in this episod for me, Scott.

367
00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:10.480
For me, it was Adira earning
a place on the away team.

368
00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:18.039
Davin, you alluded to this before. We've seen so much growth and character

369
00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:23.720
development in that regard. And there's
been a lot of places where confidence is

370
00:26:23.799 --> 00:26:30.400
kind of shaken, where doubts have
kind of come up. They make brave

371
00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:34.039
and bold decisions that prove their right
for the job, and it's great to

372
00:26:34.039 --> 00:26:40.000
see their growth as a confident and
essential member of the crew thinking of you

373
00:26:40.039 --> 00:26:44.319
know, when we first met them, never would have guessed they'd be able

374
00:26:44.359 --> 00:26:48.839
to put on a Breen suit,
a counterfeit Breen suit, go on to

375
00:26:48.960 --> 00:26:56.880
a dreadnaught and not only get their
job done, but stand face to face

376
00:26:56.960 --> 00:27:00.519
and you know, dialogue wise,
engage in a way it was like,

377
00:27:00.599 --> 00:27:03.960
no, we're here, now,
move on, Like wow, that's that's

378
00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:07.400
a that's a big step forward.
Yeah, Wayne, what about you?

379
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:12.880
Well this week I think Rayner got
the center seat, well literally literally,

380
00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:18.359
but he's done an incredible job all
this season. You know, his character

381
00:27:18.400 --> 00:27:23.559
has really grown past that arrogant and
competitive ships captain we saw in that first

382
00:27:23.599 --> 00:27:27.599
episode, and you know, and
here in this episode we got to see

383
00:27:27.799 --> 00:27:33.279
one of his biggest leaps of character
growth that he's ever had, you know,

384
00:27:33.359 --> 00:27:38.119
finally sitting down, finally taking true
command of the Discovery and and of

385
00:27:38.119 --> 00:27:41.000
course you know, the way he
picks up Burnham's hint. I love that.

386
00:27:41.160 --> 00:27:45.000
I thought that was that was a
perfect way of connecting it. It's

387
00:27:45.440 --> 00:27:49.440
the whole crew were just fantastic.
They all work together so great. But

388
00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:52.559
with him at the top there,
I think that they have no chance of

389
00:27:53.200 --> 00:27:56.640
failing in their mission. I think
by the fact that each one of us

390
00:27:56.640 --> 00:28:02.240
picked someone completely different and had good
re for it just shows you how well

391
00:28:02.240 --> 00:28:06.279
put together this episode was exactly they
were all. They were all fantastic.

392
00:28:06.279 --> 00:28:11.359
There were so many characters this this
episode that that shined. Yeah, absolutely

393
00:28:11.440 --> 00:28:15.000
good pick. And I just think
think about how far this season and this

394
00:28:15.119 --> 00:28:19.880
series has come. Okay, there's
been a few moments where faith has been

395
00:28:19.960 --> 00:28:23.039
kind of shaken of, like oh
no, where is this gonna go,

396
00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:27.720
And especially in those first couple of
episodes, it was like, Okay,

397
00:28:29.880 --> 00:28:33.200
have faith, it's in track.
We can get through this. And Wow,

398
00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:36.440
it's really turned it around and I'm
glad to see where we are.

399
00:28:36.759 --> 00:28:40.799
Yeah. I remember our first thoughts, Scott. We talked about like,

400
00:28:40.839 --> 00:28:44.960
oh man, this is gonna be
a long yeas we weren't sure. Yeah,

401
00:28:45.000 --> 00:28:48.400
but you know, after that third
fourth episode we started getting into it.

402
00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:52.039
And look at we're right now,
absolutely all right. If you have

403
00:28:52.119 --> 00:28:55.599
the choice to be any character that
appeared in this episode, which one would

404
00:28:55.599 --> 00:28:59.640
it be? And why We'll begin
with you, Scott. Well, wait,

405
00:28:59.680 --> 00:29:07.079
I'm going to get into who you
just mentioned. Rayner gets to lead

406
00:29:07.119 --> 00:29:11.440
the Discovery crew in moments where we
see them at their best and finally sitting

407
00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:15.680
in the captain's chair despite all the
pacing that was going on. But I

408
00:29:15.799 --> 00:29:18.960
just feel like it would it would
be very tense, to say the least,

409
00:29:18.960 --> 00:29:23.839
to be on that Breen ship,
and there are so many opportunities to

410
00:29:23.839 --> 00:29:29.279
see various parts of the crew kind
of working together. I'd like to see

411
00:29:29.279 --> 00:29:33.000
them from his perspective, David.
So funny is how this is going to

412
00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:37.279
turn out is because I'm choosing Scott's
pick for the character to shine the most.

413
00:29:37.519 --> 00:29:41.079
I'm going with instant Howel, because
you know, getting chosen to go

414
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:45.400
on a dangerous mission, willing to
do that, showing that character growth,

415
00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:49.119
you know, being so brave,
and then getting to go on that ship

416
00:29:49.119 --> 00:29:55.599
pretending to be a Breen and getting
to explore that technology that you didn't get

417
00:29:55.920 --> 00:29:59.680
to see when you were on the
Discovery. Sure, it's very very danis

418
00:30:00.440 --> 00:30:03.000
sure you could probably get killed,
but you know sometimes you got to take

419
00:30:03.000 --> 00:30:07.759
those chances and just that feeling that
that that that you get, that that

420
00:30:07.880 --> 00:30:11.799
adrenalin high that you get, uh, when you go into a situation like

421
00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:14.480
I had to be something unreal,
but to just to be surrounded by people

422
00:30:14.559 --> 00:30:18.160
you know are going to protect your
back, you know absolutely, it's it's

423
00:30:18.160 --> 00:30:22.640
infant out and I'm gonna probably surprise
both of you and I'm chosen choosing a

424
00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:29.680
different one. I'm gonna say Leutenant
Commander Ashen because the are specifically the helmsman

425
00:30:29.880 --> 00:30:33.880
of the Discovery. You know,
there was some expert piloting there needed in

426
00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:37.279
this episode, you know, between
flying away from the black holes, yeah,

427
00:30:37.319 --> 00:30:41.720
and then flying into that brain shuttle
craft or shuttle bank excuse me.

428
00:30:41.119 --> 00:30:45.400
You know that really took some skill
and that that's the best place in the

429
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:49.319
ship in my opinion, to see
everything that happened, and and I'd love

430
00:30:49.319 --> 00:30:53.319
to be right there at those controls. You know, just just great position.

431
00:30:53.880 --> 00:30:56.920
Yeah, good choice, well,
especially considering the state that the ship

432
00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:03.079
is in right like how what percentage
of things are actually working? Because they

433
00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:07.720
had no time to get everybody focused
on this board drive let alone. Yeah,

434
00:31:07.880 --> 00:31:11.400
I will be shocked if Discoverment makes
it through through the rest of the

435
00:31:11.440 --> 00:31:18.960
season. Shocked. I agree,
I agree. All right, let's dive

436
00:31:18.039 --> 00:31:22.799
deep into the episode and see if
I can't pull out any Easter eggs.

437
00:31:22.799 --> 00:31:26.319
And this one was a hard one
there. There really wasn't too many in

438
00:31:26.359 --> 00:31:29.200
this episode because there was so much
action, so much going on. That's

439
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:33.400
there. There were a couple that
I saw. You know, there was

440
00:31:33.519 --> 00:31:37.200
mentioned that the Brain use transport tunnels
or contents to get around. That's that's

441
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:42.039
the same technology that the Board used
to get their Cube ships around, and

442
00:31:42.079 --> 00:31:45.880
it's it's also the way that Voyager
experimented to try to get back to the

443
00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:51.759
Alpha Quatter for a while, but
they're unfortunately the attempts turned Lieutenant Tom Parris

444
00:31:51.759 --> 00:31:56.200
into a salamander so that they abandoned
them, you know, like you Yeah,

445
00:31:56.839 --> 00:32:00.359
and I'm not sure if you guys
noticed, but those black holes and

446
00:32:00.400 --> 00:32:05.200
the way Discovery flies away from that's
very similar to how the Cerritos flies away

447
00:32:05.599 --> 00:32:09.319
from the black hole in the Star
Trek Lower Decks title sequence. Yeah,

448
00:32:09.359 --> 00:32:13.240
even the black hole is the same
design of exactly the same, So I

449
00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:16.839
mean I think that that had to
be in purpose and then one final one

450
00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:20.440
and way did I have to pause
this quite a lot to figure this out.

451
00:32:20.839 --> 00:32:23.559
That map that was briefly shown at
Starfleet headquarters, it mentioned a lot

452
00:32:23.599 --> 00:32:29.119
of planets that are with the Federation. The ones that I were able to

453
00:32:29.160 --> 00:32:34.839
pick off. There was Earth Trill
Teller, Ryan, Nubula, Andria Proximity,

454
00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:37.799
and Vega and Delta as well,
which really surprised me. You don't

455
00:32:37.799 --> 00:32:39.160
hear very much about that planet.
And there were a lot more, but

456
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:42.799
I just couldn't read them. They
were they were, they just went back

457
00:32:42.880 --> 00:32:51.160
too fast. Yeah, and those
planets, yeah, no man for punishment.

458
00:32:51.359 --> 00:32:53.079
I had to watch it twice to
pull out even those there. There

459
00:32:53.200 --> 00:32:55.839
was just too much action, too
much stuff going on right now to to

460
00:32:57.039 --> 00:33:01.599
really do any callbacks. Yeah,
good call All right. So now we've

461
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:06.319
seen that sneak peak clip from the
upcoming episode, Uh, what do we

462
00:33:06.319 --> 00:33:07.599
think is going to happen next?
I know we've mentioned already a little bit,

463
00:33:07.640 --> 00:33:12.599
but so say I think this episode
called what Life Itself? Yeah?

464
00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:15.920
Like ye, I have a feeling
the series is going to end. It

465
00:33:15.920 --> 00:33:24.000
feels like it didn't yet. You
might be correct on this and that that

466
00:33:24.039 --> 00:33:29.720
clip. I'm pretty certain that's probably
the very first scene of the episode.

467
00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:32.160
Yeah, it really seemed like one. It seemed like it was continuing right

468
00:33:32.200 --> 00:33:37.759
from where we left off at this
episode. I I mean, like we

469
00:33:37.799 --> 00:33:39.240
said before, I just don't think
the Discovery is going to survive. And

470
00:33:39.480 --> 00:33:44.359
you know it's pretty wrecked as it
is, and you know that's they got

471
00:33:44.400 --> 00:33:46.160
a battle coming out. See,
this is the way I've always said all

472
00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:52.440
along that these ships should have little
fighters to be sent out to fight while

473
00:33:52.480 --> 00:33:54.480
the big ship is getting fixed.
Because as you see, the Brain are

474
00:33:54.519 --> 00:33:59.799
sending their fighters out. According to
that scene we see in there, why

475
00:33:59.799 --> 00:34:02.720
do why does the Discovery or any
other starships not have ownership that they can

476
00:34:02.759 --> 00:34:07.519
send out to fight most of the
most of their enemies do? I mean

477
00:34:07.559 --> 00:34:10.280
you have the Rascians had it,
the Romulans had it, you know,

478
00:34:10.280 --> 00:34:13.800
now the Breen has it. You
know, those are the ones I can

479
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:16.400
pick up top of my head.
But no, we've got science shuttle crafts.

480
00:34:16.440 --> 00:34:21.639
So right, that's not going to
do the trick. Grab grab ds

481
00:34:21.800 --> 00:34:25.760
nine runabouts there we go. Yeah, quite quite a few phaser bays,

482
00:34:25.800 --> 00:34:30.800
aren't There were tough little ships.
Yeah, but guys, I knows.

483
00:34:30.920 --> 00:34:36.119
As I mentioned earlier too, I
really think we're going to lose through it

484
00:34:36.280 --> 00:34:38.320
just it had that vibe, it
had that feel to it. And again,

485
00:34:38.559 --> 00:34:42.920
I hope I'm completely off page here. I hope I'm completely wrong,

486
00:34:43.039 --> 00:34:45.920
and Through is going to be fine
because we all love him, you know,

487
00:34:45.000 --> 00:34:49.519
he's like, he's among one of
our favorite characters, but he's so

488
00:34:50.440 --> 00:34:54.679
he is Wayne as you would know. Yeah, I just think it's going

489
00:34:54.719 --> 00:34:58.599
that way. I really do.
Yeah, you're you're right, I think.

490
00:34:58.719 --> 00:35:00.079
I mean, it does have that
feel. I mean, I don't

491
00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:04.480
know if it's be Saru, but
I just don't think that they're all going

492
00:35:04.519 --> 00:35:07.760
to be it. Yeah, yeah, And I do think maybe something to

493
00:35:07.800 --> 00:35:16.079
consider is that it feels odd to
lose Saru in this tenth episode because he

494
00:35:16.159 --> 00:35:23.360
hasn't necessarily been as involved in Discovery
as before, right, So it almost

495
00:35:23.440 --> 00:35:29.719
seems like I'm back to die,
right, versus maybe, you know,

496
00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:34.760
completing the arc and maybe making it
so that he Maybe it's that he never

497
00:35:34.840 --> 00:35:39.280
truly reunites with the Discovery crew the
way that he would want to. He's

498
00:35:39.519 --> 00:35:44.239
having to, you know, watch
from a distance, possibly on another ship,

499
00:35:44.639 --> 00:35:50.920
right to help them through whatever they're
they're going to do. There is

500
00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:53.920
part of me that kind of hopes
that I'll forget the trailer before we see

501
00:35:55.480 --> 00:36:01.480
the next episode, because there were
certain moments where you see and I won't

502
00:36:01.480 --> 00:36:07.159
say any thing because it's happening tomorrow, but certain characters interacting with other characters.

503
00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:09.800
That makes it kind of like,
oh, okay, so now I'm

504
00:36:09.800 --> 00:36:14.960
going to be waiting for those characters
to interact in some way. And it

505
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:19.599
might be a flashback, it might
be you know, we get a Benjamin

506
00:36:19.639 --> 00:36:24.920
Cisco kind of treatment and there's you
know, certain characters ascending to higher planes

507
00:36:24.920 --> 00:36:30.199
of existence or something like this.
But I'll be very interested to see where

508
00:36:30.199 --> 00:36:35.360
it goes. I would I'd be
willing to bet that Discovery is not even

509
00:36:35.480 --> 00:36:39.639
usable anymore at the end and we
go onto a Discovery B which you know,

510
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:44.519
in some kind of commemorative moment or
something like that. But I do

511
00:36:44.559 --> 00:36:47.320
agree it does feel like we're gonna
one of the crew members is going to

512
00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:50.960
lose their lives, and without doubt
to see who it's going to be.

513
00:36:51.199 --> 00:36:57.000
Ye, And that's it for this
penultimate episode of Phasers. Set to Stunts

514
00:36:57.039 --> 00:37:00.679
look at Discovery Season five, episode
nine, we'd like to open a channel

515
00:37:00.719 --> 00:37:05.159
to our listeners and hear what you
thought about the most recent episode and the

516
00:37:05.199 --> 00:37:07.880
season in general. Who knows you
might even get mentioned on a future show.

517
00:37:08.679 --> 00:37:13.360
Thank you David and Scott for joining
me and the listeners for another fascinating

518
00:37:13.400 --> 00:37:19.199
discussion. Next episode, as we
mentioned, is titled Life Itself, and

519
00:37:19.239 --> 00:37:22.519
we wrap up not only season five
Discovery, but the series itself. Will

520
00:37:22.519 --> 00:37:28.519
this series end on a high note
with a finale worth remembering or will we

521
00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:32.000
have another? These are the voyages
we look forward to returning to the thirty

522
00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:36.679
second century one last time next week
on Phaser's Set to Stunt