Steven Soderbergh - Ocean's Eleven

0:00 We have been discussing the twentieth and twenty fifth anniversaries of some of Hollywood's biggest blockbusters this season, and I am very excited about today's episode because it's probably one of the biggest films of two thousand and one, absolutely one of the most popular, and one of my all time favorites. I need a reason, don't see money? Why do this? Why not do it? Because yesterday I walked out of the joint after losing four years of my life, and you're cold decking teen beat cover boys because the house always wins. Play long enough, you never change the stakes the house takes you, unless when that perfect hand comes along, you bet big and then you take the house. Been practicing this speech little bit did? I rushed it felt like I was good. I liked TV things much.

1:04 So let's talk about a film by Steven Soderbergh, his two thousand and one heist comedy, which is celebrating its twenty fifth anniversary this year, Ocean's Eleven. Hello everybody, I'm Jeff Johnson, I'm Amber Lewis, and this is a film by podcast. I would have loved to have had ten people talking with me today, just for the gimmick, you know, but that word. You know, the team's not that big, and I'm not about to do that. Well it's yeah, we've we've we've expanded quite a bit lately. But uh, at the end, I just thought that that's chaos. I'm not doing that.

2:13 Yeah, that's a lot of people in the city. Yeah. So when you when you when you when you think, Okay, I got to talk about Ocean's eleven with just one person, Uh, Amber, It's got to be you. This is one of your all time favorites. Oh my gosh, this Vivie so much. It is so good. I'm not even gonna pretend to try and knock it. You know. I know last week Wayne and I we weren't overly kind to X Men the Last Stand, but for for good reason. Uh, and we do we we did recommend it, and we do we do like it. But I I just I'm gonna just gush over this movie for like the next forty five to fifty minutes. I'm sure and I and I know you will too. So it's okay, Yes, I got I got some fun stuff, some some points to discuss with you. I didn't tell you about taking taking a gamble here because this is Listen. It's a new month for us, and the theme this month is gambling, good guys and Blockbuster part threes. So you and I are going to start things off with Ocean's eleven because it's full of some good guys that are They're in the casino.

3:25 They're gambling, they're gambling on this this plan, this heist, as it were. Before we get started, let's talk about Steven Soderberg for for just a minute. I got I got three things you may not know and a quote from this guy. And his quote, Amber, is just one more reason why you're gonna love this guy. Not that you needed another reason, but I mean, right, yeah, all right, let me start off with this one. He often works with his favorite director of photography, guy named Peter Andrews. Amber. Are you familiar with the work of Peter Andrews. Do you know what all he's done? I'm not great with the crew, unfortunately.

4:08 Well I'm sure. That I am familiar, and I just don't know that it's it. Well, that's that's it right there. The fact is Peter Andrews is a pseudonym for one Steven Soderberg. He shoots his own stuff and he just goes under under an assumed name. I thought that was kind of fun because I was like, I don't know Peter Andrews, Like, wow, he's he only works with Soderberg, Like what's that about? And then you find out why. Yeah, it could only be better if it was an anagram. Yeah, talk about the uh, the talent this guy has. At twenty six years old, he is the youngest winner ever of the prestigious Palm Dior.

4:54 Uh. When his feature film debut, Sex Lives and Videotape One at the nineteen eight nine Can Film Festival. Have you ever seen that one? Ammer? Oh my god, Yes, such a good way. We should cover that one sometime. I'd love to talk about that one, Yeah. Because I think that's it's to the point where people have kind of forgotten about it. Yeah, I agree. I was always looking at I know, last year Soderbergh was on the schedule for a movie he did called Logan Lucky, which is just just a fun time. It's a Adam driver and uh, who else Daniel. Craig stealing cars.

5:35 Yeah, it kinda is like a comedic heist cars stealing. Yeah, there's some stuff going on. We might we might. I don't know. We might have to do a couple of Soderberg movies. We'll see another thing. Now, he claims this. I kind of want to call bullshit when people say this kind of stuff. But according to him, he has never read a single review of any of his films. Oh, I don't think that's true. I don't think that's I don't think that you see these interviews when when actors will say, oh, I don't watch any of my movies, or I don't I don't read my reviews. I think they're full of shit. Like you tell me, you don't want to find out exactly like this minute it hits variety or you know, the minute it hits the trades, you're not you're not rushing out to find out.

6:21 Well, I know he he reads commentary online, at least because he mentioned it in the director's commentary for this movie. Okay, Well, he was. Comparing like positive things people have said and then you know, criticisms that they've made online. I like, I like that you mentioned that he did an audio commentary for Ocean's eleven Because when discussing the importance of DVD extras, Soderbergh had this to say, quote, would I growing up like to have had access to stuff on DVDs like this? Oh? God, yeah, it's better than any film school.

7:01 I think that's funny because I was thinking that when I was listening to him earlier. Today. He gives you a lot of this is why I chose this lens, and this is why I'm pulling in and pulling out, and this is why I set this shot up this way. And if you want to be a filmmaker, it's absolutely gold. He does great audio commentaries. Uh, Ocean's eleven. It's funny you're you're watching Oceans eleven with the Sodaberg commentary and that's also got a Ted Griffith, Yeah, the screenwriter. Yeah, this is one of the best scripts ever. It's gotta be yea because. It also left a little flexibility for a little improv too, but not a lot, like, not a lot of it is on the page.

7:46 Well, And it's funny because that's brought up in the other audio commentary for this this Blu ray. I was I was watching this with the other audio commentary Amber, Oh god, what was that? There is a hilarious one. It's packed with really fun anecdotes, it's got some good information, but it's Brad Pitt, Matt Damon and Andy Garcia. Oh my gosh. And I'm telling you, when you watch it, it's if you watch it with this commentary track, it's like they're sitting on the couch with you, because there'll be moments when they're talking or like the movie's playing and no one's say anything. And like at one point, Matt Damon comments on that he goes, this is gonna be one of the worst commentary tracks ever because I keep forgetting we're here to talk about the movie. But I'm I just love this movie and I'm watching it. I can't help it. And meanwhile, Brad Pitt is like he's taking jabs at Clooney like they all are, but he's he's like, yeah, he goes, let's do this like a mystery science theater type of thing. That's what I want to do. And so it's it's just hilarious, and.

8:53 Now I have to watch it for the fifth time. This yeah, and Andy Garcia is right at home with them. It's it's a good time. I strongly recommend the commentary track with those three fantastic stuff. All right, Amber, let's let's let's get this out of the way. Well, I should say let's for you, let's get this out of the way. Probably your least favorite moment every episode, but hey, a lot of people love this, Amber, So I don't know what to tell you. I don't know some documentation on that. I'm talking, of course, about the five words synopsis, so real quick. Last week, we always ask our listeners to share their five words synopsis at the end of the episodes. Yes, for films that we've covered. Last week I shouted out several of them on the on the X Men episode, they got some fun stuff coming their way, and then I challenged everybody, Hey, if you want to try Oceans eleven is next. If you want to try doing an eleven word synopsis because it's Ocean's eleven, hey send it in and if we like it, I'll give you a free month of access to our Patreon. So I'm kind of curious to see if anyone's going to be rising to the challenge here.

10:07 That's a pretty good deal. But it's hard, Like I thought it would be easier, but it's not. Well, Amber, do you want to give us a five words synopsis for Oceans eleven? Or do you want to go for the big money and offer up one with exactly eleven words? Yes, No, I could not. I tried. I do not do eleven words. I've got a five word though. All right, hey, listen, we've had now, we've had some other listeners chiming in saying they've they've been busting people for not using five words. So I'm gonna tell you right now, if you don't have five you're you're about to You're about to go bust in the casino. Yeah, so what do you got for us? Boys? Steal all the money?

10:48 That works? And you know what? You know why that? You know why? I like that. You could have said it'd be so many different but I'll tell you why. I immediately think of Ocean's eleven. You. You could have said crew. You could have said men. You could have said thieves. You could have said convicts, you could have said con artist. You could have said a lot of things. But you chose the word boys. And the fact is these guys they're getting together, they're having a great time. This is like a good hang kind of a movie. So I like that that works. Yeah, I often refer to all of you gentlemen that I podcast with as my boys, and that's kind of the mode that I'm thinking of is though, Okay, it's eleven.

11:34 It works, Amber, Can I hit you up with and eleven words? I say you go for eleven. I went for eleven. I went for eleven because I was like, I don't know if Amber is going to go for this, but I'll have one ready. How about this one? How about this one? Because the house always wins. That's okay, let me let me do it, let me do it. I tried so hard, let me do it, let me do it. Okay, Okay, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Sorry, Because the house always wins. That's why they're hitting this casino. Yes, exactly eleven words. I tried so hard to get that quote. I want it. Yeah, I couldn't. That's that's That's one of the best moments of dialogue in this movie, and I wanted to incorporate it without just lifting it completely. So yes, there you go it all right, listen, listeners, there are there's definitely gonna be some better ones that are exactly eleven words, So uh, take me hit me up on this one. Yeah, send us a send us your eleven word synopsis because I'll be happy to give away some well I'm not going to give away Terry Benedict's money, but I'll give away a flame off the Patreon that that that I can do for you. So Ember. After producing both Blind Date and a film adaptation of nineteen fifties TV show Dragnet, both in nineteen eighty seven, producer David Permitt announced that he would next remake the nineteen six rat pack ensemble Oceans eleven, and after a few false starts, he gets

13:07 a little frustrated. He decides to move on, but Warner Brothers believes the idea has promise provided the right group of talent can be grouped together, and that wouldn't happen for another thirteen years when Steven Soderbergh gets to work with his buddy George Clooney, who he had directed and out of Sight, I want to say, in like nineteen ninety eight maybe, and these guys start making personal phone calls to everyone they want in the film, And I mean, this is the ideal time, right because when you've seen the original, have you seen the original with. A really long time ago? I don't, okay, really remember it? Okay, I mean, let's let's call it what it is, though, I mean, for its time, it had it had the guys, right, it had the group. I mean they were the top at the movies, they were the top of music, they were they were everywhere. And I kind of think it's tough to take a group like that, or find a group like that, or a symbol a group like that, and and know that, yes, audiences want to see every one of these people together, and yes they will have amazing chemistry, and yes it will be a smooth, you know, production, because everyone's just gonna have a good time. So it's it's a gamble, right, And I love the idea that these guys are just they're just sitting around saying, let's call let's call it this guy, let's call it this look.

14:35 You know, they're just they're just calling their buddies. You know. It's it's fantastic. I'll tell you what. Let's take a quick break, and when we get back, I'm gonna throw you for a loop here because I want to talk about who's not in the movie. Oh okay, all right, we'll be right back. Welcome back. Amber Lewis and I are discussing Steven Soderbergh's Oceans eleven, Amber, there are some people who didn't win big because they chose not to gamble on Ocean's eleven. Can we talk about some people from that? I know normally we talk about, you know, everyone in this This cast is too big, so I'll encourage you jump in whenever you want to say something about Roberts or Clooney or Damon or Pitt or anybody.

15:27 But for right now, I just want to talk about who's not in the movie, and I want to I want to hear your thoughts on you know, does it are we Are we better off? Or is it? I mean, I definitely have thoughts about one of them. I know, I don't really get the rest. Well, let's start off with the first one. So Mark Wahlberg is wanted. That's the one, you know. Okay, so he's wanted. They want him for the role of Linus, you know, Matt Damon's role. He had just worked with Clooney on The Perfect Storm. Oh, by the way, go back and check out the episode Amber and I did for that one. That was a fantastic time talking about the Perfect Storm. But Mark Wahlberg decides to turn this movie down to go over and do another remake that that's happening at Fox with Tim Burton talking about Planet of the Apes.

16:17 And thank god, he would not have been good for Linus. You don't think it would have been good for Is he too tough for Linus because Walburt he's plays like a tough guy. Well, the thing about Mount Damon that's so good in this movie is he's got that that kind of inexperienced. Gullible almost he's naive, right, and him where you know. They pulled that con on him and he completely falls for it. M And I don't think that you would have believed that Mark Wahlberg would. Have I think it well, I don't think Mark Wahlberg could play like the geeky gaming commission guy that the con that he does.

17:02 He could have been one of the Utah brothers and you know, the Malloy twins. Yeah, he definitely could have been one of them. Yeah, I just don't see him like ducking in fear from from Bernie Mack, you know, dropping right. Yeah, It's unfortunate for Warburg because Planet of the Apes was not the remake to do it this year. You and I kind of talked about this uh earlier, Luke and Owen Wilson, they say no to playing the Malloy Twins in favor of working with Wes Anderson on The Royal. Tenenbaum's Uh another film that you and I covered. Listeners go back and check that one out.

17:51 And I think that's a win for everybody. I think they would have been funny, but they're so. Like they're humors, so dry, like Owen Wilson would have been hilarious. I don't know about Luke. I'll tell you. I'll tell you with all with all due respect to I don't know everybody, I'll say this, they the Wilson brothers would have been really fun in this. But the reason why we're better off is the Malloy Twins need a certain degree of white trash to them. You know. And and I don't think that the I don't think Luke and Olan Wilson can play that. I just don't.

18:33 Uh. You know, they're quirky, they're they're the fun dry, like you said, dry humor. So I think we're better off here. I know why that way. You know, since we're talking about the World ten of Bombs, let's not forget Danny Glover also turned down Oceans eleven. I think he was up for the Bernie mac roll of Frank, and he also leaves to go do. Gonna be Uh. What do you think? Well, I mean he might have been Rupert. I don't know, because stories he would have been Rupert. If he's, if he's, it's better. Yeah, I could see him playing Rupert. That that would have worked to or Yeah, Ruben not no, sorry, Rubin the the Elliott Gold role.

19:19 Yes, yes he could have. He could have done that. That would have been fun. But again, I love him in the Royal Ten of Moms, so I'm glad that that's the thing. Like anybody that was in that movie, I'm not pulling him to do anything. No, No, that's a perfect cast. Hugh McGregor turns down the role of Basher and no surprise here he goes off to do Mulin Rouge, which is another film. Yeah, you and I talked about that one earlier this season with uh with our very own Angela Norris. A lot of a lot of playing the the the greatest hits here Amber where all these people that said no to Oce eleven did movies that you and I covered. So that's kind of that's kind of cool. Yeah. Lastly, after reading the script and believing the character wasn't quite developed enough, Bruce Willis turned down the role of casino owner Terry Benedict. Now, that would have been good.

20:20 That would have been very interesting. Yeah, he Now he chose to do Bandits with Billy, Bob Thornton and Kate Blanchette instead, But according to Andy Garcia, he uh Willis said, I don't think this character is quite developed, and he passed on it, which worked out for him because then, you know, Garcia says, I don't know if I was the first choice or the last choice, but I was the choice because I got the phone call from Stephen and I was happy to take it right. Yeah, and he's he's cool. Like. What I love about Garcia in this is that I know you have to have you have to have a villain, right, we have to. You know, if you think about the original Ocean's eleven from nineteen sixty, the tag I think, if I remember right, the tagline was if it were any other if it were any other city, they'd be the bad guys or they'd be the villains or something like that. And it's Vegas, so Vegas. When you go to Vegas, you know the casino that's you're you're the good guy. You want to beat the casino. You want to beat the guy. The thing about Garcia is, yeah, he's the he's the bad guy, quote unquote, but he's still very cool, well mannered, well dressed.

21:37 He says the right things. As he's said. There's nothing really wrong with him. No, he's he's intimidating in a in a cool way. You know. You believe that Julia Roberts is with him, you know, and let's let's be honest. Tess is a very successful, very intelligent woman, you know, doesn't need She's not like a a typical Vegas It's not like she was a showgirl that hooked her wagon to a you know, a sugar daddy. She's she's a she's a successful woman, you know, in the art world, and she doesn't need to be with Terry. She chooses to be with Terry, and I believe that he can have her, you know.

22:19 Like one of my favorite scenes is the exchange between him and Danny at the at the table at the dinner table, when they're they're talking to each other, but they're not looking at each other. Yes, And as cold as Garcia is in that one moment, he's very affectionate. He's holding her hand and he's kissing it, and you know he's thee Yeah, I guess I put by those tails. No, you can keep them, you know. I even love like it's almost like they forget he, they forget George Clooney's there. George Clooney is the coolest kid in school. He's he is the sexiest man alive at this time, and he's an afterthought in that moment.

23:00 Mm hmm. And I love how he just was like he kind of just like Terry Danny, you know, Like I mean, it's hard not to like Andy Garcia in this movie, you know, as far as like his his you could you could. Totally see like Tess has a thing for for bad boys, and you could totally see how she could just say, well, I don't see that side of him, so it's fine. Yeah, he's just a businessman. I I would be remiss if I just skipped right past the the actual cast here. So I wanted to give you the opportunity. You know, is there anyone specifically you want to you want to talk about right now?

23:46 As far as every. Time I watch it, I enjoy someone more than I did the last time. You know, it's like this person is is the standout, and this time around it was Bernie Mack. So hard at him. Watching this and I've seen this movie like fifty times, but his delivery and his facial expressions. Oh god, the facial the one that I keyed in on this this recent rewatch when he's when he's buying the vans and he's holding onto that the cart, the salesman's hand. Yes, you know, he's talking about the whole moisturizing moisturizer conversation. When he does that weird like he like kind of tilts his head like looks in at him, his eyes geting a little bit wider, waiting like it.

24:36 It's it's so uncomfortable and it's hilarious in that moment. I don't know the guy's name, but did you recognize that that salesman By the way, I'll give you a hint. I'll give you a hint. He is in another very famous Las Vegas movie in a very memorable scene. Oh gosh, no, I got nothing have. Well, I'll be fair because it not be It's not exactly an Amber Lewis movie. But have you seen Scorsese's Casino? Oh my god? Yeah, okay, okay, so remember remember when de Niro they catch the guy cheating at cards and and he asked me like, hey, I saw you shuffling chips with with both Can you do that with your your left hand?

25:20 He's like, oh no, just my right And then they take the hammer and then what they did with my hand? Man, that guy is the car salesman. Yeah, that's him. That's him. He I guess, I guess you had to quit quit cheating at cards. You had to get it rid of the job. He never left Vegas, he just went cars. Yeah, Bernie Mac, that's why I think we just found a connection. You know, we don't get that guy's then it's in the same universe. Ocean's eleven and Casino are happening in the amber. You just you just dropped the bomb there there it is, Yeah, because it's he pulls his hand back like it's I mean, I don't think Bernie Mac is like crushing his hand. He's not like, no, man, he's gripping it. But yeah, I think that guy's still he's got trauma from the hammer. Yeah, I think so.

26:19 I think it's so funny that you think Casino is not an Amber Lewis movie, because that has one of my favorite Joe pess like ever when. He squeezes that guy's head in the vice and he's like, you don't hop your eye out for that. Charlie for Charlie buckingem you. Joe Pesci is my favorite scary tough guy of all time because of whether it's because he is he's scary and Casino like, I'm afraid of Joe Phi and Casino, but then I'm also I love that he's the same guy basically. And my cousin Vinny, you're laughing and you're having fun with him. You know, I got a guy who wouldn't to fight me for two hundred dollars. An identity problem, a dress problem. Oh man, Okay, okay.

27:11 Let's okay, pull. It back together here. Brad Pitt, he had he had an interesting answer to why Rusty is always eating. So the first show I heard a couple different. Well, this comes from bread. Yeah, this this comes straight from Brad Pitt. Not that not that I had lunch with him earlier, but he's he's on the DVD commentary, as I said, he's because they they kind of were making jokes about it. And he's like, well, so the first scene that he does, he just happened to be eating. And on day one, Soderbug's like, you know what, that's funny, Let's keep doing that. And the fact is, if you look in every scene, it's not exactly like he's meal prepp and it's not like he's having a healthy meal.

27:57 It's always like like gas station food, like he's pulling it off of the roller thing, you know. Yes, and and Pitt had this to say about that. He said, you know, the thing is a guy like Rusty is always on the move. He's always on the go, and he's basically going to eat whenever there's an opportunity to eat because he never knows where his next meal is coming from. And it's typically, you know, where he's passing by a you know all you can eat a fet he's passing by the gas dat or wherever he's at. And that's why he's always got this trashy food. And you know, and if he doesn't need to, if he doesn't finish it, and fine, he can he can one more bite and then he throws it away or whatever. He's always doing that. He ate the famous scene where he finds out he's with Matt Damon, he finds out that Tess is in play, so to speak. Yes, he's eating shrimp cocktail. He's not a fan anymore. He ate over forty shrimp cocktail.

28:57 That's so bad. I just I don't like shrimp. I don't. I wouldn't need it. But well, usually actors like they just put it in their mouth and then they helped yell and there's a bucket there and they spin it out. But Brad commits to the bit. Uh, he does, and somehow he remains chiseled. So maybe he's onto something. I don't. I don't know. I do not know. I will say this if you had to guess. And again this is coming from coming from the guys, from the boys as as as you as you call him, who do you think the who do you think the guy was on set that everyone wanted to be around, who had the best. It's got to be Carl Reiner or Elliott, Yes, one.

29:39 Of the it's Carl Reiner. You're absolutely right. They said if you weren't, if you weren't on in a scene and Reiner wasn't in a scene. You were sitting with Reiner, everyone like he held he was basically holding court off set so much because he's and it's like he's everyone telling jokes. Everyone's like they they kind of talk about like when they first show up and Damon and Peter like, oh yeah, we all we all got in the room and we're all telling jokes and then we all start talking about sports, and then we all just we're all best friends and we all just want to hang out. And basically trailers were just empty at all times because it didn't matter if you were in the scene or not.

30:21 You were on set. You wanted to be there. You wanted to hang out, and it was that's the vibe. And you know, Wes Anderson, we talked about that on the on the Royal Tenebaum's episode. Wes Anderson wants that that vibe on his set where everyone's just it's a it's a community and these guys are doing it just because everyone's here. Like, when am I going to get a chance to hang out with, you know, with Don Cheatle again, When am I going to get a chance to hang out with Elliott Gould and Carl Reiner on the same day at the same time. So they're just having a blast. And I absolutely love that about this this. Group, Yes for sure. And but let's take a let's take another break, and then I'm gonna I'm gonna pitch you a cast. Since we're talking about the cast, I'm gonna I'm gonna give you a different cast. Oh boy, for a different for a different time. We'll be right back, and we are back.

31:15 We're talking about Steven Soderbergh's Oceans eleven celebrating its twenty fifth anniversary. So earlier, you know, when we were talking about David Permitt, the producer nineteen eighty seven. You know, by the way, have you ever seen Blind Date with Bruce Willis? Like when it came out, I watched Dragnet like a million times. How do you not eight eighties Tom Hanks comedy Dan Aykroyd, Like you have to, you have to love that. But this guy, it's nineteen eighty seven and he announces that he's going after Ocean's eleven and they just couldn't figure it out. Can I give you my cast?

31:57 Oh? This is you're like dream eighties? Can we do? Can we do? I'm gonna give you Oceans eleven nineteen eighty seven. Oh, I got it, Okay, okay, Yeah, Because in nineteen sixty it's an all star cast. They got whoever they wanted because the rat pack was in demand, right, Yes, And I think it's fair to say that in two thousand and one, all the big stars are in this movie, right, Yes, Clooney and Pitt and Julia Roberts. Let's not forget Julia Roberts is commanding twenty million dollars a picture at this point. Yes, right, So they got everyone they wanted. So I'm going to take you back to nineteen eighty seven, and I'm going to give you the cast that we could have had if if I would have been around. I was around, but the problem was I was eleven, and I probably didn't have the poll in Hollywood that I that I should have had. But here's what I'm going to give you, and you just give me a yay or nay if you will. I got Danny Ocean being played by Harrison Ford nineteen eighty seven. Harrison Ford, Yeah, yeah, Can I interest you? I know I'm gonna interest you in this one.

33:07 This is your girl. Can I give you Michelle Feifirst. Tests, oh heck, yeah. Okay again it's nineteen eighty seven, Rusty being played by Tom Cruise. I mean, yeah, you're I see I see the I see the wheels turning. You're like, yep, I think I think this is a slam dunk. Eddie Murphy has got to play Frank. Yeah. The moist Drizer conversation alone is worth it right there. How about how about Burgess Meredith as Saul doing the whole. The one last yeah. One last heist. Can you see the end when they're they're at the fountain and Burgess is the last one to walk away with a smile on his face. Burgess Meredith as Saul Bloom, I'm gonna give you Gene Hackman as Ruben.

33:58 Oh I like that? Yeah, like that? Okay, all right, I'm doing great, all right, I've got I got three more, or I should say four more, because I gotta do the Malloy Twins. So okay, well I'll just jump to them Lloyd Twins, Dan Ackroyd and Bill Murray. I don't know, I feel like they should be younger. Well, I was going with like the Luke and Owen Wilson because they're not younger. They're not They're not like Casey. Yeah, like young, but it would be hilarious. So I'm not that I was going for this. I leaned in, well, it's eighty seven. I mean, they're not that old. This is well, this is just a few years after Ghostbusters. So I'm going for the comedy, you know. Yeah, okay, because I mean, but I'm not saying okay, no, all right, I think I'm gonna get you with my I think I'm feeling pretty good about my last two. Again, it's nineteen eighty seven in the role of Linus Young, somewhat naive Linus Michael J. Fox, right, yes, yeah, and then he was.

35:03 Getting a little he was trying to transition. Was yeah, he'd done Back to the Future and he's trying to be it was. Like a secret of my success. Yeah, exactly. I think I think he did that, Nadye. I'm feeling it. Yeah, eight yeah, okay, all right, last one and again I'm gonna give you the name because you know whom I'm talking about, Terry Benedict. Okay, okay, So. You got to think if Michelle Pfeiffer is Tess and she left Harrison Ford. You know, if that's our Danny Ocean, who who can command the coolness and the suaveness and the confidence, It's got to be Jack Nicholson, who has worked with Michelle Pfeiffer.

35:52 You know, you know I love Jack. I know you love Jack. What I'm saying, list in. The list of people that you would leave Harrison Ford. Four, Amber Lewis, if you had to leave Parrison Ford, you couldn't say no, I know what I do it if you. Have that had he got jail and breaks the art and. Jack is there and think about this and he's being charming. Yeah, because by your own account, Jack Nicholson and Michelle Pfeiffer had the chemistry in the Witches of Eastwick, which is a film which is one that we covered. Go back and check that out, right. They had the chemistry in Wolf, which Holy Cow is another one that you and I covered, go back and check it out. Any time we're talking Jack Nicholson and Michelle Peiffer, I like that in the episode, you're gonna be there. So that's that's my cast for Ocean's eleven, nineteen eighty seven. What do you think could they have? Could they have done this? I'm not saying that I don't want what we got, but we could have had a nineteen sixty version, we could have had a nineteen eighty seven version, and then we could have had two thousand and one. Yes, I think this cast would have worked.

36:54 I don't hate it. I think you did good. Listeners listen, well, they are listening because they're listening. But listeners, we want to hear your choices for a nineteen eighty seven Oceans eleven and if you've got if you got some better suggestions, because yeah, give us, give us because I do agree with you, Amber, I think we could go younger. Sold on that one. So who else can be the Maloya twins? He can be, who can be who's young and funny in nineteen eighty seven? That's what we got to figure out because I kind of did this off the cuff. So I'm hoping our listeners can help us out with that one, because and maybe they got some better choices. I don't know, but i'd love to. I'd love to hear their responses. I'd love to hear what they got.

37:36 Maybe we do. Maybe we do an Outsider's reunion and we get Matt Dylan and Ralf Maccia. Ooh, I'm not I'm not opposed to that, but can I listen? Macio's kind of my nemesis. Can can I have with you? Can I have Tommy Howe? Because he's a buddy I don't even know. I don't like how do you not like him? He's rob Oh my gosh. Okay, let's keep a good thing. I'm not gonna yeah, you did get already. Yeah, let's let let's not argue. Let's let's keep this going. I know there's a scene you want to talk about, and there's a scene I want. To talk about, probably the same scene.

38:18 It's not no, okay, I'll go first. How about that I chose my scene specifically for the cinematography. You could argue that it might be a pivotal moment because of a reveal that happens, but really it's the cinematography. For me, it's the way the shot is set up. And I'm talking about the moment that Rusty confronts Danny about tests. You know, he's just found out here. Okay, now here's and here's why. So the scene starts. One thing I love about Soda Birn. The camera's always moving in this movie with this guy, it's never a static shot. So we are in tight on the vault, you know, we see someone's backs to us and they're putting away chips, and then we start to pull out and wait, this are we in the vault. We're not in the vault.

39:16 This is like they're setting up because it's our guys, it's the boys, and they're setting up, like, oh, they're creating their own vault and what is going on here? And his camera movement goes past that because we don't we don't dwell on it. It just we just happen to catch it because he's dropping little breadcrumbs for us, like pay attention because this is gonna matter in the in the third act, right yes, And then Clooney is pulled away Brad Pitt, you know, he comes up and let's go come on right now, and they walk like they're basically they're walking off away from the action, and the camera follows them. But then the camera finally holds up and they keep going away and they they basically the head of the door. It's all backlit. You can see the casino across the street, so you're kind of like, what's going on? Like, oh, they're that close. That's where that's that's their head up, that's their hot their hideout, right, that's that's HQ where they're putting all their stuff together.

40:17 And you see Clooney and Pitt almost silhouettes having the conversation, and he's, you know, he's like, tell me it's not about her or I'm walking. I'm walking right now, and Cloney's trying to calm him down. He's like, Hey, I'm just telling you. If there's you know, you're going up to two things here and if you can't have the one ways, let me remind you. Yeah, exactly. So it's kind of a pivotal moment because like these guys have been they've been in sync the whole time, and this whole movie is all about con on top of con, on top of con, And for a quick second, you're like, wait, is was Cloney conon pit? You know, like why didn't he tell him from the get go, Like, Hey, just so you know, Tess is there and here's what I'm doing, here's what's here's who I'm going after. So I think it's a little bit of a pivotal moment, but I truly I just love it for the cinematography because a camera that's always moving and sodaberg hap he makes the right decision and says, these guys Russy's trying to have a private conversation, and that's why we're not right there on a close up with both of them in a two shot. We are. We see them and we can hear them, but we're not supposed to, is what it feels like. And I love that about that scene. Well.

41:35 I also, like Soderbergh mentioned in the comment director's commentary, he doesn't really do a lot of blocking. He doesn't tell them where to be. He just kind of says, you know, find a spot where you're comfortable, where you think your person would be. And so it's interesting then when you get like a big wide shot of the room, like all the guys are. There, everyone's busy doing something right, you know. And who ends up in the background and who you know is placed in these different shots is just interesting storytelling. Yeah, well it's funny because like sometimes I know they talked about this on the audio commentary, like I really wanted to be in that shot, but I just couldn't because it was just nothing for me to do or nowhere for me to go. And Garcia he's he's talking about he's a call. I'm excited, Here comes my here comes my big moment with Matt, you know, our big scene together. And they're talking about how you know, because the producer of this movie, you know, he's he's kind of juiced in to Vegas. He's friends with the owner of the Blagio, so they gave the hotel, the casino gave them a lot of access.

42:50 And other casinos did too. No idea, you can't do that unless your name is George Clooney and Bratt Pitt. You know, Joya Roberts is going to be here staying at our hotel for the whole production. Sounds great. Yeah, you can do whatever you want. And anyways, Garcia he's like, yeah, they had to close they closed down the entire VIP parking, you know, on the front of the building, so that we could shoot this, and you know, all these whales, all these these fat cats, they're like they're going to the parking garage and they're not happy about it. But too bad. But it's just Benedict. When we were we're introduced to him, he comes walking in and like ten feet away from him. It's a blinking and you miss it moment. Matt Damon's walking out and Matt Damon kind of side eyes him, and then the commentary they're like, oh, hey, Matt, hey Andy, all right, see you. Thanks. It's just that's their big scene. That's the only sign they're they're looked on there, they're basically seen on camera together. It's funny. That's so funny, Amber, What is what's tell me about the scene that you want to talk about? Why? Why did you pick the scene that you're picking. Was it the cinematography, was it a performance? Was it you No, it didn't piss you off, So I won't ad nothing.

43:59 About this movie businesses me off. No, the the acting, it's everything that the way it's lit, the location, everything about it is just you are just completely immersed in this moment. And you kind of forget about everything else that's going on. And that is the scene with Danny and Tess in the picassa restaurant. Good scene. I scene. I love that scene so much. There it's like banter, but they're mad, so it's not really banter, and everybody's very calm, but there's a lot. Of emotion in play.

44:42 Everything about it. I just their chemistry is amazing. Amber, you are a strong willed woman. What do you do when you're ex tells you you don't love me? That's fine, I gotta live with that. You can be with someone but not him, Like, you know, I'm not joking, Like that's a that's bold of him, right, and I love that. She's like, I'm not laughing, you know, it's yeah. I'm not listening to you at all. However, yeah, you can tell the wheels immediately start turning because she has to know. You don't own three casinos in Vegas if you're like a super clean you know, yeah, I'm just a businessman, you know, kind of guy, Like there's got to be some shady, ruthless behavior.

45:33 It opens his hand on her shoulder. That smile she gives, she knows it's right, and then she's shocked when it's not Benedict and it's it's it's Danny, and yeah, it's that's a great moment. I really I agree with you. That's a that's that is two people at the top of their game having a having a good scene together. Absolutely. Yeah, it's so good. And you know, people try so hard to accomplish this in movies, and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't, but boy when it does. Yeah, what's funny? Just a quick you know about Julia?

46:15 You know the story like you know, like I said, Sodaberg and Clooney are they're basically making phone calls right, except that they didn't. They didn't call Julia. He sent her a letter, He sent her a script. Can you tell can you tell the listeners about that? George Clooney. They wanted Julia Roberts to do it, and George Clutney sent her a copy of the script with a twenty dollars bill paper clip to it and said, I hear you're making twenty a picture. Now would you join us for our heist movie? And how do I mean, my god, how do you say no? You can't say no? I mean again, she had just I don't know if she's I think she might have been the first, the first woman to get twenty million a picture. It was a big deal back then. So the fact that he can have a fun joke with it, yes, because everyone took said that.

47:08 You know they're shooting in the Bellaggio. Yeah, and he said, you know, of course, just off to either side of the shot is a velvet rope with hundreds of people watching them. He said, you know, everybody was surprisingly respectful. They were very. Quiet and you know, didn't take flash pictures and stuff like, they didn't do anything to disrupt shooting. They were just there. And he said that the biggest. Like reaction response was when Julia Roberts was there. I believe it. I asked, like, it wasn't for. Brad Pitt, it wasn't for George Clooney, it was when Julia showed. Up well and rightly. So, uh, I'll tell you something I was really surprised about. Soderbergh wanted to shoot this in black and white. Warner Brother said sure, on one condition he gets cut in half. And then he said, hey, color sounds great. Let's well we'll let's let's shoot this in color. Do you think this would have worked as a black and white like a you know, if it's because it's got it like David Holmes score. It's got this jazzy score. It's a fun score. Does it does it transport us back or do At that point, I feel like you almost have to do a period piece if you're gonna go black and white with this, does it have to be a period piece to be successful or could they pulled it off?

48:29 I mean, I think it would have worked better as a period piece, but I don't understand why in a place like Las Vegas. Yeah, you wouldn't use all that color. And it's used to such great effect in this movie, even like before. They get to Vegas. Yeah, the use of color is really I mean, it's noticeable from the very beginning. So I just think that would be such a wasted opportunity. Well, and I pose it with the it's not and I listen, I say that with this. I love black and white cinema. I mean some of my favorite films are black and white films. So there's a time and a place, absolutely, and I wish we got more, but I don't know that this would have been the right palette. Yeah, I'll tell you what. Let's take one last break, Camber, and then we'll talk some numbers and we'll start wrapping things up. All right, Amber, time to run the numbers.

49:33 I know we need. Listen, some of us are our nerds for analytics and factoids like this, so let me give you a few, a few here, because I am I am surprised about a couple of numbers. I'm gonna throw out you, but let me let me give you this. It was released on December seventh, two thousand and one, with a run time of one hour in fifty six minutes, which I again, I'm gonna say, this is a perfect film. I don't think you need more scenes. I don't think you need less. I think everything YEP is just ideal. On an eighty five million dollar budget, it took the number one spot opening weekend point in thirty eight million uh and also effectively knocking Harry Potter down to number two.

50:20 It would finish out its theatrical run with a whopping four hundred and fifty million dollars worldwide gross. That's one hell of a payday for Warner Brothers. I mean, heck, yeah, eighty five million. It brings back four hundred fifty million. And that's not even counting like VHS, DVD, Blu Ray sales, residuals from television, all that good stuff. As far as ratings go, though, here's where I'm a little surprised. IMDb score seven point seven out of ten. I feel like that's that's low. Yeah, that should be higher. Eighty three percent fresh on rw Tomatoes, which sounds about right, because you've got to be a perfect, perfect film to be in the high eighties to nineties. For whatever reason, I'm Rotten Tomatoes a lot of haters. I'm Rotten Tomatoes maybe seventy four out of one hundred on Metacritic. That's another one where I'm like, sure, I don't know. And then lastly, this is the one. This is the one I don't get.

51:24 Cinema score that's where the audience is pulled right when they're walking out of the film. Cinema score grade B plus. The heck, come on, I would think this is a At worst, it's an as. Yeah, I would. Say, I have a list of movies that I consider perfect. Yeah, it's a very like it's a small list, but I've got my my list and this is on that list. Like I would I have no complaints. Time and place. But I'd be kind of fun to do an episode on the perfect film because I would think doesn't matter what anyone brings to the table, Like, I don't know, if you if it's perfect, I think we'd all have to just immediately say yep, perfect, mm hmm.

52:08 You my wheel are turning now, so I'm gonna start thinking about that. We're debate that later. Yeah, we will debate that. What I want to debate right now, Let's talk. Someone watches Ocean's eleven and they say, Amber, this movie is a perfect film, And I get it. This guy he's made some big movies, but I like the underrated stuff. Can you give me a recommendation anything written by, directed by, or possibly starring Steven Soderberg? What are you going to give them? What? What's your recommendation? I was tortured by this. Yeah, and I also am disappointed because I thought isn't produced a choice?

52:53 No, I'm sorry, Sorry, it's too easy, because I mean every every actor nowadays produces everything. Yeah, fair, Okay, well then all right, I'm gonna go directed by and it's a movie that I've never seen, but I am wildly intrigued. And I don't know why I've never seen this movie. Okay, I'm you have you had my uh my curiosity, but now you have my full attention. This is this is gonna be this is gonna be good. What do you got for me? Because I was thinking about this a lot, but then I thought produced was a thing. So I picked two different things. But at any rate, I'm trying to look up what year it was. But he made a movie called Steven Soderberg directed a movie called The Good German.

53:45 The Good German? Yes, okay, wait is that with Is that with Clooney? Yeah? It stars George Clooney and Katelyn Chett and Toby Maguire yep. And it's World War two, but it's like after the war in Europe, after the for the war in Asia ends, so it's that kind of Middle era. And George is like a journalist I think, and and Kate Blanchette is married to a German. I think she's a Jew married to a German who had to make some tough choices to get through the war. And then I'm not sure who Toby Maguire is. But it just sounds it has to do with Operation paper Clip, and it sounds really interesting.

54:35 I don't know how I missed it. I would strongly urge you to check it out. I think you're going to really enjoy it. It's good. It's you. Yes, I recommend. Mention that you like black and white. It's black and white. It's it is. Yeah, it's a war kind of kind of thing and uh huh, so that's my recommendation. We'll all try it together, all right. I would yeah, I would love I would love watch that one again. We maybe next season we talk about that one. I don't, I don't know. We can't. We can't talk about every Stephen Soderberg movie. I mean, that's that's that's number three where we're like, oh, yeah, we should do that one. We'll have to figure it out. Maybe we do a poll or something like that. Next next season. We let the audience, We let the listeners decide for us. Uh, I've got one for you, can I can I give you one that our dear friend Angela Norris definitely not gonna watch by herself because you know, she's you know, she's a bit of afraid of cat.

55:28 Yes. Nineteen ninety seven, there's a psychological horror thriller called night Watch written by Steven Soderbergh, and it stars Youo McGregor, a young Eugho McGregor. He plays a law student who takes a job, like a part time job, as a night watchman at the city Morgue. And meanwhile, there's a serial killer on the loose who's killing women, and all these female victims are ending up at his morgue amber. It is super creepy. Uh. Nick Nolty at the top of his game. You got Patricia Arquette, You got Josh Brolin at a time when Josh Brolin he had kind of like disappeared from movies and then was slowly popping up here and there. This movie is super creepy. Uh.

56:19 I mean anytime you have a movie, Oh, it's a good one, like not even a. Little bit hurt. Yeah, Like mynt have. You ever watched a Have you ever watched a movie, whether it's a scary movie or even a scene that's scary and you're you're in the dark and you're watching it and like the hair on on your arms or the back of your neck starts to stand up because you just feel creeped out, Like you feel like someone's in the room with you. Yes, that's what That's what Nightwatch does for pretty much the whole movie. Oh my gosh. I remember the I remember the first time we watched this. Uh, it had just you know, we're we're in our twenties group of group of us, you know, and we're all hanging out. Someone's basement. We're watching it, but the you know, the girlfriends are there, and it's one of those situations where it's like I gotta get up and go to the back, like I gotta go, I gotta go pee, And you're like, anyone want to come with me?

57:15 Yeah? Can I turn on every single light in the house kind of thing. It's it's a good one. I would strongly recommend that. I'm so excited. Yeah, check that one out. I think you'll That's another one. I think you'll like it. So you've got like a Soderbergh double feature written by and directed by check the check them both out. Amber. No big surprise here, we are recommending Ocean's eleven. Uh. We're putting all our all our chips in on this one. You can rent this one just about every streaming platform there is. But I think I think we'll we'll agree the DVD or the Blu Ray version. It definitely belongs in your library. Right oh heck yeah yeah?

57:55 Uh. And if not for any other reason, it's you get not one, but two really good commentaries on this. On this one, I'm looking at it right here, because you know you've talked about Soderbergh and we at the top of the hour, we're talking about how important DVD extras are to him Ocean's eleven. This has behind the scenes documentaries HBO first look, the making of Oceans eleven and the look of the con the audio commers, the audio commentaries that we talked about. It's just it's packed. And then there's even like DVD rom stuff because I'm holding like one of the original like clamshell DVDs you know from Warner Brothers. Yes, it is just packed. It's got a lot of fun stuff. But those commentary tracks are just fantastic. So well, well, what the price of a mission right there? Well, listeners, don't cast your chips in just yet, because next time on a Film Buy, we'll be talking about Martin Campbell's two thousand and six relaunch of the James Bond franchise, Casino Royale. If you've seen it, and I bet you have, how would you summarize it in exactly five words? You can go to a Film by Podcast dot com and give us your answer.

59:11 You can email us at a Film by Podcast at gmail dot com. If we use your five words synopsis on the show, we'll shout you out on a future episode and we'll get you. We'll definitely get you. Some of the film by Swag. As always, please join us on social media. You'll find us on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, x. We love interacting with you, sharing opinions, taking your requests for future episodes, and of course debating great movies. Amber, I want to thank you. You know. Look, we you and I we go way back, and I owe you from the thing with the guy and the place, and I'll never forget at all of you listening to the show, following us on social media, subscribing to our YouTube channel, and supporting us on Patreon. We absolutely thank you.