J.J. Abrams - Super 8

0:00 So here's the thing. There are alien movies where they are hostile, and there are alien movies where they're they're friendly and we're trying to save them or trying to get them back home. Which which alien movie do you prefer? Um for entertainment purposes, um, hostile for reality purposes? Please? Friendly? Yeah? Yeah, if that's to really happen, I hope they're friendly. And if for entertainment purposes, hostile is always more or fun. Dave Aliah, I love the friendly alien. You love the friendly alien. Okay, Well, I want to talk about a misunderstood alien, which is why I'd like to talk about a film by JJ Abrams is twenty eleven Nostalgic Alien Mystery Super eight. Hello everyone, and welcome to the A Film By podcast.

1:29 I'm Jeff Johnson, I'm Brad Kozo, I'm David Burns. We got a fun one to talk about today, great director, great film. Before we do that, though, I want to talk about It's the month of May, and what better time we're talking about a mystery movie today? What better time to do a little mystery swag giveaway. So here's the thing. All you gotta do head over to Facebook find us there at a film by podcast. Hit that follow button and just drop us a drop us a comment, let us know what you thought about this episode, or what you think about one of your favorite episodes, and if you want to be stay as serious, send us a direct message or and let's just let us know that.

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2:59 Dave. I know there's a couple of people that probably are not familiar with this film because it was not a mega franchise blockbuster that he's known for, which is a shame, Which is a shame. But what is Super eight? JJ Abrams writes and directs his love poem to Steven Spielberg. It is the summer of nineteen seventy nine. A group of young friends in a small Ohio town are struggling to not only grow up with normal life problems, but also at making their zombie film that they have been working on so hard. Tragedy strikes for one of them with the loss of a loved one, But to make things even more interesting, and major accident derails the train, letting lose something that reeks havoc on their small town. In the vein of the Goonies, Close Encounters of the Third kind Et and stand By Me comes another wonderful coming of age story that would have you cheering, laughing, and keeping on the edge of your seat until the very last frame. Full of emotion and a classic sci fi story, you will find yourself brunning alongside these wonderful characters and loving every second of Super eight. Thank you, Dave.

4:00 Brad. I can't remember if this is one of the films we saw in the theaters. Uh, you know, when I was out in Los Angeles visiting or not. I remember saying this with my wife. I saw this at the Dome. Oh, you saw it at the Dome. It was nice jealousy. Maybe I was with you, Dave, just because of the Spielberg you know connection, Brad. He gets all the cool he's had, all the cool movie theaters and jealous. Yeah, Brad, do you remember you remember what you thought of this when you guys went and saw it at the Dome. I was kind of curious to hear Dave's opinion first, because I know your opinion, but I wanted to hear I wanted to go live Wow. Oh Brad, you you are suspect already, Dave. I know how you feel, But why don't you let Brad know. I know you're gonna tip your hand here, but go ahead and go ahead and tell Brad what you think of this one. I would think that my synopsis, so the film kind of gave away of how I feel about this film, calling it a love poem to Steven Spielberg, because that's exactly what this thing is.

5:09 If I was to direct something like this, if I was in a position like JJ Abrams, this is exactly what I would have done. This is a film that I would have created. So I love this movie from beginning to end. One of the things that I really like about this film, Oh, there's a bunch of stuff I really like about this film. But Brad, you're a writer, Jeff, you're a writer. We all write screenplays. We've done it before. You know, we were into the business of loving movies and talking about movies. But this is one of those films that you know, when it opens up, you immediately see that sign of accidents. You know, we haven't had accents along to you. You're pulled right into it right away. You know, it makes us want to immediately know why that accident sign is being changed. And we see out the after a funeral gathering of a family and friends with Joe sitting along alone outside, which just puts us into not only the head of the main character, but quickly allows us to attach ourselves and identify with him and his father to me, because you know, as a screenwriter, you got to grab your audience within us first ten minutes, and you need to make sure that your audience knows what's going on. And I feel like jj Abrams did an incredible job of making us feel for Joe immediately, and I attached myself to that character from beginning to end of that film. So yes, I love this film, Brad, and I am curious to hear what you have to say.

6:20 Brad. I will I will remind you there's a nice wide table separation. Dave can't possibly leap across it. So say what you want and know that you're safe. Okay, Well, first of all, I should like this movie for a couple of reasons. Number one, J J. Abrams, Steven Spielberg love them both. Number two, the dog's name is Lucy. My dog's name is Lucille. That, yeah, you know, two points. The third is all the um references of things like the Dawn of the Dead posters down to the little Dick Smith comment and you know, things like that. You know, those things should make me like this film.

7:08 But when it came down to this, and this is the second time I've actually no a third time I've tried to watch this film, it just doesn't work for me. I think it's it's just not it's trying too hard to be an homage to something that worked so much better that all those films that we mentioned, Close Encounters, Goonies stand by me, all those elements that made those movies great. This film is missing from that. And a lot of it has to do with the story just being just kind of bland and a little all over the place. Well, one of the weakest third acts I've ever seen. I think the third act of the film is just a slow, small burn with as. You have to admit that the ending is very anticlimactic. It's very weak. The the ending to this film incorrect.

8:03 Okay, So for our listeners, I'm doing my best to to dodge all the icy daggers flying out of Dave's eyeballs at Brad. And we're gonna get into you know, Brad, I'm glad that you mentioned the uh, the third act because that's something I definitely want to talk about with both of you. Um. And we're gonna hear you know, maybe maybe Brad wins Dave over. Maybe Dave wins Brad over. UM. I'll do my best to referee this one. But before we get into it, let's talk about let's talk a little bit about this cast. Um. So, Brad, you know we talked about you mentioned Joe Um sitting outside on the on the swing set, Dave uh. Newcomer Joel Courtney. This is this is his debut.

8:45 Correct. What you guys think of this kid is fantastic. I thought, Brad, you had you have to give it to the acting in the movie was it was good. All all the people in it were fine. There are many many things in this film that are that are good. It just I think is a fool But yeah, there's a lot of good things in it though. Okay, okay, Yeah, this kid is so believable. It surprises me that he's a newcomer in this movie. Yeah. His his relationship with um Kyle Chandler who plays his dad. Um. Their their chemistry between the two of them is incredible. UM. I don't know if they put them in a room or put them together for a month or two before they filmed this thing, but I believe they were a father and son.

9:31 I thought they did a fantastic job together. And I know the one scene that they were together when Joe had to blow up to him when they were in the house and Joe finally stood his ground, I thought that was an incredible scene. And you know, I know JJ Abrams had a little problem there with with Joel because he was more soft spoken and he had to like get him to really shout back Kyle Chandler in that scene. But that just showed you the the moments of him and how he was able to pull that off. And he doesn't through the whole film. If if you haven't seen this film, and you want to know just how good this uh this young man wasn't it. Keep this in mind, they they looked at five thousand kids for this film. Joel Courtney just traveled, happened to go to Los Angeles to visit. His brother tagged along on a call, and you know, his brother's like, yeah, give it a shot. He goes in for like I think it's like a Pepsi commercial or something like that that's a commercial and gets noticed and they and they want him. So I think that's impressive. Um Brad talking about impressive, let's talk about Kyle Chandler.

10:41 Yeah, doing his uh very good U coach Taylor. But Kyle Chandler just knows how to do um authoritary figures really well. Whether it's in this zero Dark thirty Argo, obviously Friday Night Lights. He just is a very believable that guy, you know type of things. So and at the time, I mean, I don't I think if Friday Night Lights had just kind of ended. So this was a good role for him as as a leading man. He hasn't kind of taken off the movie careers as I thought he would. He's kind of sticking a more TV but I mean, yeah, I mean he's he does good and everything I think he does. I think I think what he's great at. Uh is that every man hero role? Yeah, Dave, is there a there a an alternate universe out there where Kyle Chandler is more of an action hero in the vein of Harrison Ford. I could see that for sure. What about you, brad Well, remember he kind of played a almost fictional action hero in King Kong. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was very much like that. Um so you can see it. But he took in a comical turn. It was on my It was on my, uh my mind because in this film, you know, towards the end, you know, he's he's he's the depute of the town. You know, he's he's the one cop that's trying to keep

12:11 it all together and take care of everybody. But there's that moment and we're, I know, we're gonna talk about how JJ loves to uh you know, kind of do a lot of callbacks to Spielberg in his style. But that scene at the towards the end where he punches out the soldier and then he is in disguise as a soldier, that is that is pure Indiana Jones and Raiders, you know, and that's why I thought. I thought, man Kyle Chandler could have been an Indiana Jones type everyman hero. You know. I love him in I love him in this film. Let's talk about some of these kids though. These other kids, Um, you know you got Ryan Lee playing Carrie Zach Mills is Preston h. Riley Griffiths, who plays the filmmaker of the group, Charles Kaznik. I think he's one of my favorite. He's one of my favorites actually, and this was his film debut two by the way. Yeah. Absolutely. It's funny. I don't know about you guys, but when I look at these characters to see who I relate to, I kind of gravitate towards Charles Riley Griffith because he's the director of the zombie film that they are making, and he's so passionate about it that he's not worried about anything else because he wants to make that film.

13:24 So I kind of gravitate towards his character more than I do anybody else. Right, what what do you think of this this cast of kids? Like the chemistry they got with the exception of Riley and Joe. I mean, I liked their chemistry together, but I thought the rest of the group was just kind of along for the ride. You know. They didn't have the guy with the fireworks the carry. It just didn't play. I feel like having fireworks with him at all times, that's it. Just it didn't seem to work. The Preston character. They just they weren't distinct enough characters.

14:05 I felt that like we knew who, um, you know, Charles was, He's the director, Joe is the makeup guy, but the other two were just yea, almost like filler. Well we're forgetting the third Gabriel Basso plays Martin, who's like the lead. Yeah, because I forgot. Yeah. Yeah, well I think I think you you definitely have a point there. I think the relationship is more geared towards like, um, the two best friends in a group of friends. Um, I can't that. Yeah, it's about that too. Yeah, I'll concede. I'll definitely concede that. Um, we got to talk about Ellie Fanning, who who plays at Alice is okay, yeah, plays Alice, plays Alice. Yeah, Yeah, I think I think with bringing her character into it, it kind of overshouted the other chara that are in that group, because you know, you you really needed her character to bring Joe out of his show, um, you know, and what happened between obviously Alice's family and Joe's family that we find out later in the film. So I think, and I completely agree with you, Brad. I think some of those characters get lost in the shuffle here, and but I think it's because of Alice's character. Let's talk about the rehearsal scene. They're at the train, They're at the train station, they're rehearsing the film. You know, the scene that they're about to do. Alice, you know, played by l Fanning is you know,

15:37 she's along for the ride. They're they're excited because it's like, well, you know, and I get it. They're all twelve, you know, so like the beautiful, unapproachable girl at school is willing to be a part of your film project. That scene where she does her quote unquote rehearsal, she is mesmerizing in it. Yeah, I mean, how she can turn performance on and off like that just gives this incredible dramatic performance. Yes, was that good? Yeah? But whoa what now, Brad? I mean Brad at this point, correct me if I'm wrong, because she she's the older sister of the Fannings, right, because Dakota younger one. I think she's a younger one. I don't know she's sure. I'm sure she's a nepo. I think she's the younger one though. Okay, well either way, I'm I kind of have to say I think she's the more talented of the two. I mean they're talented. No, I mean they are really talented, But I mean she's she's she was good in the film.

16:36 You know, she's a good romantic lead. Um, I think the the group needed one more girl that wasn't perhaps a romantic lead with with with the group. I think it um having the sister show up for just like a little bit Charles's sister. I think if maybe she would have been with the group a little more, there would have been a more balanced out. But yeah, I thought one more girl could have should have been in the group. Yeah. The uh the character, the older sister character that A. J. Mitchalca plays kind of it definitely reminded me of like the the Older Sister and Monster Squad exactly. That's exactly what I was gonna say yes, you know, like she's she's older. We we need her when we need ye uh yeah. Let's talk a little bit about Alice's dad, Lewis, who is severely down on his luck, played by Ron Eldard. This guy is awesome, Like, why don't we have more Ron Eldard? That's a good question. Character actor. Yeh know, he kinda he's played this kind of role before. Um, he's good at it. Um kind of a slimy, you know, down on his luck kind of guy drinker. Um.

17:51 But he's yeah, he's he's just got a character actor. He's a great character actor. I don't I don't. I wouldn't necessarily call him slimy in this because, you know, we we find out that he has responsibility for an accident in this film. Dave alluded to the the opening shot of the you know the mill where they're taking down the you know, no accidents and how many days? Uh, you know, I wouldn't call him slimmy. He's just um, he's a broken guy. He's a he's a you know, I mean, and we don't even know where where is her mom? You know what happened to his wife? We know, does it there's a scene where, you know, he kind of alludes to that that she left, but I think she laughed. Brad, Do you like him? Uh? You mentioned he plays this guy. Uh, he's played this guy before. I'm thinking of his role in Sleepers. Yes, I remember he did this uh HBO movie was called a great name Bastard out of California or something Bastard out of But he basically he played an abusive father and I know he had like a big I remember him from Er, you know, and he had a big anger problem in there, So that's kind of I remember that, Like he couldn't hold his temper very much in erm. I always remember him too from a deep impact. He was the hero astronaut. Yeah, I forgot about that role. The guy's fantastic. I like him.

19:11 I like him a lot. I'll tell you another guy, another character actor Brad that's in this uh who We don't see a lot of him, but I think he's really important. Uh. Talking about Glenn glint Urman playing doctor Woodward. Oh yeah, and I remember him yeah, and voice he does, but he's always he's he's most nine times out of ten. He's playing a biology teacher. Yeah, I was waiting for him pupil stage. Yeah, yeah, yeah, stage the I think the only time I saw him where he wasn't a teacher of some kind is when he was playing the detective in out of Bounds. Uh. We did on Our Patriot. We did at one of the one of the Lost eighty six episodes we covered Yeah, we covered out of Bounds with Jason Colvin from the Shirley He Can't Be Serious podcast and and Glenn Is playing the detective who gives us the movie's title, like, you know, you better watch yourself for you because you're way out of bounds, you know. But yeah, this this guy like he first for whatever reason, it's like he's attracted to uh, monsters or creatures as a biology teacher and he's either trying to help him or hurt him. So liked his role in it, you know. Yeah that was a good homage.

20:36 Yeah, okay, okay, okay, Dave, what are your thoughts on? Uh? Noah Emerick another another great character actor, playing the Villas villainous colonel is it Nelick? Yeah? Now, like, yeah, dude, that guy always plays a good bad guy. He always plays a good He's a great soldier character. So I can see why he got casted into that position. Uh, he's a jerk. He thinks he knows it all and obviously gets what he deserves. He he does indeed, Like, yeah, he always plays the guy like you hope they got it coming to him. Yeah, you know, like I like his banker character and warrior when when he's when he's taking taking Joel Edgerson's house, Like, man, someone punch that guy in the face, you know, and you're waiting for Kyle Chandler to punch him in the face this whole movie. I'm like, just do it. Come on, come on, coach, Come on, coach, Come on, Coach Taylor, like, just knock him out right, Yeah, I don't know. Um, let's let's get into some of these, uh these moments. We talked a little bit about the rehearsal scene at the train station, but this train wreck scene, the whole sequence, Brad, is this not one of the biggest just blockbuster moments of of a sci fi film? The way they shot and I remember was that was well, at least some of it, because it's a long train crash. Yeah, a long thing. That was the trailer and I remember, and that was like they showed that, and then it was like the titles from JJ Abrams and Steven Spielberg and it's like, okay, I can kind of see this

22:07 right now. But yeah, and and some of it was real and some of it was CG, but I mean it was. I mean, it's spectacular train, you know, trash. The fact that anyone survives it as a little fishy, but still, well do they do they? I mean the train itself. Are you talking about survivors on the train or no, I'm talking about the kid and that someone that was in a pickup truck and decided to run into it is in one piece. Uh yeah, Okay, I know Brad has some some some uh some concerns, David. I will concede this one too. You know, Uh, the good biology teacher is driving head on at a freight train and uh somehow manages to you know, barely survived, because I wouldn't say he walks away like he's Bruce Willison unbreakable.

22:57 But let's not forget it also explodes. Yeah, Like I just I love the I love the idea that I mean, you're watching this and Brad, you like you said this this is a long sequence. I'm scared for the kids because every time they run in one direction, there's shrapnel or metal or something exploding or falling near them calls in them to dart in the other direction. It's it's a great moment, I think. Did you notice the really intelligent thing that they did too, that they they made the sound really loud so that it seemed like the you know, we were hearing what the kids were hearing. Did you notice that that was probably the loudest thing was the I definitely picked up on that, uh more so on purpose? Well more so And maybe you guys, I don't know if you caught this, because this has got a great, great score film score, and Dave, I'm sure you're you want to talk about that. But the thing I noticed watching it this recent time, there is no music during the trade sequence on purpose score at all. Note as you said, it's on purpose, Dave, yep. That was actually Michael Giacchino, who did the score's idea.

24:10 He said that they shouldn't have any music there because the train accident itself is the most important thing to watch and the most important thing to watch the kids because of what was going on on screen, and he didn't want the music did you track from that? Which music would never de track for that? But I get what he was saying. Yeah, Dave, sounds like you got a little a little bit more you got, you got some insight. Uh we can we talk a little bit about the production by the Yeah, absolutely would love to. Um. This was released to a June tenth, twenty eleven, on a budget of fifty million dollars. It would end up earning two hundred and sixty million dollars worldwide, so a pretty successful film. Um JJ. Abrahams actually had the idea to start of film by showing a Factories accident free sign you know, which we talked about that several times.

24:52 You're already That was actually the first idea he came up with to create this movie, and then he started molding it with another idea that he had and eventually turned into this. Primary photography began in fall of September October twenty ten in Weirton, West Virginia, so not too far from us, and it lasted through December. Steven Spielberg actually was reportedly on set a lot, and him and Abrams have gone on record as saying as this was the most fun they've had on set in a really long time. But let's be honest here, if I was on a set with Steven Spielberg, I probably would have the funnest time I've ever had in my life. Too. Another interesting thing, too, is this takes place in Ohio, not too far from where we were born and raised, guys, just west of Dayton is where it's supposed to take place in a fictional setting called Lillian, Ohio, which JJ Abrams named after his grandmother, which I thought was really cool. He tried desperately to get George Romero to cameo in this film since they were shooting close to Pittsburgh, but fortunately it didn't work out, which that wouldn't been amazing because I don't know if you guys caught it. But in the kids film, what was it? Romero's um? It was a Romero chemical? Whatnot chemical? Yes, something like that, Yes, which I thought was a nice touch to give that nod to George Romero. But yeah, pretty cool stuff. He talks about this being the fictional town in Ohio, and you

26:26 know, we grew up, you know, whether you're talking about Amelia, New Richmond, Eastgate, I'm watching this that we grew up in this neighborhood, right, we grew up in this town. Yeah, this could be any of the areas that you know, or ten minutes away from us. So yeah, I did like that about that. It was Ohio. I'm like, yep, that's that's pretty much what it looks like. That Why that is? That is where we live? Uh? You know, he we we've been talking about Spielberg. Are you guys familiar with the you know, the whole, the whole Abrams Spielberg connection. Do you know where? Do you know how that began? Well? I believed the day him and Matt Reeves were supposed or did restore some of Spielberg's original like Super eight films that he did when he was a kid. I'm right right that is.

27:15 But but do you know how they met? How they met? This is good, This is a fun one. So it's nineteen eighty nine when they meeted a film festival. Spielberg actually pitched the idea of a sequel to Who Framed Roger Rabbit and uh talked about you know, Zemecke's coming back and him producing and potentially having Abram's right, because as we all know, Abrams is a very talented writer. Uh, it only went as far like allegedly Abrams has some some fun storyboards for the movie, and that's that's pretty much all that exists for who frame Roger Rabbit Part two? Oh man? Yeah, could you imagine the possibilities it can will do that? What are you talking about? I'd be up for it. Yeah. Yeah, interesting story though.

28:04 How they met that's pretty cool. Yeah, very cool, Like, you know, i'd be excited, Like I went to this film festival, yeah, and I met Steven spiel and he and he talked about a job. So yeah, I do think it's pretty cool anytime you see collaborations like this in Hollywood, especially when it's someone that you know, like they're they're this situation. You know, he grows up idolizing, Spielberg becomes you know, building, you know, just comes J Abrams, but comes J. Yeah, thank you, becomes j J Abrams. Yeah, Brad, this film has got some some incredible stuff in it. But let's talk. Let's talk about one scene you know that you think you take the scene out and the film is less without it, Like, what what's the pivotal scene for you? When when you when it comes to this moment um the train wreck.

28:59 Oh okay, you're gonna go with the big, big moment. It's the train wreck because there's a lot of stuff like I said that I thought should have been put in or taken out. Um, but I mean, to me, that is the best part of the film. Is is the train crash. And I mean everything leading up to it, Like I said, the the no music and how you can as you're still seeing them do that scene. You see that light just slowly creeping up, slowly and slowly slow because you know it's coming. Anybody that saw the trailer knows that it's coming. It's like this, it's coming. Where is it? So you're waiting for it, You're you're you're on your toes waiting for it. You're just not expecting to be that big. So yeah, it's that one.

29:44 I thought for sure the actor and you would be choosing the scene that I think is the pivotal moment. But uh, before before I reveal that, let's let's let's see what Dave has to say. What Dave, what's what's the what's the scene? So mind's a little lengthy to just bear with me here. And this is where when Brad said that he thought the third act was the weakest, and I completely disagree with him because I think the ending is the part that I think is the strongest. Because you know, let's admit, there's a lot of great scenes in this film, you know, the train crashing, the bus attack, the tanks, the weapons going off as the kids are racing through the neighborhood, and even the simple scenes between the kids interact with one another, and even the scene between Alice and Joe when they're watching his home movies of his mother. But to me, it is the ending. The music that Michael Gciano gives us, it's you know, it just gives me chills to hear that score. But Joe letting go of his mother's necklace a symbol of letting go of the pain and moving on, you know. And then before that, when his father and him meet eyes and they you know, he runs up to him and grabs him and says, I got you, you know, very emotional, and it feels just like et just like it should. You know. Not only do we have the alien getting free after years of torture, uh in imprisonment, but he fights his way to get home, which is really, in my opinion, is the backstory to Joe and Jackson's pain that they had to deal with, you know, losing a mother, losing a wife, and the two

31:15 of them realizing in that moment when they find each other again and hug, that they have each other and that's what matters. That's why I think that ending was very powerful and that movie would not have worked if we did not have that. Okay, I that uh, very very well said. And man, Brad, you know that is not the scene that I'm thinking is the pivotal moment in this in this film. So maybe there's there's a lot of pivotal moments, but I'm thinking, Brad, you and I had a conversation about this scene. So that's why I thought, Yeah, Brad's Brad's got this one. Uh the argument between father and son, you know. Yeah, well, I mean I think that's I think it's funny the way he talks to the son. Well, I mean, well, okay, I know you love the line that he that he gives him, but but just the moment where where uh where Joe kind of takes takes a stand and you know, like like we've talked about and you know, he's not gonna be told you know what to do because you know, he's he's kind of calling his father out on the on the fact that he's not he hasn't been there his whole life. Yeah, and uh, just the the moment between those two, I think it's it's it's an incredible moment, definitely. Uh is is probably the more weighted scene of this of of the movie. And uh, I feel like without that moment, we don't understand the animosity between the two throughout the entire movie. Uh, it definitely would weaken the the

32:45 ending where they they embrace and you know things are gonna kind of be okay. So um yeah, I mean I was looking at the uh when when Alice is kind of given the the background of what happened on the day of the accident, you know, they watching home movies of of Joe's mom I thought that was a great moment, and I was I was like, this might be this might be the scene. But I don't. I don't think you can get away from what Joel Courtney and Kyle Chandler do in that moment. So interesting. We uh, you know, we typically you know, we all kind of agree, you know, like, yeah, that's got to be the scene but this is a situation where we went we went separate ways. I like that though. That's that just movie spoke volume to each of us differently. That's pretty cool, absolutely, Brad, Okay, let's we gotta we gotta talk about this. I know you both are you know, you've been sizing each other up and circling each other the whole episode.

33:39 We gotta talk about this ending. So now to be fair, Um, you know, the audience critics everyone are kind of split down the middle. It's been lauded as both fantastic and to Brad's point, very anti climactic. Um, I think what we have to do in order to decide, like which way are we going to roll on this is you know, we got to talk a little bit about this this uh this this alien because you know, we opened up we were talking about you know, like the the hostile type of aliens, like you like a xenomorph, and we talked about the the fun heartfelt you know, let's save them aliens like uh like et So this thing, you know, it crashes and we find out through the story it has been imprisoned and you know, experimented on and tortured for decades and over that time, it has grown to resent us, obviously because we're the hostile species. So you know, we talked about it being misunderstood. I'm I get it, like, you know, it should want to, you know, wreck the town and it should want to eat us, and you know, and do what it needs to do to get to get out of town and get back home. So Brad, you you feel it's very anticlimactic.

35:04 I'm gonna ask you because I know when it comes to the seventies and the eighties, you are always going to be in the camp of the seventies. When it comes to the gritty filmmaking of the seventies, I felt like the class I felt like the amending was it was kind of like an ode to the Close Encounters. You know, like you got this big, grand thing happening, but you know, the resolutions not as prominent, you know. I just feel so all the other movies that are referenced as a homage to this film all have a great build up to the ending, and you know, Close Encounters has the drive into the town and the chase up the mountain with just the I mean the great ending of the aliens coming down and communicating ets got the bike ride with the kids flying in the air, then the spaceship you know, Goonies has the pirate ship and everything like this.

36:04 Well, first of all, why isn't the military checking out the school in the first place? And that shed you know, and like you know, Noah was it Noah Emeric? Yeah, like of all the places, the check they wait till the last and the monster keeping people and I just yeah, that just none of that worked the way those other films worked with that. And then will you get this very sappy, you know, kind of delivery of we Hurt Too, and it it just felt kind of cheesebolish. No, no, it was cheap, its polish. It was very cheesy.

36:45 I know they wanted to end the film very etsqe with the ship going up and the kids looking, but I felt at this point, you know, everything with the necklace were I mean, we're trying too hard to build that team. Well, I make why are you building so much to try and make us cry when we don't really need to It just yeah, I just felt that the last act of the film was pushing it so hard to be this brand scale um opus of a film that's going to be talked about by generations and generations like those other films that we mentioned, and it's just not going to be Dave your your rebuttal, sir, he's wrong. I mean what I can say, Hold wait, hold on, hold on, wait a minute, wait a minute. Let's you know you you had, you had your time, sir. Let's let's see. Let's see what Dave has to say. You know, Dave, because you love that, you love the ending, I do, you know? And I feel like when I when I talked about the ending that I got, you know, because again and I'll say it again, I felt the alien was the backstory of you know, the father and son's story. You know, sure they were trying to go for you know, I guess, well, Brad say a sappy story, but I still felt like that word to me because that's how we started this movie, was getting involved in this family who had lost someone, so we are following them. They are the characters. This alien just happens to show up and become part of the story that you know, pushes

38:21 and drives them to realize they need each other. That alien pushed them to that reason. We don't really need to know anymore. One of the problems I do have with this movie, and is the fact that the biology teacher worked for the military, knows all these teachers and he doesn't let him go and work for a school. I do have a problem with that, absolutely, and I think that is something that should have been fixed in the script. But I still feel that the ending worked great because of the character development that we got throughout the film and pulled them together, and that's what we got. Well, you know, I I see your side a little bit, Brad, But for me, I don't need a copycat of all these other movies. You know. I know it's given an omatch to all of these films, and I think it did a really good job with that.

39:14 And that's the way I saw it. It's looking through JJ abrams because and like I said earlier, if I was to direct this, I would have gone probably the same route. You know, I want to give an omatch to all of these films. I don't want to copy other things. Even though you kind of are with an homage, but you're still focused on those two characters, and I think that was the most important piece, and I think that got lost with a lot of people. Well, oh, I'm still here and I have A I have a thought on that, okay myself. Look, I could appreciate both viewpoints here. However, the thing that I love about the third act is that we begin it with that that going into the Monster's Din style of of a of an ending. You know, we're we're hunting the thing, and then it flips on us and then it becomes about a rescue. It's it's about helping this thing get get away, you know. And I love the fact that, you know, uh, that Joe has that moment with the the creature, the alien, and it's kind of like an understood thing, like yeah, wait it, you know, because you know, Brad was like, you know, Brad to your point, you know, you said, you know, well, why is he keeping all these people? Well they're cocoon because he's eating them, you know. And again I don't feel like that's a villainous thing. It's just he you know, surviving, he he's surviving. He you know, you need a snackpack, you know. So you know, I mean, if

40:45 we're we're on a four, we're in a foreign area, we're gonna we land somewhere, We're gonna we're gonna eat you know, we're gonna hunt and that's that's all it is. So, um, I don't know. I mean I'm in the camp. Uh, Dave, I loved, I loved your thoughts uh and your viewpoints. Uh. And while you know, while I agree with with uh with you thinking that that it's a great ending, Uh, it's a strong third act. Uh, it's it's for the reasons that I stated. So um yeah, but I mean, listen, this this film. We we've all got different opinions, which I think is pretty cool. Uh, whether it's we're talking about things that that are impactful or or or problematic. So uh, this just again, anytime you have a film like this where you're kind of you're having this kind of conversation, it means something. I think it does. And you know, everybody respects everybody's opinions. That's what we do well here, you know, I respect Brad for his opinion. I expect you respect yours, Jeff, because that's what we do here. You know, we can't all agree. It's just that's the way it works. It'd be boring if we all agreed. Well, we're gonna take a quick break, but when we get back, we're gonna talk about director J. J. Abrams. Okay, Jason's test of our friendship, which is better Van Halen or Van hagar Man? Honestly, I think Vana hagar has better music. Oh no, no, no, no, it's Van Hampy wrong. What about Michael Jackson's bad album versus Michael Jackson's thriller out Thriller obviously bestseller ever? No, no, see, people tricked themselves and believe that it's actually bad. Okay, Trading Places versus Coming to America. Trade Places is the funnier movie out of this this down. No.

42:16 Coming to America is the funniest movie of all time. So if you find yourself backing one of us or the other of us, you need to be listening to the Shirley you can't be serious podcasts. That's right. We have a friendly discussion. D and I are best buddies, and we take a deep dive and look at the behind the scenes stuff, the history and the fun facts of all these wonderful movies and music from our youth. It's really just an opportunity for us to geek out about the things that we really loved growing up. For example, do you know the actor that was in Star Wars Batman eighty nine and Raiders of the Lost Ark. Yeah, Sharris Harrison Ford, Harrison Ford in Batman, Oh yeah, Billy B. Williams. Billy D. Williams was not in Raiders of the Lost Ark. Who was it? Well, you've got to tune in to the Shirley You Can't Be Serious podcast. When we discussed Raiders of the Lost Stark presses back to the future to find out the answer. We are back talking about Super eight.

43:02 Jeff Can you tell us a little bit about the director, producer, writer, JJ Abrams, composer. Yeah, listen, there is too much to tell you about Jeffrey Jacob Abrams. So I'm gonna be as short and sweet as possible. Born in New York City to parents that were both television producers, he had planned to go to art school instead of college, but ultimately enrolled in Sarah Lawrence College in New York City. At sixteen, he writes the music for his first film, nineteen eighty two's horror movie Night Beast. Did you guys see that one? No, I'm I'm curious now, but it's During his senior year at college, he partners with Oscar nominated director Paul Mazurki's daughter Jill to write a treatment. That treatment would go on to be sold to Touchtone Pictures and become a little film, a little Jim Blushi film called Taking Care of Business. Did you guys see that one? Love that movie? Love that movie? Right? That was him? That's crazy.

44:09 Yeah, well you know this is and I didn't know that was him, but more surprising to me a couple of years. A year later, he writes regarding Henry uh the nineteen ninety one Harrison Ford movie, yea great movie, Brad, you and I kid, we can never look at ritz Crackers without thinking about that Z. And then a year later follows that up. He writes the screenplay for Mel Gibson movie called Forever Young. That's right, Oh my gosh, So I had no idea he had such a prominent beginning as a writer and a composer. But um, nineteen ninety four, we're all we're all about to graduate high school. He teams up with another with other Sarah Lawrence alums h. They're known as the propeller Heads. They start doing experiments in computer animation, and that work appeals to none other than Jeffrey Katzenberg. Guess what he had to do with him. Okay, dreams a thing yet I don't know if it was. I believe it was because he hires them to UH to develop animation for a little animated movie called Shrek starring Yeah. I feeling that's where you were going with it. Yeah, interesting and if that, you know, so he's he's writing music, he's writing screenplays, he's he's developing animation, computer animation. Nineteen ninety eight, he writes another screenplay, Armageddon, which earns him a Razzie Award for Worst Screenplay. I can't believe that that movie was that movie. That movie is fun right, and you know, you know what's funny enough is the other

45:43 writer I believe on that, Jonathan Hensley. I think his name is or or no I or Kiva Colesman. One of them eventually ends up winning an Oscar later, I think from Beautiful mind if yeah, And I'm pretty sure that JJ abrams when I read about movies and stuff in the late nineties in early two thousands, he did a lot of ghostwriting too, to help other films out. He did do some uncredited stuff, which you know, we didn't really talk about. But same year he writes Armageddon. He also teams up with his buddy Matt Reeves, amazing director we have yet to talk about on this podcast, but they create the show Felicity, which starts the whole I'm JJ Abrams and you know I create Blockbuster Television. So in two thousand and one he creates the production company Bad Robot with Brian Burke, and they would go on to create Lost in Alias and Fringe. I know, Dave, I know you and I are big fans of Fringe. Brad, I know you and I are big fans of Lost. I've never actually seen Lost.

46:51 I would like to watch it. Yeah, I would like that's a show that I would like to start from me getting to end. Ah Man, you're it's such a great one. Which when Loss came out, there was no streaming, you know, so it was either you either tape it or you asked somebody if you could borrow their DVD set, you know, and you just didn't know that many people. It was it was dreaming. It was get your ass home because it's Wednesday night, and it's it's and if you worked at night, you were just like, I just gonna have to I just I knew I missed my Lost window after a while, Jeff, I think we were neighbors at that time, because I think we watched Lost together at times. Yeah, yeah, I would, I would, I would Cramer in your door and just yeah, yeah, it's Lost, so let's watch it. I'm gonna ask you guys. Um, he's probably I know he's famous for these things, but he's also very famous for Alias.

47:39 And that's something I never saw. Now, you know, I did not look as I know I didn't either. I'm sure it was good. Um, you know, it had a lot of guest stars on it. I think Bradley Cooper started on that show. Um, Quentin Tarantino I think wrote and directed one episode, So I mean it had a he had a big follow Well do you know who? Do you know who who was who was a big fan of that show? Who? None other? Nope, Well that would have been a good That would have been a good guest bright maybe who knows, maybe spoburg Is. But I'll tell you who was a fan of Alias. Uh, none other than Tom Cruise because there's the connection.

48:20 In two thousand and four, he's hired to write and direct the The Third Mission Impossible movie, and it's all at the insistence of Tom Cruise. So there you have it. Uh, and that's that, you know, directorial debut, Mission Impossible three. That is one heck of a movie to start your Yeah, he's been involved involved producing every one of those films since then. Yep. Yeah, So let's talk a little bit about this filmography. Um. Now, we we talked about some of the things that he has written. By the way, I know we're all fans of this one. He wrote joy Ride also two thousand and one. Wow, I did not recently watch that a couple of months ago, and you know the movie is, Yeah, the thing is, you're not gonna see the like these these writing credits, you're not going to see them where it says j.

49:09 J. Abrams because he was going by Jeffrey Jacob, Jeffrey Abrams, Jeffrey Jeffrey Abrams or Jeffrey Jacob Abrams. He didn't become JJ Abrams until Mission A Possible three when he has arrived. So yeah, two thousand and six, Mission A Possible three. We had had the John wu action movie with the second one, and then this kind of this kind of I don't want to say course corrects, but it does get it back on track to like the original one, exactly your your your your thoughts on Mission A Possible three agreed both the best thing that they probably did was take it in that direction. And um, you know it was six years between you know that second and third film, so taking the time and find it in the right way that they want to go to that and I think every one of those films had which is weird. The sequels are supposed to get worse as they get, but these ones seem to be getting better. They do, yes, they do. Here's something I thought I thought was was really interesting. He gets that job because initially, like in two thousand and two, David Fincher was attached to direct Mission Impossible three. He leaves the project over creative differences with Tom Cruise. Then they hired Joe Carnahan, who by two thousand and four leaves the project citing creative differences. And then Tom Cruise is like, hey,

50:40 I like this guy, I like this show. Get him. Paramount's like, well, he has some obligations to lost an alias that's going to delay the movie. And at the time he had Kenneth Brannig, Kerry and Moss and Scarlett Johansson all in the cast of m I three MM. And they're like, well, we're not waiting, let's let's go. Tom says, now we're waiting. So the three of them left the project. I mean that again. That says something like when Tom Cruise wants something, he's gonna get it. Yeah. Yeah, let's talk about two thousand and nine. He takes on, he leaves, he leaves the Mission Impossible franchise. He's still with Paramount and now we're talking about rebooting Star Trek and he does an incredible job with it. He breathed life back into Star Trek, is what he did. He made it cool. Yeah he did right, Yeah, now he is. He's on record as saying he was a Star Wars guy, but he felt, you know, I can I can bring other people people like me. I can bring them into the Star Trek world, you know, because I know he started off. It's it's it's after Mission Impossible three. Uh. Robert orc and Alex Kirtman they've got the deal to write the film, and you know, they bring him on as a producer.

52:00 But I thought this was kind of cool. He accepted Paramounts offer to direct it, saying, and I quote he would be so agonizingly envious of whoever stepped in and directed the movie. And that's after he read the script. So I thought, like, Brad, you said it man, he made it cool, right, and you know the bat Boys on the soundtrack, you know, Chris Chris Pine playing playing a young Kirk. Everything on that movie for me worked. He gave the Star Trek that grittiness that it was missing, you know, that that military esque feel to it, and he brought that and gave it, like I said, a new breath of air to star track and it worked. It worked a big time, but still keeping the science fiction mystery to it, you know, a little a little geeky and you know, time warpie type of things. So that balancing that out and giving a film that could both men and women can enjoy, you know, and a like, oh, yeah, this is just not a Star Trek film, It's an entertaining good film. Yep. Yeah.

53:08 Well, he was protective of the lore, like you know, when it comes like their prime directive, you know, not to disturb indigenous planets and uh and help them with their technology. He was respectful of what had come before, but you know, he gave it that grit that you guys are talking about. He made it cool like you guys were talking about twenty eleven Super eight. We've been talking about that this episode. And then as he's rapping Super eight, he promises to get right back into Star Trek talking about Star Trek Into Darkness. Now, this is originally conceived as a two parter, and they were planning on bringing Shatner back as an older Kirk, the same way they had brought Leonard Nimoy back in the first film. Obviously, none of that happened, and we got we got what we got, you know, with the whole you know, the whole con um situation. Well, Brad, your thoughts on Into Darkness. I loved it. I loved Into Darkness. I know a lot of people don't like it. I thought it was great. I thought it was a great thing to throw in Cohn in there it. I remember smiling when he looked at the camera and said, my name is conn I'm like, I knew it, I knew what I happened, knew it. I thought it was great. I thought it was I liked the twist that they did between switching the Kirk and Spock thing.

54:28 I thought it was a great sequel, a great summer movie. I don't know why people had a problem with it, but I had a problem with Super eight, So I understand. Okay, Dave problems with the Into Darkness or because I know you're a big fan of The Star Trek, I am. I was not a fan of Star Trek Into Darkness because I caught it. I knew. I knew it was gonna be all about Con before they even started making this movie. I knew that was where JJ Abrams was gonna go with it, retreading all new the same ground again that we saw with the Wrath of Cohn. We didn't need it. Um, there are parts of it are really good, but yeah, I was lift down by that film. Okay, this time I'll step onto Brad's side of the of the camp because I got what I what I hoped for. You know, at the time, I was like, oh, he's He's Cohn, and they're like, no, we're not doing that, And then yeah, I I was. I was right there with Brad like, oh, I knew it. I knew he was gonna be con. I thought it was a fun action movie. I again, Brad, to your point, I loved the classic death scene. But the way they flipped it and uh and changed it, I thought it was fantastic. Um. Yeah, so moving on.

55:40 You know, he's a Star Wars guy that has made some Star Trek films and now he finally gets to make some Star Wars movies. So I know the three of us all have some uh some very strong and long winded opinions on the the the Disney trilogy as it were. Uh, we don't have time to get into all that, but I will tell you this. Listeners. If you would like to hear what Brad and Dave and myself have to say about the Force Awakens and about the Rise of Skywalker the Rise of Skywalker, check out head over to Docking Base seventy seven. Last May, we were involved in a two part episode entitled Not So Long Ago in theaters not too far Away if you want to hear our friend and host of that podcast, Dayton Johnson, take some beatings here and there as he defends some of the movies. Uh, you know, check that out. Great episode I had. I had a blast talk in Star Wars with Dayton. I know so much. And if it's May here, it's it's revisit that because it May the fourth and then you're gonna want to watch Star Wars after absolutely.

56:59 Yeah, yep, yeah, we just uh yeah, that just happened. So yeah, check check check him out because that's a good that's a good episode. Quickly though, to offer a little bit of a spoiler to that episode. Your thoughts on JJ Abrams's work in the Star Wars universe. I thought he did a good job. I thought he did actually a really great job. I loved both films that he did. I know the second film didn't get as much appreciation as the first film. It made us all excited about Star Wars again, and it said something that we just never thought we'd see, and we never thought we'd see it done so well, you know, and not just a quick cameo type of movie. So I liked what he did with it, and I'm glad he was a part of it.

57:46 I wish he would have been a part of all three films, all right, Dave, your quick thoughts. Exactly what Brad just said right there at the end. I wish he had had the whole trilogy because what he did with the fourth Awaken was fantastic. He kind of had to clean up a mess with the Rise of Skywalker. So if he was able to do all three of them, we would have had a different outcome of a better trilogy. All right, So I'll tell you something. Doing some homework guys, you know, talking about what's next for this guy, there's like forty different projects he's either writing, or he's producing, or he's in development on. So rather than try to even talk about any of them, I want to know, starting with you, Brad, if you're going to pitch to jj Abrams, what do you want to see him do next? And more importantly sub question, are you are you wanting him to write it and directed or just directed? I would like him to direct a fourth and final Star Trek film. Star Trek Beyond was if you didn't like the Into Darkness, then you're gonna hate Beyond. But to have him come back give us a a cling on bass story. He teased it a little bit and Into Darkness and I thought that was one of the coolest parts of the film, and close the film off with a great send off, you know, and it's okay that time's gone by? How long was it? I felt like it was a long time between when we got that Star Trek five, the Final

59:19 Frontier and then when we got Undiscovered Country and I was like, Okay, that's a good send off. So something in that kind of vein and that was a cling on based episode or a film, and I think he should do something in that kind of vein of Undiscovered Country, but a cling on thing where really ends it with that cast and crew. Okay, uh, Dave, are you keeping Abrams busy with franchise blockbusters or do you want him to try something different like Super eight? So just brand keeps reading my notes, don't. I don't want to Star Trek four. I actually want JJ Abrams to dive into a Star Trek TV series. I want to see him even if it's on Paramount Plus. That's fine. I know Star Trek is getting huge again on TV on streaming. I want to see a TV series written and maybe one or two episodes directed by J. J Abrams. Okay, interest, well I think too is that you know, even what I've said the negative things about the film, this is a director that's a good director, but he takes too long to do films in between, you know.

1:00:32 I mean, he's a good director and we have to wait a long time for him to he said there's a lot of writing producing stuff that he's got coming up. Did any of those say director, because I want to, So, yes, Star Trek close it out, and then I would love for him to do outside franchise stuff. And I think there's more to explore once he gets done out of that shuffle of the franchise world. I would like to see what he does with just basic straight drama or a comedy or a straight up action film. You know. So I would love to see something like that. You two have been trading blows the entire episode, and I'm happy to see that you agree. We're closing it out with an agreement. You both, You just both you both want to see Abrams get his check back on. So I took it. I took it light.

1:01:23 There's a lot of inconsistencies about Super eight that I did not say. You just keep that to yourself, all right, So listen Super eight. If you do not own the excellent two disc Blu Ray edition that is noted with awesome stuff, including a very fun audio commentary by J. J. Abrams, it is available. It is streaming on Prime, Pluto TV, and the Roku channel. Brad starting with you, where did you see it, and I think I might know the answer. But do you recommend seeing it? It was on Prime. I'm sorry, I don't recommend seeing it. I think what this film did was boost a phenomenon called Stranger Things that I feel made more entertaining homage to that Spielberg, you know stuff of the eighties.

1:02:17 I felt that that did it better. But yeah, I don't recommend the film. Dave, where did you see it? And what is clearly going to be your opposite response to the recommendation question. I clearly own the Two Days Blu Ray Edition, and I love every second of it, and then watch it once a year, and I highly recommend seeing this movie, going and buying this movie and having it in your library. Well breaking the tie. I too own the Two Days Special Edition. Love it, love the film, love it for the nostalgia, love it for the action, love it for the mystery, love it for the performances. Um. So yeah. If if you find yourself often siding with UH, with with my viewpoints, uh, check it out or Dave's viewpoints, check it out.

1:03:12 If you if you find yourself often siding with Brad, maybe this one. Maybe you want to skip it, but you see where the vote lies. Um okay for speaking of things that you shouldn't skip? What else do we got coming up here with um film By this week our Patreon members are getting two exclusive new episodes. First for fans of the nineteen eighty six series Jason Colvin from the Surely You Can't Be Serious Podcast, We'll be back to discuss the supernatural thriller Nomads. We'll also discuss the comedy classic A Fish Called Wanda on a special Patreon requested episode, made possible thanks to producer James Buckley.

1:04:00 That's patreon dot com backslash a film by podcast, sign up and stop missing out? And coming up this Friday, we welcome a special guest to the show. Filmmaker Stempson Snead will join us to discuss his award winning shorts and his new feature length directorial debut, Tim Travers and The Time Traveler's Paradox, starring Danny Trio, Keith David, Joel McHale, Felicia Day, and Samuel Dunning. You definitely don't want to miss that one. But over at a film at forty five, Dave, what do you guys got coming up?

1:04:45 Well, you know it's sad we're getting close to the end of our run of it and I hate to see it go. But coming up next for us is we actually have Docking Base seventy seven's host Dayton Johnson joining us for none other than National Lampoons Animal. Oh A good time, Lord, nothing, it's forty five years old and it still holds up. And you guys will be wearing your togas during the recording. That's right, yep, Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead. And I don't know if it's a it's a bit good thing or a bad thing, but we might we might need to go video on that one. Just make sure make sure that one brings the toga you know. That's right? All right. I think that'll about do it for us until next time. This has been a Charles Castic production.

1:06:08 Brad's looking confused. I don't get it. Literally, you didn't watch the film, did you? Super eight? Oh Charles? Okay? Yeah, okay, okay, I forgot his last name. Yeah,