Brad Bird - The Iron Giant

0:00 So I was just thinking the other day we're about we're like a month away from the true forty fifth anniversary of Superman the movie, Scott, I was just I'm still like in all of the episode that you and David did on a Film at forty five earlier this year. Yeah, you guys had that, Yeah, that great, that lovely introduction by Valerie Perne. Yeah, and you had a conversation with Aaron Smolensky that Yeah, amazing, amazing features on that. That was fantastic because couldn't have asked for better guests. Well, Scott, it was hard to stay away from that episode for me, and since then I have been wanting to talk about another Superman film. If that's cool with you, Yeah, let's get into it, all right.

0:45 Well, let's talk about a film by Brad Bird, his nineteen ninety nine underrated animated classic, The Iron Giant. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to a film by a podcast. I'm Jeff Johnson, I'm Scott Hoffman.

1:30 So from the inception of this podcast, we always knew Brad Bird's directorial debut, The Iron Giant, was eventually going to be discussed on a film buy, and not only because in many ways it is a Superman film, but also because of how it handles some really complex themes. After listening to Scott discuss it on the Docking Base seventy seven podcast, Scott, you did that that awesome episode of the top seven non Disney movies. Yeah, it was a give. Yeah, it was a given that we had to invite our good friend Dayton Johnson here today. Dayton, welcome back. Hey baby, we are cool. Welcome to downtown Coolsville population. Yes, oh boy, well the this is gonna get live. So Dayton, listen. You're no stranger to the show. You've actually co hosted several times. You've been you were a fixture on our nineteen eighty six series. But for anyone listening for the first time, tell us a little bit about the Docking Based seventy seven podcast. Sure. Basically, what it is is me and a lot of my friends that helped me discuss a lot of cool things such as music, movies, comic books, books. Scott's been on there, You've been on there, and we always have a very good time. We like taking shots at each other from time to time and it's all good fun. But I'm very lucky to have a lot of people in my life that are knowledgeable and

3:00 bring a lot of good information to the episodes, anything from you know, our first season we talked about West Side Story, and recently we've talked about we did like, you know, a series of nineteen seventy six albums, you know, and stuff like that, you know, the Muppets and you know, all kinds of crazy stuff. And it never ceases to amaze me that the people I have on make raise the level of the episodes. And so it's been a lot of fun, and I'm looking forward to next year and you know, we have a lot of planned for that as well. So I already have most of next year planned because you know, why not if you have not heard it, you've got to check out Docking Based seventy seven. There is a there is a just a plethora of awesome content on there with with a lot of other great folks. Dayton, we're talking about The Iron Giant, and we typically talk about a director's underrated films. Is it fair to say this is an underrated film even though it's a beloved classic?

4:00 Oh? Absolutely. The fact is it took time for it to gain that kind of feel, you know, I still meet people today that had ever seen it. And in fact, one of my regulars on the show, Disney John, hadn't seen it until we did that episode of the top seven underrated you know, non Disney animated movies. He hadn't seen the movie yet, so I made him, no, you got to watch that after this is over. And it's because the reason it failed at the box office because Warner Brothers was stupid. Yes, they didn't because of Quest for Camelot tanked so bad the prior year. They didn't put any money behind the marketing.

4:40 They didn't even put a teaser poster out until April, and this came out at the end of August, so it's like they didn't even care and they didn't even really make any effort to spend the money on it. I will say they did leave Bradbird alone during production for the most part, but at the same time, they didn't publicize it. They didn't even realize what they had until they went to advance, you know, to early pre screenings, and it had the highest numbers of any of the movies over the last fifteen years. So it was so late in the game and it came out the same day that, you know, the Sixth Sense came out and it got buried by that. The same summer, then the live action Inspector Gadget came out, the Matrix, you know, American Pie. It was a packed summer and so it just got buried so much so that when it came out that November, we were all working at Suncoast. At that point, I tried to get people to buy that movie. It was a great Christmas gift. You need to buy this movie. There was like, what is this? Nobody knew it was. And even today, even though there was a special edition you know figure at cons and things like that. It's it's similar to what happened with The Night Remember before Christmas. It was years before that became a thing. You know, it takes time, and you know, even today, like I said, I still meet people that have not seen it and don't even know what it is. So it's it breaks my heart because it needs to be seen. Yeah, it opens like I think, in fourth place, and a few weeks later it's gone, It disappears.

6:08 It made a fraction of its budget. Yeah, Scott, for the people that haven't seen The Iron Giant, tell us what it's all about So, it's nineteen fifty seven in Maine. Sputneck has launched a space race panic and kids are learning to duck and cover in response to the threat of atomic holocaust. It's probably the worst time for a giant robot to crash land just offshore this little corner of a semi paranoid Americana. But when a ten year old boy saves his life, they quickly become friends. They spend a few days in the fall learning about life, joining the occasional Superman comic, flying a few cars, and figuring out the difference between food and art. That's the robot, that's the robotic giant learns to become more than what he was designed to be. That's a comedy adventure that asks a simple question. What if a gun had a soul? If that gun decided it didn't want to kill, could it be something more? Does it design strictly define its destiny?

7:05 Or could it be? Could it be who it chooses to be? This underrated, underappreciated animated classic challenged the standards of animated movies, broke the Disney mold, and quickly became revered as a cinematic masterpiece. Fantastic Scott appreciate well done so nineteen ninety nine. Who saw this in the theaters? I missed it because by the time I went to go, Seattle was already gone. I believe I saw it in the theater. I'm having a hard time remembering whether I did or not, but I know at the time I was absolutely ravenous for Warner Brothers animation. We had already had tiny tuted adventures, we already had animaniacs, we had the absolutely gorgeous Batman, the animated series, and The Mask of the Phantasm. So I know that if I had heard about this at the time, I'm going to be in a theater, but it's probably a fairly quiet theater, because yeah, this did not get marketed the right way. It didn't get released at the right time, and even though it was generating all this buzz, it was just a crime it didn't have more revenue in the theater. I remember I saw this in the theater, and it was because I missed the showtime for the sixth sense, and it was one of it says I was like, well, you know this might be I'm already here. Maybe it's gonna be good. I have never been more thankful to be late to a showtime because I loved it.

8:39 I've loved it from the first time I've seen it. It's one of my favorites. Now, this cast, not only is it brilliant, but there is a huge amount of casting what IF's attached to this project, and I know we don't have a whole lot of time to get deep into them, but I do want to cover several of them. Let's start with uh, let's start with Eli Marienthal, who plays Hogarth Hugh's now this kid. He's already on the map because he's playing Stiffler's little brother in two American Pie movies and Scott you mentioned DC Animation. He is the voice of Robin in several DC animated projects. Yeah. I love him in this Yeah. Yeah, he does a fantastic job. Is One thing I noted was his voice cracking is a perfect compliment to this character at this age. Yeah, it just fits so smoothly, and he's very relatable. You know, he's still exploring, still figuring life out subtle movements like when he's fidgeting on this on the barstool. I know that's not necessarily the voice work, but his delivery in This is so genuine and plays such a great range. Hats off to Eli.

9:54 He does such a great job conveying so many different emotions and a lot of fear, you know, when he's trying to convince the robot to stop, when he's running towards the town, or when he's spinning him around in the car and he's, you know, yelling, you know, we're landing, We're landing, and you know, to make your voice sound like you're spinning around in like, you know, like eighty ninety miles an hour and make it believable. That's not easy to do. But he conveys so many different emotions, and I got to say he's a much more likable character here than he ever was in the American Pie movies, you know, just saying, and I think he was the Tim Drake crobbin right. Yes, Yeah, that was, Oh my god. That was at a time when the writing on animated series was astonishing. It's interesting, Dan you mentioned that the we're landing scene. I saw it in a documentary. He was having a hard time making his voice shake like that, so Brad Bird actually went and physically shook Eli while he was delivering that line. I believe that. Yeah, I do too. That's awesome in a nice way. But yes, I'll tell you one thing that I've always struggled with with the film. I love this film. Uh. One of the more more obscure things. This kid's name is Hogarth Hughes. Now, obviously Hughes is derived from from Ted Hughes, who wrote the book. Do you anyone want to take a crack at where Hogarth comes from? Because I was like, oh that okay,

11:26 now that makes sense. Good question. I have no idea, You have no idea? All right, Dayton. His name partially comes from an artist, uh, burn Hogarth Hogarth. So that's where the other part of the name comes from. Was an artist I don't know much. Yeah, I don't know much about that, that artist, but that's where I did read that, Burne Hogarth, who was famous for illustrating the Tarzan comic strip. So yeah, very little interest, little love to uh to the the writers and animators of Old Hogarth Hughes. Hogar's mother Annie played by Jennifer Aniston. Now, she's about four to five seasons deep into friends, wildly popular.

12:09 She beats out the likes of Nicole Kidman, Sarah Michelle Geller and Meg Ryan, among others. So the question is, and she was like she was Warner Brothers first choice at this point. Also, Scott, I'll start with you. Let's say Jennifer Anison passes on it, who you picking up. I'm gonna have to probably lean into Sarah Michelle Geller because I know that she's also done great voice work, and I think you need the kind of youthful performance that Jennifer Aniston gave. I don't know that Meg Ryan at the time would have been the right pick. Dating is SMG the right call? No, I would have been okay with that. But there was one name that I saw that I really would have liked, and I'm gonna pick Julianne Moore would have been my second choice. That's right, Yes, she was.

13:03 She was. I shore her voice, and she could play the mom very well, and I think she would have brought a little bit something more. I mean, Anaton did a very good job, but in an alternate universe, Julian Moore playing the mom would have been very interesting. Yeah, I agree with that, all right. Harry Connick Jr. Is the UH is in the role of Dean mccoppin You know he's our our cool beatnick artist. Yes. Now now bird Bird wants someone who can capture that beatnick voice, and allegedly Dayton Johnson is unfortunately too young at the time. He goes up against Matthew Broderick, Steve Martin, Robin Williams, Brad Pitt, John Cusack, and John Travolta. And I know the studio was really hot for Brad Pitt, which I don't I don't know if that might have been when Pitt and Anna's more dating. Maybe that was the combo there that they're looking at.

14:01 But I don't know thoughts on some of these alternate options Dayton. The only other one that I would have accepted would have been John Cusack because I adored John Cusack. He he has a good voice for it. But I just don't know if anybody is as good as Harry Conic Junior. So I mean that was that was inspired casting. Yeah, Yeah, his relaxed, easygoing tone, like it's the the same kind of delivery that I was loosed seeing in like Memphis Bell. Right. Yeah, he's got a great range of going from like exaggerated comedic delivery when he's got a squirrel climbing up his pants to you know, when he's you know, just relaxing when Hogarth is on his caffeine high. I totally agree with your answer, Dayton. I can't see Brad Pitt because I feel like he would have had brought in too much pressure from a studio to say, we've got this big name, we've got to give more to Dean, We've got to lean into his character more and maybe more of a romance happening with with Annie, and I don't know, wouldn't have been right. I don't know about that because like this is two years after he does True Romance where he plays Floyd, and I could totally see someone like Floyd voicing Dean. See, Floyd was way too stoned to be Dean. Yeah, but like let's let's imagine a sober Floyd.

15:31 You know, who's who's who has no weed? I don't know, no, listen, Harry Connet Junior is the perfect choice against all those guys. But uh that here's where it gets weird when when you come to casting choices. Christopher McDonald, who was obviously famous as Happy Gilmore, shoot McGavin before he's cast. It's a who's who of iconic actors considered for the role. Talking about Lance and Rickson, who would have been cool, well, maybe a little dark and creepy too dark, Willem Dafoe, which we're not leaving the creepy category just yet, Kevin Spacey, Patrick Stewart, James Woods, who I definitely could have seen James Woods doing it. And then it gets even weirder, Dennis Hopper and Arnold Schwarzenegger, Schwarzenegger being the studio's number one pick. No, they're wrong, They're absolutely wrong. That's very wrong.

16:32 Could what kind of movie or do we have when Schwarzenegger is is Kent Mansley? You know, well you saw what happened with Batman and Robin moving One. You know he's could you just hear him? Like here the sports, where's the where's the giant? How does that work for? You know an American? You know, I have a government official. It doesn't make sense to me. Sorry, I have I have no idea. Uh. Assuming all these actors wanted the part, though, who would you cast? Would you stick with Christopher MacDonald Dayton or would you look at someone like like a Willum Dafoe or James Woods? Okay, so I would after thinking about it and what a fantastic job he did as Hades and Hercules. I could probably accept James Woods, but the character is just I mean, the character is so foul and awful that I guess James Woods would work too. So, but yeah, you know, it's it's hard for me. I could accept that one. I could accept him. How about it, Scott, He is the only name that I would accept. I feel like he would miss some of the smug intonation that we got from Chris. He definitely has the right delivery for that, you know, like you mentioned Tiger Sport chief, how about it? Stuff that's that's so sure, make evin it came.

18:00 But yeah, James, what is the only acceptable alternate there? Now? With the role of general roguard? There are some exceptional names bandied about. I'm happy with who got it, But before John Mahoney takes the role, they're looking at Kirk Douglas, Jack Nicholson, John Learriquette and r Lee Ermey, And I got to say, any one of those names would have hit it out of the park. I think s the line that they would have to read is you just blew millions of Uncle Sam's dollars out of your butt. That's the one I want to hear them say before me. I pick somebody. See, I've got another read they need to do. Where's the Giant Man's Ley? That's what you have to read in five different ways.

18:52 John Mahoney, you know, as I'm I'm sure we'll come up at some point on the Crane scrutiny. It was amazing and Fraser and he had absolutely the right delivery for this. I think it's interesting that John Larrickett would have been an alternate because it just makes me think of his role in Stripes. Yes, but I think he would have had the same kind of seasoned authority that you needed as a foil to Kent, right the Kent was like I'm just here to make a name, and he's like, no, you got to think about these things more on. And he just has such a great way of like that kind of gruff aspect of his voice when he's just laying into Kent. You've got to have that kind of tone. Yeah, if they're if they're reading where Where's the Giant Mansley? I could totally hear Nicholson or Douglas doing it. If they're doing Dayton's line about blowing billions of dollars out of the government's butthole. That's ur the Army all the way. Yes it is, and they probably happened to censor in quite a bit. Yeah, Scott, I I appreciate you know you mentioned Jah Mahoney, obviously famous for playing Martin Crane on Fraser. And since you brought up the Crane scrutiny, I don't have to do a shameless plug. But uh, I'll let I'll let my my good buddy Jason Covin do it. Here's him talking about the Crane scrutiny. Adi. Guess what. Okay, I'm doing a Fraser

20:26 podcast, even though you wouldn't do it with me. I'm sorry. It's a terrible idea back before they reboot the entire series. Now it's not such a bad idea, Okay, I know. So. Our buddy Jeff Johnson is joining me. We're recapping the new Fraser series on Paramount Plus. If you like Fraser to talk about the old Fraser, we're talking about the new Fraser show. Come check us out over there. You know, I don't know if everybody knows, but Jason is the guy who came up with a brilliant name for our podcast of surely you can't be serious. Thank you. And the name of this podcast is also it's called Crane Scrutiny. Could not pick a better title. Thank you. That's very good. Jeff actually came up with that, so good job, Jeff. Yep, we're gonna have fun. Check us out the Crane Scrutiny covering the new TV show. And I've heard your first episode, covering the first two episodes, and I loved every second of its. Yeah, all right, Now you know, we got James Gammon, Chloris Leachman, m em Att Walsh, one of our favorites from nineteen eighty six. They've got some fun. They're having some fun in some supporting roles. And then there's Vin Diesel as the Iron Giant.

21:34 Now, you know, when we think about Vin Diesel, obviously he's he's Dominic Toretto. He's the voice of Groot. But before he became a superstar, you know, prior to this movie, he's an uncredited orderly in Penny Marshall's Awakenings, which you know, I think Brad and I missed that. In our Awakenings episode, he writes directs and stars in an indie called Strays, And of course he has that small role in Spielberg saving Private Ryan now before he gets the job. And Scott, I believe you even dropped this nugget on Dayton's podcast. Bird's considering the elite of voice actors, you know, James Earl Jones, Peter Collin, Frank Welker, and Sean Connery who you know, you gotta remember this is following his role as the Dragon in nineteen ninety six? Is Dragon Hart, right, Vin Diesel's the choice though, that's the way to go, right, Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I mean, just from their perspective of thinking of Brad Bird being such a big fan of classic Disney Jungle Book things like this the Nine Old Men, which we're talking about a little bit later. His voice, I think is very reminiscent of one of the classic voice actors for Haunted Mansion, the guy who sings the actual song who did a lot of different voices, Tony the Tiger and things like that. I feel like Vin's performance is very reminiscent of that and brings forward some of those uh kind of voice acting talents without not

23:11 necessarily being a famous name yet in his own regard. Dayton thoughts on Vin's performance, Oh, it's spectacular. I mean he I did read. They've used very little effects on his voice, so a lot of what you're hearing is him just destroying his voice and everything else. And with as little as he says, there's quite a bit of emotion in there, you know. And he did a very good job. It's probably one of my favorite performances from him. Know, he only speaks fifty three words total in the whole movie. Yeah, I'm in full agreement with you. Let's take a quick break. When we come back, we're gonna we're gonna talk about some of the people behind the scenes, all right, So we got we got some interesting names to discuss here that that that that go into making this film what it is. Pete Townsend, lead guitarist and founding member of the who is an executive producer and we'll have more on his involvement when we discuss the film's background. But speaking with music, let's talk about Michael Cayman for a second, the composer. When I think children's movie, I don't know if I'm looking at the guy that gave us the dead Zone lethal weapon, die Hard Roadhouse, The Last Boy Scout and Last Action Hero. I mean, I'm glad he got it, but that's not exactly the resume. You want to do a children's animated movie, right, Well, I don't know. I think if you're a brad Bird, it probably is because he doesn't want safe

24:45 Disney Classic animated. He wants to He wants to go full into it. He made a statement at one point saying, like, you know, Disney is Mickey Mouse and Warner Brothers is Bugs Bunny. It's got to be edgy, it's got to be a little bit different. And I think he I think he nailed it, especially some of the and with some of the choices where he decided to dial back certain choices, certain scores for certain scenes. I think he had great choices. This is one of those moments where I would love to hear Brad Bird's temp track, because when Michael Cayman shows up, the temp track is basically a collection of Bernard Hermann fifties and sixties sci fi music, and he's like, what am I? I don't even know what I'm supposed to do with this or how I'm supposed to how I'm supposed to cover this that would have been cool to hear. Yeah, for sure, Dayton thoughts your thoughts on the Iron Giant score, Well, it actually made my top seven movie scores list, and we did that episode. I bought the Mondo edition of the South of the Music score which sits behind me.

26:00 It's beautiful. Monda do his great work with their line of releases. I love it. Michael Kane has always kind of been one of those names I look for in the credits and look forward to his scores, and he did a great job. And to Scott's point, there's some things he left out, you know, some things that are a little toned down, but then when it needs to be it needs to punctuate a scene. It definitely does that without overpowering what's going on on the screen. So it's a great score. Brad Bird writes a treatment for the film and gives it over to Tim mccanley's. Mccanley's gets the job because Bird looks at his unproduced script for what would become Secondhand Lions, that really great movie with Michael Caine and Robert Duval. He's also known he pitches a TV series called Gotham about the rise of a young Bruce Wayne with Clark Kent as a recurring character, and the CW picks it up. You guys familiar with this this show. M Yeah, well, I'm not talking about Gotham on Fox. I'm talking about Smallville because the studio actually took that premise and said, yeah, let's do this.

27:18 They turn it into Smallville for the CW. That blows my mind when I think about that. Wow, that worked out pretty well. Yes, yes, that's an amazing show. Yeah. Now obviously this comes uh, you know, credited as a writer, you know, basically for the source material, the author of The The Iron Man. Talking about Ted Hughes. I'm gonna get a little dark here. If you don't know anything about Ted Hughes, Uh, you know, famous poet married to another famous American poet, Sylvia Plath. She would become known as as as a martyr of the feminist movement. Following her suicide in nineteen sixty three, Hughes rights The Iron Man to comfort their children. Yeah. Very sad, very dark. Yeah, and it gets darker a couple of years later. It's nineteen sixty six.

28:17 He moves in with his uh, with his lover Asa Wayville. They have a child, and three years later, she kills herself and their daughter in a very macabre, similar manner as Sylvia Plath, did you know, using a gas of him. This this is tragedy for this guy. I can't I can't even imagine that. This is the this is where we get the Iron Giant from. You know, he's writing this as a means of coping, you know, as a means of you know, comforting his children. It's just it's just sad. Wow. Yeah, I don't even know what to say to that. Yeah, I knew about Sylvia Plath. I didn't know about that. Uh that subsequent deaths, that's that's horrible. But yeah, this this novel was a way to ease the kid's pain. The aspects of it, you know, things falling apart and being able to come back together again. We were able to get something, you know, hopeful out of that tragedy. But that's that's a horrible background. Well, let's talk about the background of this movie. And I know we'll be brief because there's so much to talk about. We could we could go down so many rabbit holes. But you know, we mentioned Pete Townsend. So it's in the nineteen eighties, Pete Townsend adapts the book for a concept album. You know, he's looking to duplicate the success of Tommy, and he releases The Iron Man, a musical in nineteen eighty nine. Dayton, you are one

29:48 of the foremost experts of music. I'm going to ask you, have you ever listened to this or you know you have any connection to this one? I have been It's been a very long time since I've actually listened to it. It's it's okay, you know, it's no Tommy. You know when I when I'm looking, when I'm looking to a knowledgeable critic on whether or not I should see something or listen to something, and the response is it's okay. Well that doesn't I'm not rushing right out to the record store to pick it up. No, it's like I said, it's it's no Tommy.

30:29 You know it it is. It's that. You know, it's fine. It's not great. It didn't blow my socks off or anything like that, and not enough for me to go out and visit it again. You know, I'm glad he got into it because it started a path. But yeah, do you remember if you heard it before or after seeing Iron giant. I think it's probably after because of the movie. To be honest, I heard about it. I heard about it prior, but I didn't seek it out until after the movie. Yeah, when they do a reissue of The Iron Man a musical, listeners don't look for Dayton to be writing copy on the on the back of it. Not gonna happen. So listen.

31:15 It's nineteen ninety one. Richard Baisley who becomes who would become a lead animator on the project. He pitches The Iron Man to one of the all time greats, talking about Don Bluth, and I know we all love Don Bluth. Yes, Baisley has a complete story outline, He's got character designs. Don Bluth looks it over and has has zero interest in it. Datan is this? Is this maybe a mistake on blues part? Did he miss a big one here? You know? I would have been very interested to see his take on the story. We don't get I don't think we get the we don't get the fun. I don't think from Blues's version, I think it'll be I think it'd be a little darker. You know. He kind of leads to that, which is fine and works very well for him, is it a mistake I don't know, because I mean, I don't think it's a mistake for him because he had such a career already that it probably does well. It probably does better because of him than it did with a Bird. But man, that's another alternate universe film I want to see, though. I would definitely want to see that because it definitely, just with with the Blue name, it's going to get the recognition and the cloud that it needs to be a big, big release, I think see. But

32:50 I think it would be interesting to see it, for sure. But I definitely think it wouldn't do as much for animation because there was so much, so many assumptions by the studios to say, like, well, I don't know if we can make the mega million dollar hits. That's more Disney's thing. I feel like it would have been kind of lumped into a certain type of animation and would have just continued to seem like the standard. It's possible that, you know, let's say he had the same kind of crew that is blending computer animation in subtle ways with the traditional hand drawn two D.

33:32 But I just feel like it was it was Brad's vision and his passion for challenging the standards of animation that made it what it what it is. Well, see if we're going to a Don Bluth iron Giant, I don't want to see computer animation because that's not what Don Bluth was about. I want to see I want to see black Cauldron Don Bluth. You know, that's that's what I want to see. I want I want that iron Giant. So true, I just feel like the studio probably would have also seen his name and said like, Okay, give us another American tale, give us a land before time, give us all dogs go to heaven, and probably saying like, where are the songs? And I was just gonna like, no songs, no songs in this one. Just let it tell a story.

34:20 I was clear on Dayton's podcast how I feel about songs and Disney movies. So I'm with you on that. Yeah, you know, the idea is clinging into life though at this point. Broadway director mcanough he adapted The Who's Tommy into a stage play with Townsend, and now he thinks it's it would make a great feature, and he's he plays a crucial role in getting it to land over at Warner Brothers. Now Ultimately, following the restructuring of Turner Feature Animation into Time Warner, the project is offered a Brad Bird, and we'll talk a little bit more about that when we discuss Bird's background. But Scott, I think this would be a good time to discussed the theme of the film and why Brad Bird chose to do it. You want to fill us in one on why Bird was at that point in his life, So, you know, similar to kind of the darker aspect that we were talking about with with Ted Hughes. At the time, you know, Brad was going through some personal transitions professionally and you know, having kind of a rough go So during this time he lost his sister, Susan, who was shot and killed by her husband. He was having a very rough time.

35:30 Like I said, he was a creative consultant on The Simpsons. But it ultimately kind of inspired that idea that I mentioned in the synopsis, kind of this thesis statement, what if a gun had a soul? What if a thing that was designed to kill didn't want to kill or didn't want to be a gun? And when he steps into a room and pitches this kind of simple thesis and then outlines the rest of the story to this board. There's a lot of murmurs around the room, a lot of people saying like, wait, hold on a second, We've got something here. And it was another example of turning a dark moment into something that could speak to a lot of people. I think that would be a good time to talk about the pivotal scene of this movie, and listeners were not talking about the climax of the movie. We're not talking about the popular scene that you probably saw in the trailer. We're just talking about a pivotal moment in the film that that speaks volumes to its story. I had the idea that we would probably all have the same scene in mind, but then Dayton quickly off Mike reminded me at the beginning of this like, I don't think so, So Dayton, I'm gonna ask you, what is the pivotal scene of The Iron Giant?

36:51 Okay, so my answer revolves around Kent and Hogarth. It's the interrogation scene when Hogarth comes home and he locks him in the barn, points that light at him, and he basically tortures a child. We learn how far Kent is willing to go. What a horrible person. This guy is, you know, he threatens his mom, he threatens to take him away from his mother. And only at that point does you know, Hogarth finally go. You know, he's in the junk yard, and he gives up because he doesn't want to lose his mom. He has to choose between his mom and this greatest thing he's ever found in his life, you know, kind of you know, even though it's like a kid, it's still kind of a father figure. You take that and put it with you know, Dean, and he gets the father he's been missing. So he's willing to give him up because he doesn't want to lose his mom. He already lost his dad.

37:50 He doesn't want to lose his mom. And then Kent drugs him. He chloroforms this kid, this child, puts him in his bed, and then nails the indoor shut so he can't get out. Oh my god. At that point, you know, you know, Mansley was funny and kind of annoying, but at that point I just wanted him to die. He was horrible. And then to me, anything that happened to him after the fact was too good for him, you know. And then and then of course they had that standoff where they stare at each other and Hogarth, you know, tricks him to thinking he fell asleep so they can get up. It's it's great because it shows that what how far Mansley was willing to go, and that Hogarth was smart enough to figure out Okay, I'm gonna give him up, but I'm going to figure out a way to still warn them as so they can prepare for the for the army. So there's a lot going on in those that short four or five minutes, and I think it speaks a lot to those two characters. I'll agree with that Mansley is is fun in a slapsticky kind of way up until that moment, and that's when he really becomes just like this turd scumb in. At least you want bad things to happen to him. This has got to go the worst character McDonald's ever played. I mean, if you look at every that he's terrible.

39:12 Worst character. Yeah, yeah, he is a villain. Scott. Is this your pivotal scene or did you have something in also mind? It is not. My pivotal scene is in the Junkyard. Wow, Okay, we're gonna have three different scenes here. I didn't. I didn't anticipate this, tell Us Scott. So for me, it's and if anybody has a chance, I highly recommend getting the signature edition of Iron Giant. It was a limited series, but it has a short in their era deleted scene called The Giant's Dream, which adds quite a bit, I think to this scene. But it's after Hogarth has talked through a bunch of comics with the Giant, and it's kind of interesting that, you know, Hogarth goes through you're kind of a range of comics from when you first see him, The Red Menace, which is kind of an interesting title for you know, Aliens from Above and Invaders from Mars Mad Magazine, The Spirit, which is a treatment that Brad Bird tried to get off the ground. And I'd love to see at some point a Tomo and action comics featuring Superman. So this is the scene that I'm thinking of, is where the Giant says, you know, he's he's got the sparking Hogarth has a sparking gun and he's playing that he's shooting at the Giant and he's like, hey, you're a tomo and he's like, no, no, Tomo, I'm Superman and he has the big s on his chest and then you know, Hogarth is trying to get the gun

40:45 to work, aims it back at him and he, you know, the Giant accidentally shoots at him. It triggers his defense mechanisms, and that's a scene where you see Dean react to you know, not expecting the Giant to be this kind of a thing, but seeing that he's a threat, and you see a lot of emotion from the Giant, like horrified that he could have possibly done this thing, completely unaware that that's who he is, and just as the snow starts to fall, And to me, that's that kind of pivot moment where it goes into all the you know, the action scenes and everything else that follows. I think it was just done perfectly. I don't know if it was Bird's intention, but that moment Scott, as you said, he the giant realizes what he's what he truly is what he's capable of, and he has that moment of shame. It reminds me of Frankenstein when when the Frankenstein monster throws the little girl in the water because he thinks all beautiful things go on the water after seeing her throw the thro the flowers in there. I love that moment and it does it does say a lot about who the Giant is. Now my pivotal scene again, dealing with the Giant and kind of learning, you know, becoming more self aware, becoming more human if you will. I got to go to uh to Hogarth teaching the Giant about death after they see the deer get shot. Mm hmm.

42:17 It's such a it's such a heartfelt moment. It's a sad moment because Hogarth, you got this nine year old boy explaining what death is and and how it comes all of us. But but that's okay because you know, we all we also have a spirit and the spirit lasts, you know, is everlasting. So great moment for Hogarth, great moment for the Giant. That that would be my pivotal scene. Yeah, that's a that's a great choice, I think. Yep. It's worth noting that when they watched that, the animation team, the production team got together to kind of watch that, you know, uh scene about the giant kind of talking about you know, what has a soul that it's a little separate from that, but the crew is weeping at you know. Storyboard level, really rough animation, and people just wept. That speaks a lot to the emotional weight of this movie.

43:14 I know there were some points when they thought about making some different choices, like the giant accidentally squishing the deer and being the one that would actually kill it. I'm very glad that they made the choice that they did because it speaks to the central theme of this of this movie, and in both of those moments, there are things that lead him to choose to be something else than what he was designed to be. On that note, let's take another break, and when we come back, we will talk a little bit about the man himself, brad Bird, and dip into his filmography. Okay, we are back. I'm assuming you guys probably already know most of what I'm about to drop on, but because our listeners may not, I will be I'll be brief because there is a lot to talk about brad Bird in a short amount of time. So Philip Bradley Bird was born in nineteen fifty seven, the same year as the Iron Giants setting. I don't think that's a coincidence. His parents, Scott, you mentioned this, briefly mentioned this.

44:22 His parents take him to see Walt Disney's a Jungle Book. When he's eleven, he decides then he wants to be an animator, and through a friend of his parents, he gets to take a tour Disney where he lets them know he'll be back one day to work and they're like, wow, who's this kid. At age fourteen, he completes his first animated short and mails it to Disney. This ultimately leads to an apprenticeship from the studio's Nine Old Men. Dayton, I can't think of anyone else that is more of an expert on Walt Disney. Can you give us a brief explanation of who the Nine Old Men are? Yeah? The Nine Old Men are basically the original animators that Walt Disney worked with when they started the studio. You know, they were responsible for, you know, the snow Whiteness of a Dwarfs and Sleeping Beauty, the early the early classic Walt Disney films that basically created the juggernaut that would become Walt Disney animation. Yeah. These these are the guys that put him on a scholarship to the California Institute of the Arts in the late seventies, and from there he goes to work for Disney. He's joining a new generation of animators because these guys have they have all kind of moved on that some of them are directing, some of them retired. But here's what what kind of fascinates me about brad Bird and the path he takes.

45:47 He becomes very critical of management and senior leadership and is openly criticizing them for their unwillingness to take risks. And when he's confronted by said leadership, he actually challenges him to fire him if they don't like what he has to say. Well, he's fired on the spot now. Before he leaves, though, he does receive credit for The Small One and The Fox and the Hound, but he goes uncredited for his work on Mickey's Christmas Carol and The Black Cauldron. That's two. That's two Disney works that I maintain are some of their best. And you know, Dayton, you you gave us an opportunity to talk about The Black Cauldron, yep, And I told you it's my number one Disney film, Don Bluth Black Cauldron. Knowing that Brad Bird was involved just makes me love it even more. So. He's got a portfolio of work he's bouncing around the studio system trying to get funding for an animated adaptation of Will Eisner's comic book The Spirit Again. Scott alluded alluded to earlier.

46:51 He gets involved with Ambulin does Amazing Stories. He's got a few episodes there. One of his story outlines becomes the film Batteries Not Included nineteen eighty seven, which he co writes, and from there he gets a job as an executive consultant on the first eight seasons of The Simpsons. He directs the season one episode Krusty Gets Busted, as well as the season three episode like Father Blake Clown and I think I think it's Treehouse of Horror seven maybe in ninety seven. That's like the last credit he gets on The Simpsons from you know, might need a you know fact check on that. But nineteen ninety five he joins Turner Feature Animation and starts fast tracking a sci fi feature called Raygun. He co writes that with Matthew Roberts, but a year later Turner merges with Time Warner and they make it clear they have no interest in ray Gun, but they do offer him several projects, one of which is the Iron Giant and as Scott told us, you know, he kind of he gets the project. He reads the book, becomes fascinated with it and sees that there's something there. So he doesn't have a big filmography, but if you guys are ready, I said, we jump into it. Yep, I'll do it. So it's worth noting. Like we talked about amazing stories, we talked about the Simpsons. He's the director of the Bartman Do the Bartman music video, which I know we all love when we were kids.

48:22 Following his directorial debut The Iron Giant in nineteen ninety nine, he goes on to what might be the best Pixar film ever created. Dayton is shaking his head already talking about The Incredibles. Absolutely. Yeah. I remember the first time I saw this in the theater and somebody asked me how it was. I said, well, the title tells you how good this movie is, because it's freaking incredible. It's so good. And it's one of those things that I laugh at Warner Brothers because they had this director who would go on to make multiple films for Pixar, and they had him and they screwed him. And I'll see you later. I'm gonna go somewhace else and you know, look what he's given us since then. It's just it's funny, and the Incredibles are It's my favorite Pixar movie of all time. Yeah, I agree with you. He was shopping The Incredibles around in the early nineties to some of these studios and none of them are binding on it. And I gotta feel like they're kicking themselves when this comes out in two thousand and four, because it is a blockbuster success and shows us, like, you know what, there's more to Pixar than just toy story. Yep, and I agree with you. This is this is their best. This is Pixar's best.

49:39 Yeah, it's it's it's stylistic. The style is cool, it's original, it has everything that it needs to succeed. The writing was phenomenal. Teaming up with Michael Giacchino for the music was inspired. Like, there's there's so much that's just stylistically cool about The Incredibles. It's one of my favorites of all time. Now. He over the next couple of years, he does a couple of shorts for Pixar. He's well, you know, there's like a Jack Jack short that that's uh, that's that's that's out there, which is fun. Yeah, two thousand and seven. His next feature Radatui.

50:22 I'm gonna go ahead and tell you I haven't seen it. What but I but I don't. I'm just not compelled to see it. You look dat you you're both shaking your heads at mess. I listened. I watched. I watched the trailer like a week ago because I was like, you know what I really want to get in this and just I don't know. Okay. It has an eight point one on IMDb and a ninety six meta score. Okay, I mean it is so much fun. The characters are fantastic and oh my god, it occurred to me that you haven't seen this movie much. It hurts me. You're you're I think I don't think you need to see the trailer first. I think you just need to spool it up and hit play. Yeah, agree, trust me, trust me.

51:09 Trailer does not do it justice. It really does not. Just thinking about like Brad Bird has this tendency to take really original ideas and give it so much style and heart, and it absolutely comes through in rat Tattoo as well. And you wouldn't necessarily think of that when like, if you look at the synopsis for what the movie is about, it doesn't seem like it has any opportunity for style or cool, but it absolutely does. Yep. Yeah, I just I watched the trailer and I see, I see a lot of things I don't like. France, rats, chefs. Just stop buying the trailer, man, trust us, trust us, give it two hours.

51:50 All right, I'll tell you what I will begrudgingly. I will go in. I'm gonna watch this and I you know me, you know, Dayton's over there with like the you know, the Pixar skull, ready to make me a true believer. Yeah, I'm just dating. I'm just thinking of a line. Uh, you know what your muscle through the gag reflex. Really, you guys aren't selling it, but I'll take I'll take a look at it. Oh my god, the humor in that movie is just on another another level. Yeah. All right, Well, before I upset you further, let's let's move on to twenty eleven, because I think we can all agree his first live action film is awesome. And I'm talking about Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol. Yeah, easily my favorite, my favorite in the series by far, totally agree, even with the new ones. You're saying, this beats fall Out, this beats oh yeah, oh yeah. Because Okay, when I heard he was directing this, I got all the feels because I love The Incredibles. I loved Iron Dry. It's like, I can't wait to see what he does live action because my brain imagined I just pictured all the stunts he'd put in, especially in The Incredibles. I'm like, he's going to do stuff like that live action, And he absolutely did, and he made it fun. He he there was interesting stuff in this movie. And I'm only sorry we got one, you know, I'm just sorry we only got one from him, because it's the other ones are good.

53:15 I'm not saying, but by far my favorite. Well. I think it's surprising to think. I mean, this is we're talking about a blockbuster franchise that's already established, and they're they're tapping an animation director who has, you know, no experience directing real people. Right, you know, It's it's surprising, but it's it's a pleasant surprise. Because Ghost Protocol it might be the best mission impossible film. I don't know, I you know, I recently watched all of them because we had the new one come out this this past summer. I'd have to I'd have to go back and do like a rack and stack. But it's definitely if it's not the top one, it's it's in the top three for me. Sounds like that's a future topic, Jeff, that's you. You'll find that on docum base seventy seven.

54:00 That's he. You know, I don't know if we can rack and stack. You know that sounds Dayton speed. We're gonna skip the second one though, we see No. I like, I like Whoa. I love what Jost does for the franchise. Yes, hold on Scott, Let's hold on Scott. Let's over that. Let's not gloss over. That's fine, that's fine. No, don't take John Wu's name in vain. That's I'm not. I'm not. I'm just saying, you know, it's the weakest of the bunch. You see. Got no. So twenty fifteen, he gives us tomorrow Land again. I have not seen this one, and it's not for a lack. It's not. It's not because I have ratituy vibes from it. It's because it's just one of those that got away right. It was like, I want to see it. I'll see it when I can.

54:53 But it didn't make a big hit. It wasn't big hit though, didn't make a big splash, right. Uh No, I did see it in the theater and we actually did an episode on that on Tomorrowland. And it's there's a book. There's a lot of good people involved. It's not a dud by any stretching the imagination. It's fun, it's visually amazing, it's a clever idea. And because of this movie, he passed on Star Wars Force Awakens. He was on the short list to do the first Star Wars the Disney era movies, and he turned it down because he was working on Tomorrowland. My hot take right now will be if he would have taken the Force Awakens, it would have been a better movie it. Yeah, No, I don't disagree. I don't disagree. Yeah, I think I think, you know, I mean, we we've kind of established Bird as a bit of a maverick. He will challenge the studio even if even if they if it means they're going to fire him. I think he puts his foot down on the four Awakens and and not to give us a cookie cutter nostalgia trip that JJ Abrams does kind of goes like, you know what, we're gonna do it my way or fire me, and maybe they're like, okay, well we'll fire you again. But yeah, I don't know.

56:13 I would have I would have loved to have seen his Star Wars film as opposed to what we got. That's that's what I'll say. And I do want to see tomorrow Land. It's just one of those you know. I was like the last zero Hour, I'm like, it's it's not streaming anywhere, all right, Well you can borrow my copy, you can borrow my right. I do think it's a shame that it's not streaming anywhere. I mean, I think the the trailer is captivating. Every single time I watch it, I'm like, Wow, just the camera work all alone is brilliant. But I think he made the right call at that time, because again, it's it's original, right, It's an original concept. It's something that he's been thinking about since the Iron Giant. When you watch the signature edition, you see in the the TV that the the Giant's hands watching instead of a Mapo commercial, it's a tomorrow Land Yeah, well that's the that's the signature edition. Yeah, that gives that because I know he wanted that, Disney said no. Then it becomes popular and the you know, signature edition is is great because there's a couple of deleted scenes that get put back in.

57:17 Yeah, we're just like raw animatronics and stuff, you know, initially, but yeah, tomorrow, land definitely want to see dating this is. This is George Clooney, right, yes, yeah, it's a fun movie. It's a fun movie. It's definitely worth seeing. All right, Well I'll tell you one that's definitely worth seeing. His last directorial effort, twenty eighteen's Incredibles Too. Everything you loved about The Incredibles, he takes it and then he just ramps it up more. This is one of This is the situation where the sequel. I'm like, you know what, the sequel is just as good as the original. It's not better. It wouldn't be.

58:00 I don't think it's better, but yeah, it definitely feels it literally feels like they made this right after they finished the first one. It's so incredibly seamless, and it's he I remember reading he was asked consistently and continually when are you gonna make a sequel to The Incredibles. Yeah, I'm waiting for a story. He waited and he's a patient, and you can there's gaps. There's big gaps between his films because he's waiting to make something he wants to make. And uh, and when we finally got the sequel, I'm glad we waited because it's it's great. You know, it's a lot of fun. No, no, mockey, I'm cool. I'm cool with that though, because I mean, it was only five years ago. It's not like he's been sitting on it for a decade. So if he's just like, if his main contention is you'll get it when the story breaks, then I'm all for it because I appreciate the fact that he's not just going to churn him out, you know, year after year, just to just to make a buck. Yeah, I totally agree. I can't wait for Sitibles three. I assume that it's going to happen because over ten years from now, we don't tend to get just you know, two movie franchises. But you know, it's it's about the family more than anything, right, And I have a feeling that there's that moment that we need to wait for where it's like that next milestone in a family's life would be great for that kind of that kind of movie and turning up you know what would be built as a superhero movie. The in the movie is brilliant and I just hope there's

59:32 another one coming out. Well, let's hope for it. Currently, IMDb lists his long gest ending projects nineteen oh six and Raygun as in development. Difficult to know if we're ever going to see those, But I've got I know what I'd like to see him do. But before I before I drop that on you, Dayton, if Brad Bird is going to do any film that you want, what is it going to be? Is he is? He? Is it animated? Is live action? What do you What do you got for Brad Bird? Uh? Honestly, well, I kind of alluded to it earlier. I want him to I want to see his Star Wars movie. I want them to either say, like tap into some of the old characters, like I think it'd be fun to see him do something with like Dash Rednar from Red Dar from the Shadows of the Empire, Shadows the Empire, right, Yeah, yeah, either take that kind of get a whole story around him, or maybe just have him create a whole story on his own. He does He does best when he has the story idea and he can kind of craft it himself. I mean, yeah, uh, the arm Giant was based on original material, but he added characters.

1:00:42 He kind of changed, you know, some of the story and the Incredibles is all his. And he does better if he has a lot more control. And I would love to spend time in his Star Wars universe. So that's what I really want to see. Dating the day we get Brad Bird dash Rendhar film, I will buy the tickets if you'll buy the popcorn. That's great, that's a great choice. Scott. Two follow up questions to that, though, yep, okay, live action or animated. Actually I do want live action. Yeah, I really gotta be live action. And is he going to team up with Dave Filoni? No, because I want Flony or Fiber to do their own films. Okay, Scott, I will help you out by saying Felony can executive produce. Mm hmmm, provided we have Kathleen Kennedy locked in a closet somewhere so she can't screw it up.

1:01:42 Scott, what do you what do you want from brad Bird? I would be fascinated to see what he would do with uh animated horror. Interesting the sampling of what we got with the kind of the pulp cereal that Hogarth is watching in his room, and I'm trying to think of you know, what I rely on from brad Bird is original, stylistic, iconic. Right, if we could get something that is family approachable but still with a horror bend to it in animation, possibly even in black and white, I think that'd be fascinating to see. Now. I know that he's been working on Will Eisner's The Spirit, or he had been working on it, and I've seen, you know, rough animations of that. I think that kind of thing would be fascinating. But I also want to see something totally original that just taps into a certain iconic kind of genre. All right, well, I'm gonta see if I can't get your money with this one. I want to see him do a live action follow up to The Iron Giant. It's going to take place in the late sixties early seventies. We have an adult Hogarth played by Jack Quaid, who reunites with the assembled Giant during the height of

1:03:14 the Vietnam War. Give us a rogue government agency run by an Aaron Eckhart or a Josh Brolin type who's working to weaponize the Giant, and you can bring back age appropriate Jennifer Anderson and Harry Connot Junior to reprise their roles, and the kicker would be obviously, we're gonna get some flashbacks to fifty seven when he first meets a Giant, and I'm sticking, there's gonna be animated, little mash up there, how's that grab you? Scott? I love the concept, but in my heart, I don't want to ever see a sequel to this movie. I wanted to stand alone and be celebrated for what it is, and they need to just re release it. Your idea is fantastic as far as casting, absolutely having in the time period of Vietnam War.

1:04:09 Absolutely thematically thinking about what that would bring back totally, especially because there's the possibilities that we would learn more about the Giant himself. Right, Yeah, I'm sure there would be a little bit more backstory, Like I was mentioning the Giant's dream and other deleted scene they put back in the signature you see a little flashes of you know, what was happening on his planet? What was his kind of species so to speak? Used for it would be interesting, But my heart just says, no sequel. Ever, Well, then you don't get to go when we see it. That's right. No popcorn for me, no popcorn for Scott Hoffman. Listen, I think it's obvious we all recommend seeing this film. The Blu Ray Signature edition is a mustaf or any fan of the film. Am I right in saying that, guys, because I've got my copy? Absolutely? I mean, like Dane, you mentioned Mondo, look at that gorgeous box set. Look at that thing. Yes, yes, it has eight by tens of all the movie posters in there too. Yeah, what's your number, Daighten? It is two thousand and nine eighty eight out of fifteen hundred. Dang it, I'm in like the mid five thousands. Yeah, it's got such a great sampling.

1:05:24 Aside from the features that you get on it, which are unmissible, it's beautifully presented. There's a great book that's included, the little posters that you get, it's it's just gorgeous. The documentaries on it, the behind the scenes stuff the audio commentary by Brad Bird. It's one of these things you're you're gonna like every time I sit down, I'm like, you know what, I want to watch it, but I don't, So I'm going to watch the documentary. I'm going to watch the audio contrary. You know, there's always there's so much more to dig into with this when you have this, this particular edition. But a missunity, a missed opportunity by both Puffs and Kleenex to not include a little sample packet tissues in there, because I tell you what, man, I cannot watch this movie without weeping, not just tearing up, like weeping. Oh yeah, And it's funny that you mentioned that because in the fabulous TV show Ted Lasso, there's an episode well yeah, they watched the movie and he makes some comments like I gotta get back in there before I have an entire football you know, team of crying in the locker room, you know, because yeah, I cannot watch this movie without you know, becoming a mess, you know. The last I mean, I can't even talk about it because I will start crying on this. So this is I think this is probably the only animated film I've ever watched that has brought me to tears. I think, I think if you if you watch this and you don't cry, you're you're probably made of You're probably made of iron, but not the not the kind of iron that iron giants made out of, because you're you know, you're definitely a robot,

1:06:56 that's for sure. It's like the Blade Runner test. They have to show this to you and if you don't cry, then I know. Those of you that don't have the Mondo Edition or the Signature series, it is currently streaming on Max. So for those of you wanting to revisit it or see it for the first time, we strongly recommend it. Dayton. I want to thank you for joining us. I knew you would have a lot to say about this, this incredible film. But tell us what is next on docu Base seventy seven. Well, tomorrow we actually have our almost wrapping up, our episodes, our series on nineteen seventy six albums. Tomorrow we have a day at Races from Queen and then the week after that we have Tom Petty and the Heartbreaker's debut album. So that's our November wrapping up and yeah, it's that was a fun series. And I'm glad we got to do it because it actually got to listen to quite a few of those albums for the first time all the way through. So I have absolutely enjoyed your nineteen seventy six series. I feel like it's been an incredible companion to our nineteen seventy six series. You know, we're given, we're given listeners, the movies, you're giving them, the music. Hate that you're wrapping it up so soon because we've got I think like five or six episodes left.

1:08:14 Might have to start a letter writing campaign, maybe get you to do a couple more, just just just to run it, run it, let it run its course so we can we can end them both series together. But definitely looking forward to what you got for us, Scott, Uh, We've got We've got this Star Trek limited series that you've been you've been running for us. Tell us about Drawn into Lower Decks. Yeah, I mean speaking of groundbreaking animation story with a ton of heart. Drawn into Lower Decks talks about the newest venturing into Star Trek animated world. Every week we talk about the latest episode to set you up for the new and now. It's a great way to dive in. We just had a fantastic conversation with director Brandan Williams as we're wrapping up the season. So you haven't gotten into it if you're a lifelong fan, well lifelong, it's been on for four seasons.

1:09:09 If you're a big fan, or if you've never seen it before, it's a great way to dive into Star Trek in one of the best series they have to offer. We're also getting ready with one of the co hosts of that series, David Burns, coming back and talk to me at a Film at forty five. This year we're diving into nineteen seventy nine. I can't wait to start diving into that. Looking forward to that as well. Listeners. As always, we thank you for checking us out. Let us know what you think of the Iron Giant. Reach out to us at www dot afilmbyopodcast dot com. You can also find us on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter at a Film by a Podcast. Next week, we're getting dirty with Clint Easwoods San Francisco detective Harry Callahan when our limited series nineteen seventy six covers the four Sir. Until next time, I got a rocket in my pocket and a roll in my walk Oh family, don't fuss me with the North Unicne.

1:10:19 There ain't nothing you can tell me about already know. I got a rocket in my pocket and a ready go A let go some place who we can rock with me? I got a rocket in my pocket. In refusally