A Film at 45 - Watership Down

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Hello everyone, and welcome back to
the year nineteen seventy eight and a Film

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buys limited series A film at forty
five. I'm David Burns and I'm Scott

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Hoffman. Then thanks for joining us
again. We're dusting off the end of

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a decade that changed cinema forever with
a fresh look at modern classics and hidden

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gems that we can't stop watching even
forty five years after their debut. With

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today's episode, we're jumping back into
the animated side of seventy eight with Martin

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Rosen's Watership Down. All the world
will be your enemy, Prince with a

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thousand enemies. Whenever they catch you, they will kill you. All the

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world will be your enemy, Prince
with a thousand enemies, And whenever they

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catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you.

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Digger listener, runner Prince with a
swift warning, be cunning and full of

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tricks, and your people will never
be destroyed. Based off the iconic nineteen

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seventy two novel by Richard Adams,
it has been considered to be the most

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violent animated PG movie ever made,
and could say traumatized a generation of kids,

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including yours. Truly, the film
was nominated for the Hugo Award for

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Best Dramatic Presentation in nineteen seventy nine. Scott, let's take our listeners to

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the nearby warren and let them know
what is this film all about? Yeah?

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So, this animated classic tells the
story of a small group of friends

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on a quest to escape danger,
find their freedom, and build a new

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home in a place called Watership Down. They just happen to be rabbits.

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They live in their own natural environment, the wild hillsides of Hampshire in southern

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England, where they have their own
culture, language, and mythology in a

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home that's always felt safe, but
never quite free. When one of them

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is terrified by a premonition of their
homes destruction, they set out on their

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own to find something new. It's
an epic quest in a strange yet familiar

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world just below our backyard, and
an original adventure unlike anything we've ever seen

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before. So let's get into this
animated classic that's barely given half a century

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old and talk about why it endures
as a timeless story. Dave, I

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don't know about you, but one
thing I love about this movie is that

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it does take that that environment that's
so familiar and turns it into another world

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entirely. It does. This is
the movie that does an excellent job of

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putting us as an audience into the
eyes of rabbits, and you know,

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we care and what they are going
through, what they're dealing with, you

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know, you know, is it
five I believe has the premonition of you

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know, what is to come.
So he you know, freaks out and

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gets Hazel and they try to get
out of there. You know, it's

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their quest and you completely pulled into
that quest of them going across the land

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to find a new place to live, right, you know, And it's

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it's it's a scary world looking through
those rabbits. You know, it's not

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your typical Disney film. It's not
a Disney film, but you know what

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I mean, you know, it's
it's scary, it's creepy, there's death,

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you know, and it's it's frightening
world. And we see that through

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the eyes of the rabbits. Yeah, and it's it's expertly told. It's

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one that unfortunately in a lot of
instances, it's um it's somewhat kind of

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dismissed as a children's movie just because
of the nature of it being animated,

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which I've always thought is a is
a big mischaracterization of the genre in general.

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I think animation reaches a lot of
people of different ages, and it's

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one of the reasons that a lot
of animated movies become classics that adults continue

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to love. I think it's something
that can transcend ages. I think it

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can transcend a lot of things if
if people kind of give it the chance

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and don't kind of regard something that's
animated as something that strictly for kids.

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And I think at the time,
this is one of the first times when

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I think, in my experience in
the in the US, this is one

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of the first times when animation was
allowed to do so. Even though we

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had just talked recently about Ralph Bakshi's
Lord of the Rings try to do a

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similar kind of thing right right,
and both successfully did so. But there

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are times when this will be seen
as you know, it's a movie about

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rabbits and it's animated, so people
think it's just for kids. It's interesting

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that it is, but it really
isn't. No, It's it's true.

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I mean, you watch this film
and especially you know the final fight there

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you have at the end. I
mean, they don't hide anything when it

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comes to blood and gore and you
know, the dog ripping the rabbits apart

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and stuff like that. That is
some frightening stuff. Scott. Yeah.

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Well, and it's never used to
excess, right, It's never used as

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like you know, seeing somebody's intestines
spilt or something like that. Sorry,

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anybody who's having breakfast. But it's
it's always told to make it very real,

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like this is not um even though
they're they're rabbits that have their own

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language and society and things like that. They're not wearing outfits, they're not

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trying to be people. They're telling
their story with a voice that we recognize,

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but it's very much their society.
They're very much claws and fangs and

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and things like that to protect themselves
and to establish new territory and um.

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Yeah, I think one of the
disturbing scenes that pops out in my mind

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is when they learn about Fiber's premonition
coming true and how that's realized is a

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terrifying thought. Yeah, I'll give
the spoiler warning now for anybody who's you

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know, it's a it's a it's
a podcast. About forty five year old

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movies. But just in case,
um, give you a chance to get

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out. Um the scene where they
talk about the rabbits being trapped underground when

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they're being gassed, Oh my gosh. Yeah. And it's not only that

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terrifying idea of like, you know, your home being filled with gas.

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That's that's lethal, but the fact
that they couldn't get out because the bodies

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of the other rabbits were piling up
and block blocking the way. Yeah.

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Scary, good god, you've got
that. You've got a fair amount of

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violence. You've got this this idea
of death personified in the Black Rabbit.

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Um, all very mature things,
All things that I mean, I think

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you have to kind of gauge whether
or not a child could be ready for

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that kind of stuff. Yeah,
but then again, it's it's it's something

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that is a mature story that's not
told, like I said, to excess,

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So it's something it's a very approachable
when that kind of topic is is

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right for a kid. I think
this is a great movie for them to

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see. So, Scott, you've
got kids, Yeah, what age would

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you allow them to see this movie? That's a great question. It's what

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I've been thinking about because when I
was watching this on my own, I

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was like, well, maybe I
should watch this with my youngest. I

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think I would probably get into probably
about fourth maybe fifth grade with this,

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because I think that's just around the
time when they're probably going to start getting

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into dystopia kind of books. They're
starting to learn about those subjection it's becoming

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a little bit more real. I
think that's the kind of age where you

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can set this movie up, and
I absolutely would set it up as this

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is a really interesting look at a
world that we've never been able to see.

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Whenever you see a rabbit runaway and
run down a hole, you kind

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of one or how far does that
go? You get to see that,

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you get to see a closer look
at a rabbit's actual life. And even

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from the first I kind of want
to call it an animatic in the in

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the opening, which is beautifully told
and beautifully animated with the um with an

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amazing narrative that we'll talk about soon, one of my favorite voices of all

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time. But it sets up this
idea of rabbits having the power of speed,

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the power of swiftness, being clever
and all this other kind of stuff

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because they're having to evade things like
weasels, foxes, dogs, cats,

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hawks. You get a very close
look at a very real look at their

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What they need to do is to
survive, and they're how They're kind of

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pursued by various creatures, including humans. But it's very real because you see

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um when they get trapped, there's
in a snare, there's blood, they

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get cut, they get you know, it's it's never meant I don't think

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it's ever meant to be scary.
No, it's not meant to be real.

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But it is a very real discussion
of death, and it's not always

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necessarily a violent death. Sometimes it's
peaceful, sometimes it's natural. I remember

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when I saw this as a kid, I was not expecting it same.

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Yeah, when did you first see
this? Oh gosh, I want to

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say I was probably eleven or twelve
years old when I saw this movie for

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the first time. Like I said
at the beginning, it did traumatize me

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a little bit. I wasn't ready
for what I was going to get.

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Right, Um, I assume you
probably saw it on TV and it just

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happened to beyond and you caught it
right probably about the same time we were

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seeing things like the Hobbit exactly right
at the ranking Bass Hobbit. I don't

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know about you, but this is
one of the the first times when I

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saw a kind of mature animation that
also seemed appropriate. It was kind of

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like finding a book for the first
time that is accessible to kids, but

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not necessarily written as though it was
kind of pandering to them or patronizing to

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them. It was kind of like, this is a serious journey if you're

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ready for it and jump in.
I saw the same way for the first

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time, and it was it was
fantastic. Um. It drew me in

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for the animation, right, because
it seemed like it wasn't kind of the

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disneyfied kind of animation style, um, something different like Raging Pass's Hobbit.

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It was also something that the voice
acting absolutely drew me in in one in

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one regard because it was a lot
of British actors and I was not used

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to seeing British things at the time. You're right, right, what kind

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of things were you seeing at that
age, right, Like from Britain?

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The Hobbit. Maybe that's that's really
all I can think of off the top

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of my head at that age.
I mean there was like Doctor Who.

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I think I really won Doctor Who
at that point, but yeah, I

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know it was around. I know
my brother was watching that a lot,

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just like one of these weird special
effects stuff like you know, Tomorrow People

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and Money Benny Hill, which is
a whole different thing that was kind of

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being sprinkled in. And then when
you hear so much voice voice acting from

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Britain, it kind of makes it
seem a little bit more like, um,

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a little bit more unusual, a
little bit more like something that's kind

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of an import that also kind of
drew me in it does. You're right,

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I couldn't agree with any morning and
I say, it's something else it

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does, is it? You kind
of mentioned it touched on it a little

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bit ago. When you do see
a rabbit now out in low in the

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world, you look at them a
lot differently after you've seen water Ship Down.

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Yeah. You know, even when
I was a kid, like when

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I was out, you know,
hiking in the wood and stuff, and

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I'd see a bunny bounce out and
it quickly sent me back to watching Watership

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Down and say, oh, I
wonder where his burrows at. I wonder

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what's going on? You know,
right right well, and teaches you a

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little bit more respect for the rabbit, like, yes, this is not

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a cuddly creature. Don't try to
grab it and take it home, because

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it will defend itself. Yeah.
Yeah, it's got its whole society,

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it's got its whole own world,
and obviously it's not as we might not

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understand it, but it is very
real, absolutely absolutely Well, Scott,

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let's talk a little bit about this
cast. Since we've mentioned we've touched a

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little bit on it, um,
so let's talk about little bit about the

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narrator that you mentioned. Who is
that, Scott, none other than Sir

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Ralph Richardson, returning as the voice
of God known as Frith to the rabbit

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world, um, the Supreme Being
from Time Bandits. Sir. He also

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plays the Chief Rabbit and um,
his voice is spectacular. It's automatically identifiable

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as soon as I heard it.
There are times when I was watching this

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and listening to it more than I
was paying attention to the visuals, and

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it's it's it's fascinating how many times
these voices bring you to other places at

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the same time. Fits so well
within the role such a commanding presence,

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but also a welcoming kind of paternal
presence. And yeah, in that intro,

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oh goodness, such a beautiful intro
with his voice and the stylized kind

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of um kind of reminded me of
like Deathly Hallows, absolutely Black Panther,

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and it totally convinces you that all
of this stuff is real. It seems

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like established mythology that's taken from another
part in the world, but it is

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completely taken from the imagination of the
author of the original book. Yeah,

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and I believe another director had done
that part. It was John Humily was

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directing Watership Down first and then he
got let Go, but that opening sequence

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is his and they kept it in
the film, which I think is really

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cool. Yeah. Yeah, it's
it's very fitting and it does a great

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job of from the beginning, it
establishes you're gonna see some disturbing stuff because

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as soon as the cats and dogs
and whatnot evolved to the point where they

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have kind of natural weapons, they're
killing rabbits. So it's very clear from

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the beginning like this is about these
rabbits getting pursued with this black rabbit of

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death kind of always looming presence.
So yeah, Sir Ralph Richardson love it.

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I do too, I do too. Well, we've already mentioned this,

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gentleman when we did The Rough Box. She's a Lord of the Rings.

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But John Hurt, who is the
voice of Hazel, does such a

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wonderful job in this role. Um. He just got that distinctive voice.

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You know, I've known him for
so many other things, and we've mentioned

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it before, you know, Alien
Harry Potter. But what I found interesting

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too is that John Hurt and Nigel
Hawthorne, who is also in this movie,

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Nigel author and plays Captain Campion.
Uh, those two would go on

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to do a couple of other animated
together. They would do Richard Adams The

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Plague Dogs in nineteen eighty three,
and they would also do The Black Cauldron

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in the nineteen eighty five together.
And I want to do a shout out

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there to a docking base seventy seven
Dayton Johnson's podcast. We did a podcast

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on the Black Cauldron with him,
so and that was a lot of fun.

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How do yeah, yeah, um, but yeah, John Hurt does

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a wonderful job as Hazel. Um. Then we have what Richard Bryers,

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who plays Fiver. Um, I
didn't really know much about him, but

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apparently he did some UK work for
Bob the Builder, which he was one

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of the voices above the Builder.
That is amazing, Yeah it is.

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He did some Torchwood, which I
love. You've never seen Torchwood, definitely

206
00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:11.240
check that out. Yeah, you
know, he did Doctor Who as well,

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which these were British actors. You're
probably gonna see a lot of these,

208
00:16:14.120 --> 00:16:17.519
uh you know connected to Doctor Who
in some way or Oh yeah,

209
00:16:17.519 --> 00:16:21.039
well, John Hurd is one of
my favorites as the war doctor. Oh

210
00:16:21.120 --> 00:16:25.159
yeah, absolutely, so good,
so good yep um our test based on

211
00:16:25.279 --> 00:16:30.279
Ralph Richardson. There the next one
who has a very special place in my

212
00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:37.120
heart because I know him as Marcus
Brody Indiana Jones. And of course that

213
00:16:37.240 --> 00:16:41.480
is then Holme Elliott, who plays
cow slip Um. He has done so

214
00:16:41.559 --> 00:16:44.759
much work over the years, and
but I will always know him as Marcus

215
00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:48.399
from Indiana Jones. Just it just
is that's who I grew up with.

216
00:16:48.480 --> 00:16:51.919
I'm sorry. When I first heard
his voice when I was watching it recently,

217
00:16:52.679 --> 00:16:56.399
I happened to be looking away before
he said his first line, and

218
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as soon as he spoke, I
felt like Salah, oh yeah, I

219
00:17:02.039 --> 00:17:07.359
was just like Marcus Brodie. Oh
yeah, I loved hearing his voice and

220
00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:12.079
and so so well done. There
is there is, there are no gaps

221
00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:18.000
here in voice acting. Um,
it's all just astonishing. Um. And

222
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another familiar voice that came around,
Um Roy Kinnear as Pipkin. Oh yeah,

223
00:17:25.880 --> 00:17:30.279
mister Salt from Willy Wonka. Yep. Another distinct voice that that just

224
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made me smile as soon as I
heard it. Um. Joss Ackland surprised

225
00:17:36.039 --> 00:17:40.160
me. Um in this one as
the voice of the Black Rabbit, who

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I always come back to, Um, the villain from Lethal Weapon too.

227
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That's right. Oh yeah, I
forgot about that, you're right. Yeah,

228
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yeah, I watched the documentary,
so as soon as it's his hace,

229
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I was like him, that's right. And then of course you know

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00:17:56.880 --> 00:18:00.480
Michael Graham Cox who plays big Wig. We talked about him. He was

231
00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:03.119
in Ralph back to He's Lord of
Rings as um a boor Mere. Yeah

232
00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:07.960
yeah, a lot of connections here, yeah absolutely. Um. But of

233
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course U Zero Mostel who played as
a Key Horror. Yes, he voiced

234
00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:18.680
Key Horror. This was his last
movie because he would pass away after voicing

235
00:18:18.880 --> 00:18:22.559
um Keyr, which you know,
we definitely want to mention him. He's

236
00:18:22.799 --> 00:18:25.799
done a lot of work as well, but you know, he went out

237
00:18:25.839 --> 00:18:27.839
with a great film, I'll definitely
say that, and anything hard for him.

238
00:18:29.160 --> 00:18:32.039
I think his his role was spectacular
in this one, and I think

239
00:18:32.079 --> 00:18:37.200
he did a great job of giving
the right kind of um, kind of

240
00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:44.079
comic relief. Yeah, but never
being you know, bumbling or that you

241
00:18:44.119 --> 00:18:47.759
would would laugh at somebody who just
gave a little bit of levity to the

242
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situation. And the way that he
portrayed this character, uh, spectacular.

243
00:18:55.039 --> 00:18:56.799
Yeah. Not not to keep using
the same words again, but it's hard

244
00:18:56.839 --> 00:19:00.279
not to, but it's hard not
to, right, it does, and

245
00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:03.200
you know, and they've made some
other versions of Watership down over the years.

246
00:19:03.559 --> 00:19:06.920
I believe there's a TV series too
that they did. Um. Netflix

247
00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:08.359
has done one recently if you've not
seen that, and I guess we can

248
00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:11.480
touch based on all it later.
But it's really well done. I enjoyed

249
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:15.759
it, um, But this one
in nineteen seventy really holds a special place

250
00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:18.519
in my heart. But you're right, you know, you got this,

251
00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:22.599
this this crazy bird who does such
a wonderful job of just you know,

252
00:19:22.799 --> 00:19:25.359
he makes you laugh. But it's
not you're not laughing at him, you're

253
00:19:25.359 --> 00:19:27.359
just laughing because he's just goofy,
you know, right right, well,

254
00:19:27.400 --> 00:19:33.559
and he's one of them. He's
one of the few times when the character

255
00:19:33.599 --> 00:19:37.759
it's almost like a character from outside
the rabbit world, right right, So

256
00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:41.079
he's aware of things like the oceans
and you know, all this other kind

257
00:19:41.079 --> 00:19:45.920
of stuff and the world beyond theirs. So he gives us a little bit

258
00:19:45.920 --> 00:19:51.599
of um It's almost like Han Solo
I think does in Star Wars, where

259
00:19:51.599 --> 00:19:56.279
it's like everybody's very immersed and bought
into this mythology and somebody like what hold

260
00:19:56.319 --> 00:20:00.240
on a second, ken, It
gives you like a realistic kind of record

261
00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:03.359
scratched there. So yeah, I
think he did a phenomenal job and he

262
00:20:03.400 --> 00:20:06.920
definitely steals the scene. Oh ever
seen that he's in. And these rabbits

263
00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:10.079
aren't dumb. I mean they're finding
people or they're finding other animals who can

264
00:20:10.119 --> 00:20:11.640
help them, because I mean,
you know, you get a bird who

265
00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:15.680
can like fly high and look around
and spy, which is exactly what you

266
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need, you know, a scout. Yeah, So I mean these rabbits

267
00:20:19.319 --> 00:20:22.559
are intelligent. They're trying to find
their way to a safe place. But

268
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yet they're they're getting assistance where they
need it, so very smart of them.

269
00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:30.880
Yeah. Yeah, we got to
talk about the dark side too.

270
00:20:30.880 --> 00:20:36.039
We gotta talk about General Woundwart.
Oh yeah, Harry Andrews is the voice

271
00:20:36.079 --> 00:20:41.279
of a General Woundwork. Yes,
very creepy um just seeing him. How

272
00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:44.160
decrepit and evil he looks. Man, you can tell he's been through a

273
00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:49.119
few fights. Well, he's been
through the horrors of losing his home planet

274
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of Krypton. Yeah, he's right, the Elders in nineteen seventy eight's Superman.

275
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He sure is you're right now another
connection, Scott, They're all over

276
00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:03.000
the place exactly. Yes, No, he gets such a wonderful job as

277
00:21:03.079 --> 00:21:07.960
genner Win work that you know,
you dislike you're scared of him, especial

278
00:21:07.960 --> 00:21:08.839
when you're a little kid. Man
you're like, yikes, man, I

279
00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:15.160
mean he's like the Darth Vader of
this for sure. Right. And it's

280
00:21:15.200 --> 00:21:21.839
it's again like when you think about
animation, it frees it frees up the

281
00:21:21.880 --> 00:21:25.799
production to a certain degree to be
able to say, like, we don't

282
00:21:25.839 --> 00:21:29.720
have to try to craft this thing
three dimensionally and make sure that it doesn't

283
00:21:29.720 --> 00:21:37.279
fall apart. Animation on its own
is a very painstaking, intricate process,

284
00:21:37.559 --> 00:21:41.440
but I think it allows somebody to
do so much more, to explore so

285
00:21:41.519 --> 00:21:45.920
much more. And the way that
he's drawn, the way that he's illustrated,

286
00:21:45.839 --> 00:21:52.440
he fills every area that he's in, even when he's standing outside.

287
00:21:52.000 --> 00:22:00.400
It's this big, intimidating presence of
a rabbit that has m one one eye

288
00:22:00.440 --> 00:22:06.079
that's completely glazed over. He clearly
has his scars. Um and balance that

289
00:22:06.119 --> 00:22:14.480
with the voice UM that absolutely calls
anybody to stand at at attention and um

290
00:22:14.720 --> 00:22:18.000
and and be afraid of him.
And there's a viciousness that comes out UM

291
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:26.960
in that voice acting during the climax, and it just it draws you so

292
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:30.759
much further in and um and does
just a great job of making it kind

293
00:22:30.799 --> 00:22:36.200
of a thrilling scene. Yeah,
And he's the he's the leader that leads.

294
00:22:36.759 --> 00:22:38.519
You know, he may be evil, but he maybe you know,

295
00:22:38.680 --> 00:22:41.680
sees the world in his own way. He doesn't care about anybody else,

296
00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:45.039
but you know he Um, he
gets in there and fights. He doesn't

297
00:22:45.079 --> 00:22:48.440
sit back and let his soldiers do
the work. You know, he goes,

298
00:22:48.519 --> 00:22:51.240
he goes in there and fights himself. And you see that man.

299
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He goes right into that burrow and
goes after those other rabbits because you know,

300
00:22:55.519 --> 00:22:57.640
he doesn't care he's going to tear
him apart and take over, because

301
00:22:57.640 --> 00:23:02.279
he's just got that vengeance in his
in his eyes that he just sorry.

302
00:23:02.839 --> 00:23:06.920
And I like that because the fights
that he has, you know, they're

303
00:23:07.000 --> 00:23:11.559
they're rough, man, they're tough
that you see on screen. Yeah,

304
00:23:11.599 --> 00:23:14.440
for sure. Yeah, Well,
of course we have to talk about the

305
00:23:14.480 --> 00:23:18.920
director himself, Martin Rosen. You
know, I know that we talked a

306
00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:21.119
little bit about John Hubily. He
was supposed to do this, but I

307
00:23:21.160 --> 00:23:26.319
believe it was Martin Rosen who was
in disagreement with him, and I guess

308
00:23:26.359 --> 00:23:30.200
they ended up just letting him go. I know, John Hubily passed away,

309
00:23:30.440 --> 00:23:33.559
I believe in seventy seven, so
he wasn't able to see the finished

310
00:23:33.559 --> 00:23:37.200
product that was out there, and
I'm just glad they were able to use

311
00:23:37.279 --> 00:23:41.079
his opening sequence that we already talked
about because it was very fitting for this

312
00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:45.759
film. You know, it's set
the tone. But but a nice way

313
00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:48.359
to honor that director of making sure
some of his work still made it into

314
00:23:48.440 --> 00:23:53.200
the film. Yeah, Martin Rosen. He began production in this in seventy

315
00:23:53.240 --> 00:24:00.799
five. He is actually from Bronx, New York. It seems like we

316
00:24:00.839 --> 00:24:03.359
get a lot of that anymore,
you know. I believe Boxhi two went

317
00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:07.599
to New York as well. Yeah, in the thirties, so it seemed

318
00:24:07.599 --> 00:24:08.119
like a lot of people go to
New York. You would think it would

319
00:24:08.119 --> 00:24:11.680
be Hollywood, California, but now
back then it seemed to be in New

320
00:24:11.759 --> 00:24:15.160
York. Seemed to be the popular
place. You know. All right,

321
00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:18.480
so let's talk. Let's talk some
more about through the lens Scott. What

322
00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:22.519
do you got. Yeah, there's
a very interesting documentary on the DVD that

323
00:24:22.519 --> 00:24:27.200
I've haund actually where they do a
conversation with Martin Rosen and the editor Terry

324
00:24:27.279 --> 00:24:33.720
Rowlings, and they talk about the
production of this movie and the what they

325
00:24:33.720 --> 00:24:38.160
had to go through to get it
done. It's an independent movie. They

326
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:45.359
had a hard time getting it secured
with a studio. A lot of a

327
00:24:45.359 --> 00:24:49.680
lot of places actually didn't really understand
what it was supposed to be about,

328
00:24:51.720 --> 00:24:53.799
which is something similar to what we
heard with Lord of the Rings. They

329
00:24:53.799 --> 00:25:00.119
would hear a rabbit movie and and
one of them happens to have, you

330
00:25:00.119 --> 00:25:03.799
know, extrasensory perception and things like
that and warns him of danger, and

331
00:25:03.079 --> 00:25:07.200
they were really bought into it,
even though this had begun as such a

332
00:25:07.200 --> 00:25:14.000
popular novel in the UK, which
I don't think we can we can skip

333
00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:18.200
over. It's a completely original story
which I think is fascinating the way that

334
00:25:18.200 --> 00:25:22.000
I understand it. It was written
by Richard Adams at the insistence of his

335
00:25:22.160 --> 00:25:29.240
daughters, Juliette and Rosamund, based
on these long car trips that they would

336
00:25:29.279 --> 00:25:34.920
take to see Shakespearean productions. He
would make up these stories on the fly

337
00:25:36.039 --> 00:25:38.759
and just kind of talk to them
and kind of just tell them off the

338
00:25:38.799 --> 00:25:45.559
top of his head, and they
convinced him to turn it into an actual

339
00:25:45.599 --> 00:25:52.559
story, to weave it all together, which he got done in eighteen months,

340
00:25:52.079 --> 00:26:00.440
dedicated to his to his daughters and
based on some descriptions he knew of

341
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:04.240
wild rabbit behavior. With time he
spent with a friend, Ronald Lockley,

342
00:26:04.279 --> 00:26:11.200
a famous British nationalist, they went
on a tour of Antarctica and wrote another

343
00:26:11.200 --> 00:26:15.960
book on that voyage. Had some
difficulty getting that made. It was rejected

344
00:26:17.000 --> 00:26:19.599
seven times before it was finally produced
again. It was that idea like you

345
00:26:19.640 --> 00:26:23.880
know, not understanding exactly what it's
about and seeing it as as as a

346
00:26:23.960 --> 00:26:30.640
big risk. But when it was
published it got a lot of acclaim Like

347
00:26:30.640 --> 00:26:34.759
you said, the seventy two Carnegie
Medal, the Guardians Children's Fiction Prize,

348
00:26:36.680 --> 00:26:41.359
Californian Young Reader Model, aside from
being tremendously popular in the UK, so

349
00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:48.359
as I understand, when it was
released there it did very well as a

350
00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:52.839
movie and then found legs to be
able to reach in other places. It

351
00:26:52.920 --> 00:26:57.799
wasn't easy to do so they couldn't
even get an advance on from showing it

352
00:26:57.839 --> 00:27:02.839
in theaters. They could get maybe
a couple of locations, They couldn't get

353
00:27:02.839 --> 00:27:07.759
advertising money, couldn't make prints,
and basically had to try to get it

354
00:27:07.799 --> 00:27:12.160
going on their own, a very
independent kind of approach for something that became

355
00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:15.799
the second or third highest grossing movie
in the UK at the time I think

356
00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:21.240
it was. Yeah, Yeah,
I'm just astonished at how much they were

357
00:27:21.279 --> 00:27:26.119
able to take something that was very
well known in some places but unknown in

358
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:33.319
others and turn it into something that
has become this classic in both media,

359
00:27:33.400 --> 00:27:37.200
in both as a book and as
a movie. It's clearly had a big

360
00:27:37.200 --> 00:27:41.440
impact. Yeah, and again,
you know we've mentioned as many many times

361
00:27:41.440 --> 00:27:44.039
in other podcasts. You know,
this is a time when there's no social

362
00:27:44.079 --> 00:27:47.279
media. You know, there's none
of that. So you know, these

363
00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:51.720
movies thrive on word of mouth from
people. I mean, yeah, you

364
00:27:51.759 --> 00:27:53.359
have news you know who talk about
stuff. You know, you had Jeans,

365
00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:56.680
says Gordon Rodert Ebert that would you
know, review these movies, And

366
00:27:56.680 --> 00:28:00.640
you were pretty much lenient on that
kind of off in newspapers and on TV.

367
00:28:02.599 --> 00:28:04.279
But you really didn't have what you
have today with Facebook and you know,

368
00:28:04.400 --> 00:28:08.119
the Internet and stuff like that.
So these movies really thrived on word

369
00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:11.440
of mouth. So it just shows
you the legs this movie got and how

370
00:28:11.440 --> 00:28:15.599
well it was done, on how
successful it became with it being an animated

371
00:28:15.640 --> 00:28:19.480
film that was just so independent and
they struggled to find that money to make

372
00:28:19.519 --> 00:28:22.839
it, but look what happened.
They have a classic on their hands to

373
00:28:22.920 --> 00:28:27.240
this day. Yeah. Absolutely.
What I find interesting too is Watership Down

374
00:28:27.279 --> 00:28:33.599
is a real place. It's located
in south of Newberry, in which I

375
00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:36.240
find that so cool. I want
to go visit that just to walk around,

376
00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:40.799
you know, see some rabbits please. Yeah. You know, here's

377
00:28:40.839 --> 00:28:42.880
another thing that I found very interesting. A couple of things actually so this

378
00:28:42.960 --> 00:28:48.960
is the first anime movie to be
presented in Dobe stereo in theaters, a

379
00:28:48.279 --> 00:28:56.400
little ahead of its time. But
apparently back in two thou eleven, developers

380
00:28:56.400 --> 00:29:02.000
had announced they're planning to develop a
park near Newberry, Berkshire, which is

381
00:29:02.039 --> 00:29:06.759
almost what happens in the movie that
Fiber has the vision of, right,

382
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:11.720
you know, the same scenario was
happening in and apparently Richard Adams got involved.

383
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:17.039
You tried to organize in opposition to
the development for obvious reasons, you

384
00:29:17.039 --> 00:29:18.160
know, because you know he talks
about that in his book, it's in

385
00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:21.920
the movie. You know that this
is why, you know, the rabbits

386
00:29:21.920 --> 00:29:23.079
were leaving that, you know,
to go find a new place because of

387
00:29:23.200 --> 00:29:27.640
humans threatening and destroying the place that
they want to live. I just found

388
00:29:27.640 --> 00:29:32.200
out how unusual it is that this
actually really happened in the same place that

389
00:29:32.279 --> 00:29:34.039
this book takes place. How crazy
is that? But yeah, and it

390
00:29:34.079 --> 00:29:37.319
seems like something that people wouldn't allow. It would just be like, you

391
00:29:37.359 --> 00:29:41.359
know, here's my proposal for why
this should be essentially be in nature preserve.

392
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:44.640
Yeah, puts the book on the
table, puts the DVD on the

393
00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:48.960
table and says absorb either one of
these, and you understand why there's a

394
00:29:49.000 --> 00:29:53.920
case that has been made since the
seventies to keep this, to keep this

395
00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:56.960
killing. There's a difference between developing
it into a park and it's made for

396
00:29:57.000 --> 00:30:02.559
people and maintaining its something that's a
preserve. Like you said, you'd love

397
00:30:02.599 --> 00:30:06.039
to go visit, not so that
you can, you know, go to

398
00:30:06.039 --> 00:30:08.839
a pepsi machine and drop a few
quarters and get something to drink, and

399
00:30:08.960 --> 00:30:11.960
you know, go to the snack
bar that's down the path. Something where

400
00:30:12.000 --> 00:30:15.559
you want to see it, but
you don't want to disturb it because you

401
00:30:15.640 --> 00:30:21.119
respect what's happening there. I love
the fact that when they when they illustrated

402
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:27.000
this movie, it's it's all based
on real locations, and they wanted to

403
00:30:27.039 --> 00:30:33.519
maintain that realism, even down to
the sound um. When they went and

404
00:30:33.559 --> 00:30:40.119
did the sound recording, they recorded
things like the train, things like the

405
00:30:40.160 --> 00:30:45.079
cars, just the environment. They
recorded in a in the actual location,

406
00:30:45.160 --> 00:30:51.359
so there's sounds from the actual water
ship down at the time. They did

407
00:30:51.400 --> 00:30:56.519
some other fully work behind the scenes
afterward, putting together just massive trays of

408
00:30:56.880 --> 00:31:04.200
grass and soil and even using some
some rabbit for to to help simulate it,

409
00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:07.599
just running through it with their fingers. I think there's a that's another

410
00:31:07.640 --> 00:31:14.759
aspect of the the realism in this. You hear nothing but the sounds of

411
00:31:14.759 --> 00:31:18.160
wilderness, aside from those times when
you do have that trespass of a train

412
00:31:18.319 --> 00:31:26.079
or a car, which sidebar is
a is a great, a great representation

413
00:31:26.119 --> 00:31:30.960
of this being their own world because
they have these uh what do they call

414
00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:36.160
it? The car, the yeah, and the train, and it's all

415
00:31:36.359 --> 00:31:38.079
naming it based on the sounds that
they hear. But other than that,

416
00:31:38.119 --> 00:31:42.640
you don't get humanity trespassing very much. Um. There are scenes where they

417
00:31:42.680 --> 00:31:48.960
trespass on a human farm, but
otherwise it's all the grass rustling. It's

418
00:31:48.960 --> 00:31:52.839
all that stuff that you'll hear if
you go out and just stay in the

419
00:31:52.839 --> 00:31:56.480
middle of nature and just kind of
let it surround you. And I think

420
00:31:56.480 --> 00:32:00.440
it's a beautiful thing that they did
with this, right. Um, Well,

421
00:32:00.480 --> 00:32:02.079
before we go too much further down
the rabbit hole, let's take a

422
00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:07.480
quick break and come back for the
rewind now, Jeff, you know I

423
00:32:07.519 --> 00:32:12.200
love my extras and my bonus features. Now, are you ready to offer

424
00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:16.519
some to our listeners? Absolutely,
Brad, That's why we've launched via Film

425
00:32:16.559 --> 00:32:22.559
by Patreon. Starting for as little
as three dollars, you can become a

426
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production assistant to receive a film by
Merchandise and gain access to our exclusive content.

427
00:32:29.440 --> 00:32:31.680
That's right. Each month, we'll
be offering up everything from episodes about

428
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our favorite actors to audio commentaries of
our favorite and not so favorite movies.

429
00:32:37.119 --> 00:32:39.960
Now, for you fans of the
familiar, we've got a nice surprise,

430
00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:44.759
right Jeff, that's right, brad
Our. Patreon is the only place you'll

431
00:32:44.759 --> 00:32:51.119
get access to the lost nineteen eighty
six episodes. We're covering twenty more movies

432
00:32:51.160 --> 00:32:54.359
from nineteen eighty six, and we've
got some of our favorite guests joining in.

433
00:32:54.599 --> 00:33:01.599
Now you mentioned merchandise stickers, t
shirts, our new color changing stadium

434
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:07.279
cups exclusive to the Patreon. So
join today and get in on all the

435
00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:15.839
great bonus content. Welcome back,
everybody. So let's let's rewind a little

436
00:33:15.880 --> 00:33:20.559
bit. Let's talk about some of
our favorite stuff in this movie, Scott,

437
00:33:21.039 --> 00:33:27.680
some favorite scenes. I think some
of the favorite scenes would probably be

438
00:33:28.960 --> 00:33:34.319
Fiber's visions. There's there's the premonition, and then there's another one later in

439
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:39.000
the movie. And what I like
about that is that it it blends the

440
00:33:39.039 --> 00:33:45.519
animation style that we saw in the
beginning with the animation style of the main

441
00:33:45.599 --> 00:33:49.799
part of the story, and I
think that does such a great job to

442
00:33:49.880 --> 00:33:53.200
kind of keep you grounded in the
rabbits world but also take you out of

443
00:33:53.240 --> 00:33:59.559
it a little bit and use the
animation to kind of take you to another

444
00:33:59.559 --> 00:34:05.480
place. Um. I think that's
done so beautifully. Similarly, I guess

445
00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:10.039
along similar lines the Black Rabbit.
Um, just the way that that's illustrated,

446
00:34:10.159 --> 00:34:14.519
kind of the the shading and the
way that it kind of fades in

447
00:34:14.599 --> 00:34:20.119
and out. Um. I just
find those things so fantastical while also staying

448
00:34:20.159 --> 00:34:23.239
grounded and sundering leaving. Yeah,
yeah, what about you I have There's

449
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:25.639
so many favorite things that I counsaid
here and talk about for a while.

450
00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:30.039
But I think one of the scenes
that I loved was when the rabbits to

451
00:34:30.119 --> 00:34:36.320
go to let the dog go because
to attack to fight General Woundwork and his

452
00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:39.599
soldiers. Um. I love how
you know each rabbit stopped in their spot.

453
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:43.519
Yeah, that they would take turns
to the dog would look at them,

454
00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:45.599
and they, you know, to
give the other rabbit a break because

455
00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:47.079
they were running so much, give
them some rest. So the next one

456
00:34:47.079 --> 00:34:52.199
would take on the journey of making
the dog chase them. UM. I

457
00:34:52.320 --> 00:34:55.159
love that that quick plan that they
came up with to do that. Um.

458
00:34:55.239 --> 00:34:57.960
I thought that was so well done. And then when, of course,

459
00:34:58.000 --> 00:35:01.440
when the dog arrives and he just
starts attacking General were his soldiers,

460
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:06.440
and it's just the violence of all
that was just well done. You know.

461
00:35:06.519 --> 00:35:07.599
We we said, you know,
they don't have the violence here just

462
00:35:07.679 --> 00:35:10.000
to have the violence. They don't
show the gore, to show the gore.

463
00:35:10.400 --> 00:35:13.599
You know, they're just showing,
you know, what would happen in

464
00:35:13.599 --> 00:35:16.519
a situation when a dog would go
after a rabbit like that. And I

465
00:35:16.559 --> 00:35:21.280
just thought that was well done.
And you know, but one of the

466
00:35:21.280 --> 00:35:23.960
other ones that I loved too,
and I already mentioned it was the fight

467
00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:29.119
between big Wig and General Winwart.
I think because it was so brutal.

468
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:34.400
You could just see two rabbits going
out one another that just did not like

469
00:35:34.639 --> 00:35:37.559
or care about it, but they
were just trying to defend what they believed

470
00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:43.679
in. I thought that scene was
really well done. And the other one,

471
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:45.719
I've got to mention this one too. I told you I've got so

472
00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:47.360
many. I could keep going and
going and going, Scott, because this

473
00:35:47.400 --> 00:35:52.400
movie has just done so well.
Big Wig. I like when he got

474
00:35:52.440 --> 00:35:58.800
captured in the trap, because you
saw the panic, You saw the fear

475
00:35:59.000 --> 00:36:02.920
and the other rabbits when trying to
dig that spike out, you know,

476
00:36:04.000 --> 00:36:06.320
when he got trapped in trying to
you know, get it out so he

477
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:09.360
could get some air in his lungs, and then you know he didn't.

478
00:36:10.039 --> 00:36:14.559
He thought he died. You know, you have the blood coming out of

479
00:36:14.599 --> 00:36:16.199
his mouth, and he's just like, you know, that was devastating.

480
00:36:16.239 --> 00:36:20.280
Man. You know, I'm thinking
back to when I first saw this.

481
00:36:20.480 --> 00:36:22.719
I just remember like, oh my
god. I was just sitting back,

482
00:36:22.760 --> 00:36:25.400
depressed and just scared, frightened and
worried, like does this really happen?

483
00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:29.599
You know, did do rabbits get
caught in traps like this? And of

484
00:36:29.599 --> 00:36:31.920
course they do, but you're seeing
this for the first time, you know,

485
00:36:32.079 --> 00:36:36.039
through through your child's eyes, and
he's just like, Wow, that

486
00:36:36.159 --> 00:36:37.639
was rough, Scott. It was
rough, But I was glad to see

487
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:42.400
big Wigs survived. Yeah, And
I mean two of the things that you

488
00:36:42.519 --> 00:36:49.440
just mentioned make this a masterclass intention. Literally that scene where he's trapped in

489
00:36:49.440 --> 00:36:54.679
the snare, it's his own resistance
that's strangling him, right, he keeps

490
00:36:54.719 --> 00:37:00.199
that line taught on the spike and
he's trying to pull himself away to get

491
00:37:00.199 --> 00:37:02.719
out of it, not understanding that
that's making the line around his neck tighter.

492
00:37:05.079 --> 00:37:10.000
There's a great amount of so that
that tension of the scene, the

493
00:37:10.079 --> 00:37:15.440
dramatic tension where you don't know if
he's going to live or die. He

494
00:37:15.639 --> 00:37:17.880
looks like he has all this blood
writing down his face. He seemed like

495
00:37:17.920 --> 00:37:21.599
he's a goner. He has that
pause for a moment where it seems like

496
00:37:21.599 --> 00:37:24.880
he is going and then he kind
of sputters and comes back. Spoilers on

497
00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:32.000
a forty five year old movie.
But but that is a great kind of

498
00:37:32.119 --> 00:37:39.239
simple, um but very powerful example
of that tension. And then what you

499
00:37:39.280 --> 00:37:44.400
mentioned about the dogs or the dog
scene, Um, they have that great

500
00:37:45.039 --> 00:37:50.639
plan, but it kind of builds
in tension. So there's the tension of

501
00:37:50.679 --> 00:37:52.440
being chased by the dog. Will
they each be able to get away?

502
00:37:53.000 --> 00:38:02.239
Then as they stop near that the
giant robot robot wire tower, the dog

503
00:38:02.320 --> 00:38:06.760
stops for a minute and comes back
like he's catching in on you know,

504
00:38:06.760 --> 00:38:10.119
he's getting wise to what they have
planned. And then as they get him

505
00:38:10.159 --> 00:38:15.719
close to where the big fight is
happening. You know that that dog is

506
00:38:15.760 --> 00:38:20.760
outside, so you've got the tension
of what's happening and inside with the Manoamano

507
00:38:20.920 --> 00:38:23.840
battle. But you also know that
anybody who sticks their head out there's a

508
00:38:23.920 --> 00:38:28.880
risk that giant set of dog jaws
could be waiting for you out there,

509
00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:31.920
which is what they have in mind. But it's just such a great build

510
00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:37.639
of sequential tension when it's really just
one idea of being chased by a dog.

511
00:38:38.440 --> 00:38:42.880
It's brilliant. It is absolutely brilliant. Is definitely the word we want

512
00:38:42.880 --> 00:38:45.800
to use here, all right,
So let's move on to let's score it.

513
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:52.440
Any thoughts on the music's got I
thought the music was very impressive.

514
00:38:52.519 --> 00:38:58.320
There's two parts we have to talk
about. The first is obviously the score

515
00:38:58.480 --> 00:39:02.440
itself. So as I understand it, the original composer was only able to

516
00:39:02.480 --> 00:39:07.679
put together a few sketches of music
and five minutes of score for a ninety

517
00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:15.199
minute film. They were able to
get Angela Morley and who picked up after

518
00:39:15.320 --> 00:39:20.199
Malcolm Williamson, who was the one
that was unable to finish it. But

519
00:39:20.960 --> 00:39:23.199
what Angela was able to do is
to develop the whole score in two weeks

520
00:39:23.880 --> 00:39:30.079
and did so with very little to
work with, but just knocked it out

521
00:39:30.119 --> 00:39:34.360
of the park. In that documentary
they comment on how you know, when

522
00:39:34.519 --> 00:39:42.320
the composition was played by the orchestra, there was this giant applause in the

523
00:39:42.400 --> 00:39:46.519
room with respect to what she was
able to do. It's just it fits

524
00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:52.119
this so well. Can you imagine
only getting two weeks to do something like

525
00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:57.000
that, something that massive. I
cannot imagine the pressure that would be put

526
00:39:57.039 --> 00:39:59.719
on you, that would be put
on Angela in a situation like that.

527
00:40:00.400 --> 00:40:02.679
I just it's mind boggling, it
really is. But yes, knocked it

528
00:40:02.679 --> 00:40:06.880
out of the park. Yeah,
for a movie that not a lot of

529
00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:09.679
people were understanding what it was supposed
to be. The studios didn't even understand

530
00:40:09.719 --> 00:40:14.920
what it was trying to be.
There's no precedent set for this kind of

531
00:40:14.960 --> 00:40:19.039
thing that I can think of.
Um, so it's it's trying to,

532
00:40:19.519 --> 00:40:22.920
you know, get the right tone
and get everything the way it needs to

533
00:40:22.960 --> 00:40:28.960
be to set the stage for all
this. From a musical's perspective, I

534
00:40:29.000 --> 00:40:31.920
think she did a brilliant job.
Oh yeah. But the other side of

535
00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:37.719
this we have to talk about is
art Garfuncle's British number one hit Bright Eyes,

536
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:42.760
Bright Eyes, Yes, perfect perfect, that one perfect song. I'm

537
00:40:42.760 --> 00:40:46.239
gonna stay right there for that.
Um, I know was it was it?

538
00:40:46.320 --> 00:40:50.280
Mike? Was it Mike Batt who
wrote other songs for the film but

539
00:40:50.360 --> 00:40:54.880
weren't used. Ye, so they
went the composer recorded three songs with vocals

540
00:40:54.920 --> 00:40:59.800
by Art golf Uncle, but it
was only the Bright Eyes that was made

541
00:41:00.280 --> 00:41:04.320
for this film. And you know
when when that happens in the movie,

542
00:41:05.239 --> 00:41:07.360
I you know again, I could
go back to say that was probably one

543
00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:10.199
of my favorite parts of this film
too, just because it was five going

544
00:41:10.239 --> 00:41:15.000
looking for Hazel correct. Um,
you know when when this was used,

545
00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:16.760
so you don't know what's going to
happen. So I thought this was a

546
00:41:16.800 --> 00:41:21.800
perfect song for that, for that
part. Yeah, And I mean it

547
00:41:21.920 --> 00:41:29.920
really Um it gets into the the
emotional power of this movie. I think

548
00:41:30.000 --> 00:41:32.239
that's something that comes across in it
because it is a you know, it's

549
00:41:32.239 --> 00:41:37.840
a it's a peaceful kind of tune. Um, it does but exactly what

550
00:41:37.880 --> 00:41:42.000
it's supposed to do. But I
remember watching this when a kid, when

551
00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:44.440
I was a kid, and I
was like that song got me really sad.

552
00:41:45.159 --> 00:41:46.719
Yeah, but an appropriate way,
right, And that's one of the

553
00:41:46.760 --> 00:41:52.400
things that kind of makes this more
of a mature movie. But also I

554
00:41:52.440 --> 00:41:54.280
think something that's you know, for
kids at a certain age, is it

555
00:41:54.360 --> 00:42:00.559
appropriate watch right? I completely agree
because you know a lot of I don't

556
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:02.639
honestly a lot, but some other
movies have done this part so well too,

557
00:42:02.679 --> 00:42:07.360
where they just add a song into
a part where you know it seems

558
00:42:07.400 --> 00:42:10.599
all hope is gone. You know, your your main character is going looking

559
00:42:10.599 --> 00:42:15.719
for another character that you probably is
dead or something bad has happened, and

560
00:42:16.119 --> 00:42:20.920
you just have this song put in
place that just is in the exact perfect

561
00:42:20.920 --> 00:42:23.000
spot, and that is this situation. You have a perfect song, you

562
00:42:23.079 --> 00:42:28.480
have a perfect scene, and the
emotions are already built up, so now

563
00:42:28.480 --> 00:42:31.280
you're getting all this combined together.
Just makes it for a fascinating time yep.

564
00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:37.440
And it's that unmistakable voice of our
darf uncle yep. You know the

565
00:42:37.519 --> 00:42:43.920
seventies and that that time period.
I mean, at this point he has

566
00:42:43.960 --> 00:42:51.519
been such a a powerful presence in
the music world, and it's automatically familiar

567
00:42:51.519 --> 00:42:57.039
and recognizable, but at the same
time it's so ethereal and kind of mysterious.

568
00:42:57.119 --> 00:42:59.719
I think it is a great job. Yeah, I do too,

569
00:43:00.760 --> 00:43:04.639
all right, So let's quote this. The only one I really could find

570
00:43:04.760 --> 00:43:09.199
was from director Martin Rosen himself.
This was on Watership Down. He says,

571
00:43:09.239 --> 00:43:14.800
some people get it and some people
don't. Some people get it very

572
00:43:14.920 --> 00:43:20.480
powerfully. I'm accused of waking people
up at night twenty five years after they

573
00:43:20.480 --> 00:43:23.679
saw it. And it's true,
you know I mentioned earlier. I mean,

574
00:43:23.679 --> 00:43:28.880
this had such a huge impact on
you know, a generation, you

575
00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:30.639
know, and it did for me. You know, you saw it at

576
00:43:30.679 --> 00:43:34.519
a certain age. And I'm telling
you, I'm going to be fifty years

577
00:43:34.559 --> 00:43:37.119
old soon, and I'm telling you
I still remember the day I saw this

578
00:43:37.159 --> 00:43:40.800
movie just like it was yesterday.
That tells you the impact of this film.

579
00:43:42.239 --> 00:43:49.159
Yeah, And I mean you and
I have shared our passion and our

580
00:43:49.440 --> 00:43:54.000
reverence for another animated movie that's considered
a bit traumatizing, Transformers, the movie

581
00:43:53.639 --> 00:43:58.719
Oh Yeah, which I think some
would say you're talking to apples and oranges,

582
00:43:58.960 --> 00:44:04.599
But it's that it's a similar kind
of idea of an animated movie that

583
00:44:04.760 --> 00:44:08.079
hits so powerfully with certain notes,
and it seems like something as a kid

584
00:44:08.119 --> 00:44:13.159
that you're not quite ready for.
But when you experience it, you find

585
00:44:13.199 --> 00:44:15.920
out that you're better for it coming
out on the other side. Yeah,

586
00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:20.760
this is not something where you know, I'm growing up with a phobia of

587
00:44:20.840 --> 00:44:24.599
rabbits. It's not something where it's
you know, scarring me or you know,

588
00:44:27.079 --> 00:44:30.119
anything else like that. It stays
with you, it's impactful, it

589
00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:35.519
makes you sad. But I think
we're better for having access to this story

590
00:44:35.559 --> 00:44:40.760
in another way that we may not
have otherwise discovered and giving it that broader

591
00:44:40.800 --> 00:44:45.320
reach. I think it's something that
makes us accessible to a lot more people.

592
00:44:45.559 --> 00:44:52.320
It's a relatively brief movie that gives
you an overview of the book,

593
00:44:52.679 --> 00:44:54.840
and I think probably interested a lot
of people in getting into the book and

594
00:44:54.920 --> 00:45:00.360
diving into more detail. So anytime
you can have a movie that does any

595
00:45:00.400 --> 00:45:02.960
of those things, I think it's
a it's a win. And it's absolutely

596
00:45:04.599 --> 00:45:07.559
the case for an animated feature that
helps to kind of elevate the perception of

597
00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:14.440
what can be done in illustrated storytelling, not just for kids, but for

598
00:45:14.519 --> 00:45:16.559
audiences of all ages. Yeah.
Absolutely, And you know you hit the

599
00:45:16.639 --> 00:45:20.559
key right there, man um.
You know, as a parent, you

600
00:45:20.559 --> 00:45:22.400
know, if you see this movie
with your kids or you allow them to

601
00:45:22.480 --> 00:45:28.239
watch this movie. Um, definitely
sit down with them, read the book

602
00:45:28.239 --> 00:45:30.920
with them, you know, because
you're going to open up a bigger world,

603
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:34.159
which a book always does, because
come on, you know, we

604
00:45:34.239 --> 00:45:37.239
love movies, we love TV series, but they only have a limited amount

605
00:45:37.239 --> 00:45:40.559
of time to tell the story that
a book can go on and on and

606
00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:46.000
on to explore more for you.
Definitely read this book. Read it with

607
00:45:46.039 --> 00:45:50.920
your kids, let them read it, you know, and get to enjoy

608
00:45:51.199 --> 00:45:55.719
this world that is Watershipped Down.
It has a huge impact. It shows

609
00:45:55.760 --> 00:45:59.039
right now what an impact it has
on Scott and I. You know,

610
00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:01.800
we're talking about it to this day. Yeah, we're specifically doing a podcast

611
00:46:01.920 --> 00:46:07.840
on this movie because what it did
to for us when we first saw this

612
00:46:07.880 --> 00:46:12.199
film. You know, this isn't
your typical animation. It truly pushes the

613
00:46:12.239 --> 00:46:19.559
boundaries and it allows us to look
through the eyes of a rabbit right rights.

614
00:46:19.760 --> 00:46:23.599
It's illustrated storytelling and its finest and
I think a lot of people took

615
00:46:23.639 --> 00:46:30.639
cues from this in animation that we
see today that's able to tell these kind

616
00:46:30.679 --> 00:46:37.280
of stories. I think it's one
that hits right in the middle of right

617
00:46:37.280 --> 00:46:40.639
in the middle of age and what
that can reach. It kind of transcends

618
00:46:42.199 --> 00:46:45.960
being defined by age. Like you
said, for kids, it's a very

619
00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:49.280
mature story that they discover and it
makes it feel like this is something a

620
00:46:49.320 --> 00:46:52.159
little bit more grown up the movie
I wasn't ready for For adults. It's

621
00:46:52.199 --> 00:46:58.599
a still a serious and gripping thriller
that's intricate without being too complex, and

622
00:46:58.880 --> 00:47:05.079
I think the the way that it's
portrayed takes you back to a time when

623
00:47:05.880 --> 00:47:09.599
it kind of lets the adult world
fall away. There's no technology, there's

624
00:47:09.639 --> 00:47:15.119
no cities, there's nothing surrounding that
you're taken into a very simple, yet

625
00:47:15.159 --> 00:47:21.960
focused and relatable story that yeah,
just draws you right in. Yeah,

626
00:47:22.000 --> 00:47:25.079
And like we mentioned earlier, they've
they've done different versions of this in later

627
00:47:25.199 --> 00:47:30.480
years, And I will mention again
the twenty eighteen version that Netflix did.

628
00:47:31.239 --> 00:47:36.079
I really enjoyed it. Definitely check
that out if you get an opportunity.

629
00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:37.760
Scott, I don't know if you've
seen Netflix version. I haven't. I

630
00:47:37.800 --> 00:47:43.639
saw a trailer and I saw that
James McAvoy was associated and a lot of

631
00:47:43.679 --> 00:47:46.519
great voice actors with it, and
I just I'm definitely interesting in catching that.

632
00:47:46.719 --> 00:47:50.199
Yeah, definitely give it a chance. But if you've not seen the

633
00:47:50.199 --> 00:47:53.880
original nineteen seventeight version, please do
yourself a favor go watch this movie.

634
00:47:54.159 --> 00:47:57.639
If you've got young kids, just
as Scott has mentioned, you know,

635
00:47:57.880 --> 00:48:00.039
you know there may be a little
bit young if you want to wait a

636
00:48:00.039 --> 00:48:04.000
little bit, sure, I understand, but definitely give them an opportunity to

637
00:48:04.039 --> 00:48:07.519
watch this to have the experience we
had when we were kids to see this

638
00:48:07.599 --> 00:48:10.719
movie. Scott, where did you
watch this at? So? I caught

639
00:48:10.760 --> 00:48:16.760
it in two different ways. HBO
Max I think currently has it, but

640
00:48:17.000 --> 00:48:21.559
I also found a copy of through
the local library, found it on DVD,

641
00:48:21.760 --> 00:48:24.679
has great features on the side,
and just gives you another way to

642
00:48:24.719 --> 00:48:29.920
absorb it. As Dayton Johnson Document
seventy seven would say, a physical media

643
00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:32.159
is always better. He's right.
There's a lot of advantages to catching it

644
00:48:32.199 --> 00:48:37.440
that way, and it just allows
you to see it wherever you have it,

645
00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:40.599
regardless of what kind of streaming service
that you have. Absolutely, I

646
00:48:40.880 --> 00:48:45.519
saw it on HBO Max as well. I'm glad they have older films like

647
00:48:45.559 --> 00:48:47.679
that popping up on some of the
streaming services to give them an opportunity to

648
00:48:47.719 --> 00:48:51.519
gain a new audience. Yeah.
And the fact, yeah, that you

649
00:48:51.559 --> 00:48:53.320
go to the library to get these
Scott, that's that's a brilliant idea.

650
00:48:53.519 --> 00:48:58.159
Please go use your library, you
know, check out those movies, check

651
00:48:58.159 --> 00:49:00.719
out those books. Gives you an
opportunity to get both of them, you

652
00:49:00.760 --> 00:49:04.079
know, the book and the movie, and you can share that experience with

653
00:49:04.119 --> 00:49:07.400
your family. Yeah, or obviously
you can you can buy this physical media

654
00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:15.760
as well. About make the the
developers very happy, and it's something that

655
00:49:15.800 --> 00:49:17.679
you can actually kind of, you
know, take off the shelf and pass

656
00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:24.280
down from time to time. I
would just recommend just anybody who's kind of

657
00:49:24.320 --> 00:49:30.480
wondering when to see this. Uh. There was a kind of a slip

658
00:49:30.559 --> 00:49:37.119
slip up made when they broadcast this
around Easter. No I remember hearing thinking,

659
00:49:37.159 --> 00:49:39.000
oh, it's a rabbit movie.
Let's show that rabbits. You don't

660
00:49:39.039 --> 00:49:42.719
want to show this at Easter.
This is not a story of the Easter,

661
00:49:42.800 --> 00:49:45.559
buddy. So just you know,
I think you catch the drift from

662
00:49:45.559 --> 00:49:51.079
what a lot of what we discussed. But um, yeah, it's especially

663
00:49:51.280 --> 00:49:53.559
in springtime. I think it's a
great time to watch this movie. Gives

664
00:49:53.559 --> 00:49:58.199
you another appreciation from nature from another
angle. Yeah, that's right. All

665
00:49:58.280 --> 00:50:00.519
right, Well, I want to
thank all of our listeners for tuning in

666
00:50:00.639 --> 00:50:05.840
listening to what we have to say. We've got some other films coming up

667
00:50:05.880 --> 00:50:07.320
that we're going to discuss, and
some guests coming up that are going to

668
00:50:07.400 --> 00:50:12.119
be joining us. But I want
to say, listen, kids, if

669
00:50:12.119 --> 00:50:15.679
you don't do as your parents ask, then general winwork. We'll get you

670
00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:20.800
Scott. What's next for us?
So on the marquee, we've got another

671
00:50:21.079 --> 00:50:24.519
dive into a different kind of animal
world. We're talking about Animal House with

672
00:50:24.840 --> 00:50:30.000
our favorite guests dot com based seventy
seven Zone, Dayton Johnson. Yes.

673
00:50:30.159 --> 00:50:35.679
On the main podcast A Film by, We're gonna hear Jeff dive into jj

674
00:50:35.800 --> 00:50:39.320
Abrams Super eight. Such a great
movie. I cannot wait to hear what

675
00:50:39.360 --> 00:50:43.679
they have to say about that movie. Yep. All right, folks.

676
00:50:43.719 --> 00:50:45.559
So if you want to leave a
comment, discuss what's next, or even

677
00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:51.519
half suggestions, you can find us
at www dot a film by podcast dot

678
00:50:51.519 --> 00:50:55.280
com, A film by podcast at
gmail dot com, a film by podcast

679
00:50:55.320 --> 00:51:00.719
on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram.
Until our film real start rolling again,

680
00:51:01.119 --> 00:51:05.920
go out watch something new, watch
something different, and who knows what you

681
00:51:05.960 --> 00:51:08.320
will discover next. Thanks everyone,
Thanks, have a good win